wow… thanks alot for sharing your knowledge. So I have a question why is P Zantetsu banned, and what makes him so good? Just want to know, him being the coolest looking character and all.
One reason:
:r::l::r::snkc: > :qcb::snka: > (Follow-up) (Jump) :qcf::qcf::snka: (x2)
Instant full-screen knockdown that’s almost 100% safe, crosses up ambiguosly even if they’re in the air, plus the follow-up you get like 80% meter back.
He’s not always banned. Like I said, the community’s too small and unorganized for there to be much consensus about anything, but most people tend to stay away from him, because he makes the game retarded with that one move.
I just could check your guide today. Thanks a lot, dude.
Kyokuji, do you know where to find any more Hibiki vids? Only 2 on your youtube list. When get an at home internet connection i’d love to try out my new Hibiki, with whom ive been practicin alot since losing access, against you. Hopefully ill win a few this time. :lol:
Have any links to a In-Depth Setsuna FAQ. I’ve picked him, and Power Lee up.
G.O.T., it’s not a big deal but how is the quote relevant to your post? LOL
:wasted: just wanted to get his attention. thats all there were other ways but im lazy
Best advice and stuff I can give you would be the following:
A: His anti-air. It’s fast, hits pretty high, and fast recovery, nuff said. If you’re quick enough, standing A can link to qcb+B I believe. His jumping A is nice since it hits pretty low and many people have a hard time AAing it.
B: 2-hits, but obviously not the spam. best if a jump in hits. His f+B covers distance, but at the same time it is freakin’ obvious to see a mile away. Jumping B is nice as it does 2-Hits as well as allow cross-ups to occur. d+B is 2-hits as well.
C: His f+C and sweep are mad long. Standing C is slower than most characters.
qcf+A/B: A version is pretty useless. Sure, it’s fast, but what kind of player is gonna throw it out? Unless you linked a B, in which case I’d rather just do the super then and there since the A version might push him farther than the last hit of his super. B version is nice after a D since you can super cancel it into the super or hit him with his DP A, or in the corner you can do the AA throw.
qcb+B: combo finisher of choice. Don’t throw it out randomly as you will get screwed.
DP A/B: A version is one hit, B version is 2-hits. A is fast, B is slow with more range. Not really an AA since A takes care of the job. DP+B is pretty damaging as a combo ender, but only out of B or d+B.
DP C: The anti air throw. Again, very little practicality unless you’re in the corner.
HCB…fogot button, been a while: Setsuna gets a one hit invincibility. This is pretty much the money right here. With this mode on, you can get free combos at times since he is uninterrupted after 1 hit. I’m not saying you should try to plow through the guy since people can still interrupt with A,A. Best used after a knockdown. He also gets the move HCF+C which has extremely limited range, but does nice damage and stuns the guy for follow-ups. If it’s blocked, you are screwed.
Throw: Picks him up and slams him to his feet with no position change. Pretty bad throw imo since he doesn’t get a nice time to get d/f+B on the guy. Damage is damage though.
qcf, qcf, A+B: strong, damaging, can link with stuff after the animation if in the corner. It looks like a good AA move, but frankly, I wouldn’t wanna waste meter since it can whiff. Standard super.
hcb, hcb+B: lightning surrounds him, hitting the opponent for damage and like his invincibility move, he gets I believe 5 free hits before going out of it. He also can do hcf+C a few more times as a chain, but chances are that ain’t happenin. He also has the desperation of hcf,hcf+A+B (not 100% sure on command) which is a throw, but has a pretty slow animation. Desperation super.
You can find his SPEED custom combo links on GAMEFAQS I believe.
In terms of mode to use, he can pretty much be used in whatever although I see POWER a lot because he can be played pretty solid like that. He gets a lot of damage out of his basic combos and supers. He doesn’t really have a reliable link to his SPEED combo like Hibiki or Kaede, so there’s almost no reason to not opt for his desperation super.
I am by no means a Setsuna player but I am going by what I have played against and seen. He’s pretty solid although a lot of people pick him for fanboyism and just spam Bs.
is p. kojiroh’s sc supposed to have really strict timing, cuz im havin a tuff time with it, any tips or confirmation of this ?
The timing is just strict. You have to cancel off the first hit of the 3-hit slash.
I wouldn’t use her in power unless you’re extremely good at hit confirming with her.
I don’t think she has anything in POWER mode that cannot be outdone in SPEED mode.
I was looking at your first page for Hibiki and I have to disagree on one of your things.
For DP motion B, it is a tremendously great move for SPEED. You link A,B,DP B, cancel into HCB+C, then do d,d A/B for massive damage. She is probably the character that has the most reliable chain into the speed combo.
EDIT: Also now that I have time, one thing you forgot to mention is that Lee’s regular super is escapable after the fan hits. You just mash and block.
I have to add some stuff with Mukuro since I use him as my main.
For after (b+A)x3, f+C, f,b,f+C you can cancel the crawl to his qcf,qcf+B desperation move. I see that combo used a lot and I use it a lot myself. He also has a mixup with after the crawl to cancel into B, then cancel again into crawl so you can mixup with the hcb+C throw or stuff. Most of the time I land the throw. Another thing to mention since I didn’t see it in your guide was that you can add more hits after the u+B, something that a lot of people don’t know and don’t even add to their FAQ movelists! After u+B input, mash f,b,f,b…as it will give you like 8 or something more hits. His hcb+C throw is great since it deals tremendous damage and can be followed up with a dash in C. If you are too into the corner when you perform the move, the last hit will most likely miss since he lunges forward. The u+B after C+D throw timing is weird since he recovers long before the guy hits the floor, something I really like about that throw (pretty crazy throw too). Another thing I like to do is cross up always with jumping B, never straight up jumping B cuz I can mix it up with qcb+A, super-cancel into super. That’s for those that cannot block crazy good on reaction however. I also don’t like the first combo of doing f+C to qcb+A/B, u+B since the guy can air recover and have PLENTY of time to run at you later. I just typically go for the crawl mixup or just simply (b+A)x3 into hcf+A.
big bad mog, i cant deny that from my experience, i agree that kojiroh seems to be alot more flexible in speed then in power, but then question for kyokuji or whoever else can answer it, on the inclusive banlist posted, how come power kojiroh is ranked higher then speed ?
And in all of the vids ive seen on youtube i see only speed kojiroh not any power
That tier list is my list, it doesn’t necessarily reflect everyone’s opinion. Although, the top and bottom tiers are pretty much set in stone. It’s the middle tiers that can be debated somewhat.
I haven’t seen anything from Speed Kojiroh that impressed me, besides her :r::snkb::snkc:, she’s got no stagger black :snka: on speed, which sucks since :snka: has great speed/reach and her command dash throw is much less scary since it doesn’t do much damage. Also, the mix-ups using her command dash become less potent as well. Normally, you can force your opponent to choose between jumping and eating a DP or staying on the ground and eating a throw, or eating a fireball if they try to counter attack. That sort of thing is much more effective in power since you’re getting like twice the damage output from single hit moves. If you can reliably hit confirm her :snka: into her super, then I see little reason to use her in speed. Especially when you consider how much more often the super will be available to you in power.
When I see people play her in speed, it just looks like they’re trying to play her the way they play everyone else, and I think you should play a character in a way that emphasizes their unique strengths. In her case, being her long range :snka: normals and her command-dash mix-ups. It’s the same reason why I think Speed Kaede is a waste of time.
Also, not all of the combos I list are stuff I necessarily want you to use. Just showing you what’s possible, and yeah I added that to the Mukuro combos. I had to re-write the whole thing so it slipped my mind. I did take out a little bit of stuff regarding the crawl mix-ups (like the reverse reset into ambiguos cross-up stuff), because I thought I was giving a little too much away. I’m here to help and give information, but not to tell you ‘everything’.
That’s not a good idea. The person landing from the reset has frame advantage throw wise if they time it properly. They’ll always get you first. It’s the same reason why you shouldn’t try to throw someone off a ground-air deflect.
And the more hits part is in the very first line of the guide 
Maybe it is just :r::l: repeatedly. I always just did repeated :hcb:s
The reason why I don’t like this is because you have to be fairly close for it to hit reliably, and I think part of what makes Hibiki strong is the reach and speed on her :d::snkb:. I’d much rather just go into her DM from :snka:, :d::snka:, :d::snkb:, or :snka:, :d::snkb: unless I hit confirm a cross-up or something.
I included that combo in her guide thing anyway though.
Also, I believe I’ve mentioned the Lee thing before. The same is true for Zantetsu’s super, probably because they re-use the dizzy code so you’re able to mash out the way you would for a dizzy.
People use SPEED over POWER kojiroh because the simple fact that POWER Kojiroh…well…sucks. The combos she does in SPEED are stronger and allow high/low mixup and chaining into her super is dirt easy. POWER desperation sucks and the SPEED custom combo at least gives you a 50/50 when setup right. I remember hearing something about the dash mixups, but she didn’t interested me so I didn’t pay attention.
From what I have played, I am very sure that they cannot throw you out of the crawl cross-up to throw after hitting them with B in the air. It’s been a while, but I clearly remember never being out-thrown during all my times using that combo against players. Mebbe it was cuz I used it sparingly or maybe you cannot out-throw the guy. Who knows, but again I am very sure that you still have the advantage. As for the follow-up, pretty sure it’s f,b,f…then again I used to do hcb,hcb a lot too. Just going by my memory stuff for move lists.
For the Hibiki thing, you have to hold B for a very slight time. Once that gets down, she should be able to plow through the guy 100% of the time. Follow-up after the SPEED launch combo with her super is possible if she’s low on health, so that’s always nice.
SPEED Kaede ain’t so bad. You can easily link his SPEED combo after HCF+C. I rarely see anyone play POWER Kaede on stuff like MAME since the timing on his b+As are really annoying with lag, same with Kagami’s links.
I’d throw my tier list that I remembered was argued long ago back with JoshthefunkDOC and Kono, but that stuff was debated like crazy and besides Zantetsu and Moriya, different things were thrown around and the next places got tossed around.
If I didn’t read things you did put down but I said you didn’t, my bad.
The finisher is :hcf::snka::snkb:
It’s :hcb::snkc: to activate his armor
If catch you a jumping foe with :dp::snka: before they reach their apex I believe you’re guaranteed enough time to get off :hcb::snkc: without risking being thrown. However, hitting it consistently does require a bit of anticipation. If you ever play Beo he uses this quite well IMO.
How? You can’t combo into speed customs from speed chains. They still have enough time to air deflect before the first hit. The only exceptions to this are Shigen, Setsuna and Amano since they get off the ground slower than others, and even then, they can still do it, it’s just tighter on timing.
Desperation moves shouldn’t be something you rely on period anyway. If you’re getting that low in the first place, you fucked up somewhere during the round.
I’ll gladly pit my power Kojiroh against your speed if you think she sucks in power. I’ve got a private server on kaillera where we can play on LAN provided you have under 60-70ms. We could debate it on here, but it’s easier just to test it on the field.
If I had to guess he’s referring to juggling in the corner off an overhead to setup a speed combo 50/50. Is that setup a true 50/50?
Links can be annoying with lag and delay but you get used to them after some time. Well most anyway.
How the hell Kyo there hit Kagami’s link like every time he tried it last time i played him is beyond me. I manage to get that one twice in a match if i’m lucky. (and have low ping)
It’s really quite simple…
Step 1: Wake up, shower, and eat a balanced breakfast (showering optional)
Step 2: ???
Step 3: pwnage