How do you guys deal with tiger shot spam?
In alot of situations I feel that Makotos forward dash goes too far, and this is one of them. Focus absorb -> forward dash makes you dash into the next tiger shot without any chance of blocking. That leaves you only with the option of jumping over them when you need to advance, which is a horrible option to be honest =/
I have yet to face a Sagat with Mak. Can she dash under high shots? If so, maybe dash under highs and IA Tsurugi over lows?
can you guys give me advice on this video i recorded? any tips that i should know and practice?
[media=youtube]533Cf8dqTAo[/media]
This should be in the video critique thread, but I’ll give it a go anyway.
You jumped in a lot, but he didn’t AA you for it, so play on. Just note that, against a more solid Ryu, you’re going to eat some SRK for that.
If I was playing against a fireball happy Ryu, and I had U2 selected, I’d just sit back and absorb some fireballs. After absorbing 2 or 3, I would IA Tsurugi over them. When my health refilled, absorb a few more. You’ll just about keep up with him in meter gain, and you’ll build up U2, which will shut his fireballs down. This will keep you from having to jump in on him and make him bring the fight to you… or stall out til the timer runs. 
Also, did you guys realize the wiki says EX tsurugi is projectile invincible on start up? That should be pretty useful. 
If fireballers want to keep us out, IA Tsurugi over FBs from full screen, stock up a few EX Tsurugis, and go let em have it, right? I could be late on this one…
Yeah. It was found earlier, then confirmed through the hit box data. And gilley may have even translated the japanese guide for that item by now for the srk wiki.
EX tsurigi feels more like a gouki/gouken angled projectile killer.
No, she can’t dash under high Tiger Shots. That was the very first thing I tried when I started Makoto only to be left all sadfaced.
I’ll definitely have to use it more. I usually save my meter for EX Oroshis… I whore that shit out way too much…
Now I’m all sad faced, too… 
It would have made that match up a lot more bearable…
Ugh this is exactly what I meant when I mentioned that my matches are increasingly being decided by time-out decisions. I get Ultra 2 ready and Ryu/Ken/Sagat stops throwing FBs. Then the whole match becomes a footsie war, or a “chase Ryu around the map without jumping because you’ll eat DP–>Ultra.” Yeah. not fun.
Makoto’s FA2 comes out really fast. 11 frames, I think there isn’t one in the game thats faster (even though a bunch of characters share the 11 frame FA2, like Gouken)
Is there any characters jumpin(sans two hitting jump in like Chuns TC) that Makoto’s Focus Attack won’t punish before they get out a 3-framer? I’ve been trying this against a Ryu target dummy jumping in and spamming cr. lp. If I didn’t fumble and botch the timing like an idiot, it caught him everytime. But I’m less confident in how well I set up my dummy. Has anyone else done testing like this?
If people are playing footsies are being very cautious cause you’re sitting on Ultra, U2 them on a with footsie. Or literally start getting in their face and throwing out some throws/Karakusas. At some point they’ll either get pissed or want to actually try to regain the health lead…oh yea U2 is there.
People playing footsies/defensive against Makoto is a good thing IMO. Especially against shotos/fireball characters. A lot easier to get in and 1 less thing to worry about stopping you to get in their face. Of course this doesn’t really work when it comes to charge characters.
Can U2 punish a shoto cr.mk? Because ultimately that’s what it boils down too in their footsies. I dont think U2 is fast enough and I sure as hell don’t wanna risk being “psychic” with it.
Sounds like your game is U2 reliant with that comment. Honestly, the fear it puts in shotos just makes your game that much easier. Nothing changes except that you can get in quicker and without chip or focus damage.
Hmmm? Not sure what you mean. The “fear” of U2 is what is making them run away and causing me to chase them in the first place. The problem is I still have to be very selective with my offense when approaching them or engaing in footsies. Shotos still have excellent footsies even without relying on thier fireball. The thing is if they are determined to run away the whole match, then I feel like there’s very little I can do–that’s why I mentioned that I’m increasingly having matches that run the full 99 seconds. Yes its good to shut down their FB game, but what I’d like to know is what Mak can do against their normals in footsies, or what Mak can do if they happen to have a health lead and just run away.
That’s always an issue. For me the almighty knockdown becomes my only goal with max range ex Oroshi, uppercut baiting and punish, and the mid block string FAD > Karakusa if you’re seeing them fall back on cr MK > fireball to end block string in desperation from the chase. Whenever they choose to run it always ends with their back to the wall. Once there controlling that distance to make them desperate is all you need. I know the frustration you mean though. I have to stop myself sometimes and remember to avoid jumping in.
sounds like you may need to find that “normal” to beat Shoto cr.MK or do more FAing. I’d assume s.HK would but i’m just assuming seeing how active that normal is. I’ll fool around with it though.
Focus attacking is probably your best option overall with shoto footsies.
I’m by no means a master Makoto player, but what I do when I attempt to break someone’s defense are a variety of these things.
If they let you jump in, you can do these things. I don’t try to cross people up with makoto, her j. mk hitbox is sadly aweful and only let’s you cross up very wide characters like Hakan, Gouken, etc.
[LIST]
[]J. mk ticked into backthrow
[]Jump-in into Cr. lp xx st. lp > cr. lk xx lp hayate. The damage isn’t great but you can hit confirm it before you commit to doing the cr. lk xx hayate part. The link is two frames if you go from st. lp. One frame from cr. lp (hence the standing jab). If he just blocks it you can block string out by cancelling the st. lp to cr. lp. If you have super and ultra, you cancel the hayate into super then go into ultra, but the scaling isn’t the best.
[*]Empty cross up jump to throw (which usually just gets teched, I should probably stop doing this. But I’m too damned addicted to crossups after playing Abel for the last months :o )
[/LIST]
If you don’t get to jump in, then your options are obviously more limited. Things that I aim for are.
[LIST]
[]Cr. mp xx mp hayate FADC karakusa (light or ex) is something I try to fish with. Some people jump out of it but mostly people just mash jabs. Hence the ex.
[]Try to get into close range footsies (jab distance) and pop out your ex oroshi.
[*]Fish for Cr. Hp at the appropriate range. If it connects I get to do the godlike meaty mp oroshi combo that I’ve been training all day 
If you don’t know it. After a successful sweep, you buffer the forward dash during the last frames of recovery of the sweep so that it comes out immediately. Likewise during the last frames of the dash your buffer the mp Oroshi so it comes out asap when the recovery is done. If done correctly, you should get a frame perfect Oroshi meaty that gives enough frame advantage to do what heck you want with (st mp, cr hp, U1!). Some characters rise later than others and it can whiff, but they are few and far between. Let them know you can do this and you’ll easily bait DPs on wakeup.
[/LIST]
I have no idea if these options are even good, but it what’s I’ve been doing and I’m doing well against scrubs at least lol.
I suck at using IA Tsurigi, I just get karakusa instead =( But that is probably a good option for some situation, which those are I’m not so certain. Everytime I use it feels like the range and hitbox is off.
He FA2 is among the fastest in the game, comes out in 11 frames and the range is okish. So that can lead to very nice things.
(/braindump)
oroshi is so slow that anyone with half a brain should be able to just block it high or backdash outta there. do that setup more than once and even scrubs should be able to get out for free.
If they block it you still have a huge frame advantage and this simply leads to more setups. If they backdash they get out for free but probably won’t be able to punish you. Once you’ve conditioned them to backbash, instead of oroshi dash forward and karakusa them out of their recovery frames into anything. Just watch out for reversals.
yeah, but the thing is that because it’s so slow they can backdash on reaction to the oroshi, instead of needing to do it preemptively. if they see you dash forward instead they can jab you out or neutral jump or whatever. zangief can condition people to do X, Y or Z because his stuff is too fast to react to; makoto, at least in this case, not so much.
Unfortunately, a blocked meaty mp oroshi can have only +0 frame advantage at best.