M.bison USF4 , any Rumors of buff/nerf changes?

Test EX Psycho throwable during the first active frame or if they reverted the damage. Easy setup: Use Akuma’s Ultra during Bison’s wakeup.
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Here your answer , look in 11:35 on the video https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cfNq0Lk49yA&list=FLjORrVB5ACJFgNBpeIJHveg i Hope Capcom correct this :confused:

Every time I see Bison lose to Ibuki, I die a little inside. Even I’m free to good ones cause there’s hardly any good ones online. They’re more rare than a good XBL Ken. The one at my local refuses to play me because “Fuck Bison”.

Now why can he be thrown? >.> Tbh with DWU, I never found any real use for his teleport on wakeup. The only character I was scared of (which he never did), was Akuma. Free Demon. Cammy also but I faced only one and it was a mirror. Of course others can punish it too, but you know it’s mostly the rushdown/vortex characters that are fishing for it.

This is a record from USF4 Arcade. It’s outdated, so I don’t have my answer yet.

Outdated 04/05/2014 ! ok

The arcade version is not updated daily.

Teleport is too easy to punish on wake up but I virtually never get punished when they are using a block string with gaps or a tick throw mid screen. I agree it should be noticeably worse than Sim’s but there is no excuse for a walking Swiss Army knife like Akuma.

As far as EX Psycho Crusher getting grabbed, yeah it’s random but it makes me appreciate EX Scissors FADC a lot more. I see the direction of nerfs to crusher and buffs to Scissors is to make Scissors a more attractive option and I welcome it if the changes to Scissors make Bison better overall.

On a somewhat related note I was over the moon when I heard about the buff to EX Scissors projectile invincibility.

Ok guys I will make a list.

With respect to the teleport issue. Look at YouTube for the video with the following title. Will post link later. On my phone right now.

"Usf4 m .bison back teleport vs. forward teleport recovery test."
Here it is

I really don’t see this teleport nerd though being fair. Why should Akuma be a Swiss Army knife?

Cause every game needs that retard boss character, and Bison hasn’t made the cut since Final Bison in Alpha 3. Kinda fitting it has the word “Final”.

Hahaha, yeah it was the last time Bison was a badass. But what about SFex? Bison was pretty bad ass in that one?

In any case, what else should I test this weekend?

What heck? We can have gifs in our sigs?

Arika developed it so it doesn’t count.

It does count cause that game as fun as hell!!

It was fun, but it wasn’t Capcom. So they gave up on him.

I suppose there’s no way to test if they normalised the tech window on Bison’s throw?

Ok guys, so got back from ECT.

Unfortunately, given the setup I was not able to test things in a systematic way as I wanted, due tot he fact that the defacto rule was first to three wins has to give it up for the next contestant, and there was always a line at every console.

However, I tried to keep everyone in mind and focus on the changes. Here is what I noticed and anyone can ask questions.

Overall, I have to say that Bison is, in my opinion, ALOT better off. This is the best version of Bison in my book. So let me go down the list.

AA; the C.fierce is DAMN good. It may trade in some instances, but the thing is so fast I was whiffing on Cammy Cannot spikes. Trust me when I say, gone are the days of people abusing us from the air, neutral jumping, and jumping in for free. It really comes out fast. I knocked Cammy right out of the air, which btw is a totally fair matchup now!!

S.MP; again VERY good. c.mp to s.mp is so easy, and there are really allot of possibilities for this move. It is great after an SK to snuff or which punish stuff for big damage. And it DOES work in certain instances as an AA. It really works!

I think I could tell the SK nerf was there, but honestly it isn’t that game breaking. I was still able to do c.lk follow up and with the s.mp there are many other opinions. The SK does seem to have double the chip!! This is a big deal because you don’t want to see there and take the pressure, and you KNOW you can’t jump for free anymore.

The hell attack into crusher is nice too. I didn’t see it hitting twice though in the juggle, so idk what’s going on there.

Crossup PC seems more safe, but I did get punished a few times, I think even with a demon. But it is hard to say if I just miss timed the PC or not. I do know against this Cammy player he was mashing the cannon spike and I kept beating him out on wakeup after a lk sk knockdown.

the head stomp being faster even if it only two frames does help though. It is less likely to be back dashed now! This is good. It beats out more in the air from what I could see due to the speed increase.

Double ultra was w/e, I didn’t even bother to use it. I used U1 the whole time.

Red focus was good. I didn’t really mess with it, but SAW the potential. Trust, this is Bison’s way to Ultra not counting random hell attack opportunities.

EX devil reverse is a REALLY good move for punishing certain things. That thing falls FAST. He drops like a stone and can really punish whiffed moves with high recovery. Any of those past instances where you fake a stomp but just don’t have the speed to punish, or the damage for that matter, now you do. Its decent, seriously.

I really felt that there was better damage output and didn’t feel like I was struggling like I am in AE for scraps.

I talked to Combofiend about Bison. I told him overall I was happy with the changes, but mentioned the skull diver. he said “its a great move.” He mentioned the bit about wiggling and all that, which I told him at high level it could be punished and was basically worthless. His response was simply not to use it that often and use it as a sneak attack. I told him that if your conditioned to beat it you could never use it unless that person simply slipped up, but that doesn’t make it a good move.

His attitude was that he wasn’t going to address it. He also said that at this point they are taking more feedback from the Japanese players. I was kind of disappointed about that because skull diver is the one move I really wanted fixed.

We should petition Combofiend here on SRK to sneak in that change before it becomes final.

In any event,

the game felt really slow, like you were moving through cement. I wasn’t the only one who felt this. EVERYONE else said the same thing. We told Comofiend and he said that one of the prior builds it felt to fast, but not the worry because the final build will be good.

That’s all I can remember now. Any questions?

Wow, that’s a lot of info. Thanks exogen.

I have one question: is hell attack into PC damage worth the loss in positioning? Is there a way to avoid switching sides, like using a light PC? If so, does it do less damage than using a hard PC?

It’s a good question. I don’t know if light PC can connect, because I did not test that. I actually thought of it when I was away from the tournament, and forgot when I was there lol.

However, the damage is very good with the HP PC. My thought process is that if you have the option use it because your will gain a good chunk, so its worth more to me than positioning. However, maybe some cases might be different, so I suspect it will be situation dependent, but that is only because there is reason to say the damage is worth it.

Btw Bison is now godlike if he get’s you in the corner. Where are you going to jump to? It felt so good to know I could beat jumps clean or at least get a trade depending. Trust me that arm comes out so fast. you’ll see.

Another thing I talked to Combofiend about was the mechanic change and the aim of Ultra and bison.

He said the aim was to make a game where it does not focus on getting the knockdown to vortex, and to make one that was more about the fundamentals that have been in SF games since the beginning of the series. I have to agree with him. Vortex is a relatively new thing and I personally hate it, being a Bison player.

He said with respect to Bison they wanted to address the concerns we had, and also make him less “brain dead” and less reliant on kicks. The -1 nerf was partially to try and shift his style to other damage options and to come up with more ways to do damage is what he said. By giving him other things, he becomes more versatile.

I’m happy delayed wake up turned out to be the way it has unfolded so far, the technical message really helps confirm what Bison has to do after a throw.

With Exogen’s encouraging post, especially in concerns with anti air this character is going to be more fun to use.

Thanks a lot for all of these info Exogen. It is really good to now that Bison become stronger. He deserve it as a Boss :slight_smile:

From what I’ve seen, Hell attack connect with the first hit of PC. So you do more damage by using HP version.

Anyway Capcom should fix EX SK to make it hit twice after Hell attack. It’s only character specific in AE but it should work against everyone due to the move properties

Yeah, the EX SK is another thing I didn’t really test. I did see it hit twice, but I don’t remember who.

The EX SK is really good for going through projectiles. It is a lot easier to use it now for that purpose.

Oh EX PC can still be thrown. I know for for sure because I got thrown by Justin Wong who was using Elena lol.

Oh as a side note about DWU. Combofiend said that people in Japan are saying that Daigo is unbeatable now because of the elimination of vortex due to DWU. They say that it is because you actually have to play against Daigo on HIS terms now.

I think that this is great for Bison as a character as well being so footsie heavy.

It was funny. I played against this Akuma was had beat a team member of mine in the tournament. HE didn’t seem to know about cross up HP making the DP whiff after throw. He NEEDED to use DWU. But I think that the worst that will happen is that Bison will just land and have to do a meaty or wait. But its not like he doesn’t have the tools to pressure in close now and resist the air abuse. Seriously guys, the air abuse is no more. Between all Bison’s AA tools now, there is something to stop people from jumping. It was amazing to watch people get hit by the AA including Cammy cannon spikes, and then watch the squirm because they didn’t know what else to do lol!!! I really enjoyed it. I saw Geifs trying to jump in and get murdered, especially cause Gief’s forward j.hp is ass now lol.

I really think that once we master the new Bison he is going to be much much better than the other Bisons, even Super.

I really see what Combofiend was saying about Bison with the -1 nerf. With the added chip it makes Bison quality over quantity.

Oh, the teleport, I almost forgot.

Yeah, its recover is pretty bad. Basically though, with the AA, your uses on it are going to be very character and situation specific. It still works though for getting away from cross ups!!! So again, Bison has a tool to escape air abuse!!

Oh and some punishes are still intact. For example. I was playing evil Ryu. I baited the DP using teleport like always. He did a HP DP. I was able to teleport back and punish with c.mp into SK like always!!! Trust it still works. It is just risky now so use it sparingly. If your concerned about the teleport, again, I stress the AA. I can see why they nerfed it.

hmm, there was something else I remembered but it has slipped away. I will post any more information as it comes back to me, it was a long weekend.