Anak is great, he just takes a lot of work. Same for Dhalsim, in a way. Neither can take a hit very well at all. But if you use all of their tools well, they can do some impressive things.
Agreed totally… imo of all the top tier (cables, mags, storms, sent, blackhearts, spirals etc…) doom has to be the cleanest to be effect against decent players.
I think hes better all around but I think a lot of low tier can compete with him but then again it depends on the assists that back him up.
anakaris max SJ height coffin abuse is above the reach of 90% of low tier characters. He can chill up there for a few reps before he has to come back down and only then can you truly hit him clean. He has an air dash to control his descent spot and his normals have outstanding priority on them.
I know most people rush down with anakaris but he can also be used to run the fuck away vs characters who can’t reach his max sj height spot. If you think about why dhalsim should be banned, because he can run away forever vs low tiers, anakaris is pushing that same limit all though he has to come back down eventually.
doom beats the fuck out of low tiers. They can’t compete with his space controlling and run away capabilities. This has already been established though through years of the old low tier system that was ran @ evo. They had some ratio system in which doom\bh\cyke were playable but as ratio 2’s, all everyone did was make teams around the good ratio 2’s and watch them go to work. Doom’s run away when you don’t have mando and your character can’t reach the top of the screen is brutal. He’s up there to fucking long and your character better have some mobility options to deal with jupbck+fp and photons from the ground or air.
i think you and others are just thinking he’s viable because you play against higher tier teams with low tier.
if you are going to do any sort of low tier game setup, he needs to be banned. of course some characters can maybe get through some of his stuff, but he has all the tools to keep so much low tier out and not do anything.
the shit he puts on the screen can really fuck some up, where sometimes you would prefer fighting mags instead.
either way, what shoult said…yeah doom belongs no where in true low tier. he’s in the high tier list for that very reason.
that’s really much of example.
either way, I know exactly. that’s what gabe does, and that’s what I do. but I have never seen it to be abusable when either of us did it. we could stay up there for maybe a couple reps, but there was always something to stop us. it’s not infinite runaway like dhalsim…I mean, can you almost say it’s like stalling with gambit or ken or someone else who “floats” at the top?
and again, I don’t think that’s anymore of a problem then some buff BBH, MM, OMega teams shit for some of the cast.
I do agree that Doom is one of the best of the non-god-tier. He’s probably the best actual point character out of all the ones known largely for providing a great assist. Sure beat Psylocke, easily; better than Commando, Tron or BH also with a lot less work involved.
Maybe that’s where my side of the argument is coming from… to me, there is the Big 4 and then there is everybody else. There are some damn good “everybody else” characters like Cyke and Doom. There are some that require different gameplans to fight, like Spiral or BH. But they’re still “everybody else” at the end of the day.
I’m not a fan of banning much of anything. If you’re doing a low tier league and you leave out the Big 4, that’s adjustment enough IMO. A ‘ratio’ system is already pushing it…
Wtf are you guys talking about? Anakaris can stay out the top of the screen all day if he wants. Especially if he gets hit with something like Cable Scimitar assist. Just let a few pixels of feet chil on the screen while spamming coffins, curses, and snakes, oh my.
that’s not what we’re talking about, though I addressed it. we’re talking about max SJ height and if it’s really as unstoppable as shoult says it is.
i agree I hate ratios…but you need to take out the likes of doom/bh/spiral/strider for a low tier league. they are specifically in the high tier mark.
the only reason they aren’t god tier is because the GODs were able to counter them and their screen control, which the low tier cannot do.
you’re interested in more non godtier play. that’s cool. I think it’s a little silly since you still leave in high tier
shoult and I and others are interested in low tier, which excludes the god tier and the high tier that apparently a lot of have been blinded from how bad they beast low tier (probably because they don’t really used true low tier anyway)
Maybe… but my counter argument would be, how much are you trying to water down “low tier” Marvel? And is it still Marvel?
And where do you cut it off?
Do we exclude glitched Jugg because it hurts? Do we get rid of Ken because of glitched air hurricane kick? Maybe we should get rid of that pesky Tron-y, too…
This is coming from someone who is used to fighting whoever, no questions asked. So maybe I’m just basically in the wrong thread arguing the wrong argument. If a low-tier league gets started and people are happy, that would be what matters - whether I individually and personally agreed with it or not. At least nobody would be being asked to do roadtime for it…
but that’s just it. you don’t really have a counter argument imo.
the god tier and high tier are there for a reason and are pretty straightforward, unlike the low tier. exluding them is obvious imo and it’s still very much marvel. may as well keep in god tier though, because it’s not really marvel without them eh?
mentioning juggs/ken/tron really isn’t an argument 
. we’re talking about someone who totally controls the screen against much of the low tier cast. not some high damage attack lol. of which there are many more high damage things. at least we’re up close and personal too, which doom/sprial/strider/bh totally doesn’t allow.
honestly I’m not sure what you’re arguing. seeing as how you said you’re against ratio systems…but you want to keep everyone in aside from god tiers? clockwork…bh teams…doom teams etc. and you want to call that low tier? eh, no.
seems you just like playing a team that has no god tiers, play it agaisnt all tier teams, but consider it low tier…so would like a system that would allow them but call it low tier when it isn’t. it’s pretty similar to people playing rog/storm/tron or low tier/god tier/whatever and calling it low tier. nuh uh sir.
also, the point that shoult etc. are making for low tier is to allow characters that would get shut down by the likes of doom a chance. in a system that still allows all the high tier (the new god tier) that would not happen
You kind of make my argument for me - it just doesn’t appear to relate to what you guys are trying to do. So I’m going to let it go.
When you take away god tier, top tier becomes best. When you take away top tier… it would be interesting to see who comes up as best. And if that’s the purpose of a low tier league, that would be an admirable goal.
But you still end up with that new ‘best’. And you can take it down as far as you want. You can have Marvel with 5 characters and Zangief and Hayato being the best things going. Not sure what the point would be, or how I would feel about the wins.
God tier is pretty well established, difficult to fight and we all know why. Everything else that has been mentioned about top tier is just irritating to fight and not really what I think of as ban-worthy. Random teams that happen to have BH or Spiral on them are not top-tier teams. nuh uh sir.
I feel like pretending 20% of the cast doesn’t exist is just a bit much - unless you just want to see if you get some low-tier discoveries out of it. But to each their own. Like I say, I will let it go with this.
snip
dope ima try these out. Ima try to master low teir cuz honestly top tier gets boring some times. dont want to this game to die so L. Tier is where its at. gotta use those 56 characters!
upload more dliner joe matches please! dlj, use ur ICEMAN! UGGHH
we already know what spiral and BH can do. For god sakes, spiral won EVO twice. Give spiral some low tier tools that are actually very good like gambit card, ruby spike, or bbhood projectile, and she’s wrecking shop with a solid AA vs other low tiers. You need mobility to get around her and speaking from a low tier perspective, 90% of them don’t have the mobility to compete. Fuck, mag\storm just have BARELY enough mobility to actually stop her. Thats just pure mobility, we’re not even talking about landing a hit yet which is another goal. If thats not good enough, spiral\BH have been played to death already.
IMO, the point of a low tier league is to let the next batch of characters step up and see what else is possible in marvel. Why let BH\spiral get MORE play when other GOD like characters like m.bison, morrigan, chun li virutally go untouched? By letting BH\spiral in, the amount of low tier characters that can compete become EXTREMELY limited. By taking them out, you virtually can play the entire cast thats left after the ban list. It allows for more creativity which I find to be best thing about low tier. This game has an extreme amount of possibilities and we’ll never see them all if we allow characters who are already known to be good.
its pretty easy like beats said, ban the god op tiers and thats it. Thats where you end the list because the top 11 characters have been played hardcore for 10 years with the exception of dhalsim. He’s gotten play since the beginning but I don’t think anyone really knew his potential till magnetro did that tut. There are other things that matter like potentially banning tron Y and mando AA but thats just finite tuning. Of course, other power houses will rise to the top but the goal is make sure that the max amount of low tier characters become playable in a low tier league.
Like I said… if that’s the goal, then that’s fine.
I’ve been playing low tier for a long time now and it’s way more fun learning how to break top tier teams down with the low tier characters. Always being at a disadvantage is a lot more fun than depending on some top tier priority to get a fast easy win. Like ironman infinite, fast fly with commando etc… Low tier makes you think a lot more and test your basic fundamentals of marvel and see how you play when you’re at a disadvantage. When I play people with low tier online I can see a lot of them don’t understand the basics. That the other characters can win against the top tier characters in the hands of a good player.
demon hyo be wrecking shop with his anti msp and general low tier teams! ugh!
though when he plays cyc…he really shows that some real low tier characters can’t do much against a total runaway/keepaway cyc :[ but his teams are good for fighting higher tier teams if you’re smart enough.
D.Hyo’s low tier is ragequit inducing.
Amen to that brother! I picked up BH years ago cuz people were starting to say he was obsolete and I liked the way he could actually win by out thinking the god tier and making them fall for traps. Now I play Dan teams for the same reason!
I’ve noticed that the people that excel with low tier understand the deeper components of playing this game. Everyone thinks about painful combos and DHCs. Few of the new breed really understand the concepts of patience, zoning. Virtually none even think about other things like baiting punishable actions and assist punishing.
Hehe… Thanks for the props, Beats. It’s true I mainly use those low tiers to fight top tiers. But when I see someone with Tron and they say they wanna do a low tier battle… it’s still just depending on tron in the end and that’s not true low tier. I’ll gladly do play people with straight low tier vs low tier. I don’t think cyc is fair against low tiers as long as the other person has a true low tier team.
Sakura!!
P.S. Beats, your anakaris and son son are mad solid/slick. Love fighting them. Minus tron though :[