Those are the cornerstones of all those character’s games…
you shouldn’t jump at Sim. Once you are on top of him, guess what? You can beast him until he finally escapes. He is designed to hit people from across the screen and attempt to zone perfectly.
if shoryukens don’t hit anything, the guy goes flying up into the air and you can punish with whatever you want. Even if he does touch you, if he FADCs to make it safe, he just spent half his super meter for that luxury.
he was FADCing and tick throwing as well, plus he eventually lost. He boiled his strategy down to two moves which as it turns out are fundamental to SF… the dragon punch and throws. A 50/50 mixup like that can be quite effective.
there are character-specific gaps in the tiger knee lockdown that you can escape through
Dan has a DP and is bottom tier, Ken has a DP and is low tier, Cammy has a DP and is bottom tier, etc. DP are as a rule massively disadvantaged on block unless you blow two EX stocks to cancel them. If they miss entirely, you can not only punish with whatever you want but you have some time to decide what exactly you will do. They are good moves but not all you need to win.
If Guile’s sonic boom was like even Ryu’s hadouken, he’d be even shittier than he already is. There are also ways around sonic booms that do not involve jumping onto his crouching fierce.
LK Scissors is safe… that is the point of that move. To apply pressure. It can be stuffed by a well timed jab. You can focus and backdash it.
Crouching mk is good but it is a low attack that Vega has ways of avoiding.
You want Vega to be E-Z Mode apparently. Newsflash buddy, Vega has some sick moves.
Standing roundhouse - incredible move. Breaks focus, is incredibly fast, decent anti-air, hits hard, does a lot of stun, combos off of basically everything.
Crouching mk - not quite as good as Ryu’s but still awesome
Crouching mp - deadly poke
Standing mk - just as good as M. Bison’s
Crouching rh - sliding sweeps are very valuable if you learn how to space them. Safe on block, tough to guard on reaction, goes under high tiger shot
Standing close and far lk - awesome tick setups
Jump up roundhouse - also incredibly fast, hits everything
Jump back/forward fierce - instant overhead on some characters, does a lot of damage and stun, stuffs a lot of normal anti-airs but not shoryukens but why are you jumping in on someone with a shoryu?
Even his specials are good
Scarlet terror - very powerful combo ender. Shit reversal.
Sky high claw - punishes fireballs hard
Flying barcelona - awesome mix up opportunities, decent damage especially if you can izuna drop someone on the ground
His super and ultra aren’t great.
Then he has other things in his favor - good throw range, good throw power. He has to be one of the most mobile characters in all of SF, giving him a nasty tick throw game, etc.
Characters are not determined good or bad based solely on their specials or if they have any abusable moves…
TL;DR Vega is not a shoto and will never play like one. His game is focused on his normals, not his specials
ok i had to respond because u really just flipped around what i said. I said it would be nice if they sped up vegas Hp rcf to the speed of his lp version.
then u replied saying that it would make him so much better and it seemed like u were saying he would become unfair.
Then i replied saying, no, it wouldnt b/c everyone else has sooooo many things vega doesnt. I know he is no shoto, but y no invincibility on his ST? it’s pretty much the same as guiles flash kick. Y does his claw go right through ppl and do no damage? y does his overhead not have overhead properties? Y does gen get the exact same roll, except at an easily comboable speed? these things rnt game changing or revolutionary, they just make sense. Vega is a ninja, he shouldn’t have any slow rolling moves. Y give these thigns to everyone else and not to vega? it just keeps him at the bottom. does a Dragon punch really need to have invincibility frames, beat out pretty much everything, do good damage, and be cancelable?
I never said he should play like a shoto, i never said DPs should do no dmg. I said that there r a number of moves that everyone has that can be abused do to their power, speed or invincibility. Vega does not have anything like this yet almost everyone else has at least one. So speeding up his HP rcf would not make him unfair or be anything absurd.
They gave some characters advantages and gave none to others. yeah there r bottom tier’s with strong moves, but THAT IS WHAT IM SAYING! giving vega this one boost will not make him TOP tier. so y r u so against it? lol
EDIT: If u were being sarcastic or misread what u said before then my bad. I was replying to jozhear when he said gen has a fast roll and its mediocre.
I felt like typing a lot of unrelated stuff I guess :lol:
Rolling Crystal Flash has to be super slow otherwise you can start doing c.mp xx fierce rcf block strings all day. Vega would have a really easy time pushing people back into the corners then since that move travels a long way, does a lot of chip damage, and then he can lock some one down since he can run a pretty sick corner trap due to the aforementioned normals.
I get the impression that RCF wasn’t supposed to part of Vega’s B&B combo the same way EX barcelona is. That is one thing I personally think could get a damage boost - the actual wall dive part of barcelona that hits them up into the air should do a bit more damage.
The other thing that needs some love is EX scarlet terror. That move is a nice surprise once and awhile and it hits hard but it just isn’t reliable. A few more invincibility frames would be a nice buff.
I guess I’m trying to say that RCF won’t be his abusable move and I don’t think it warrants a big buff… that’s not the role Capcom wants it to play in his game. I think Capcom sees Vega as more of a runaway-style zoning character than anything else, by giving him a good set of pokes, a lot of mobility, and not many powerful combos.
lol. I agree with what ur saying. but already doing cr.mp xx lp rcf isnt some great lock down move. It does corner some people, but going from the last hit to the cr.mp is already coutnerable. And so what if it could push them in the corner, gouken, sagat and a few other ppl have moves that throw ppl right into the corner and knock them down. I didnt mean that vega needs this buff, i was replying to someone else because they mentioned “what if” about HP rcf.
BTW, i asked in the Q&A thread, but it couldnt hurt to ask here too. Can u Iz-Drop ppl out of their wakeup shoryukens? Not IF u land behind them. I mean can the grab, grab them before the shoryuken comes out? Any vids of it maybe?
Very decent Vega, but made quite a few fundamental mistakes, like constantly jumping at Seth, focusing so much against Balrog, and forgetting that nobody should be afraid to meaty Vega, ever. I think he started the rounds with EX Barcelona a lot too.
GEXP (Abel) vs Reiketsu (Claw): [media=youtube]0h2EEqDV3II[/media]
Reiketsu (Claw) vs Akimo (Honda): [media=youtube]Lmtinjly4Rw[/media]
Some interesting tactics in both videos. Reiketsu always does a great job of demonstrating what to do and then what not to do within the same match. He also manages to land Vega’s super during a high-level Japanese tournament. :looney:
