i like vanessa and blue mary but anybody would be welcome 
i noticed that the demo was taken down on psn. was the same thing done for 360? i donāt have the console to check for myself. thanks.
The top characters imo is the 3 listed but in no particular order. Meaning Kyo does not necessarily loses to MK and Beni, or vice versa for all 3. They play all positions on the highest level and are the best in the game in my opinion.
The first row to the left are probably the best anchors in the game but have faults because they need meter. They can still be played on point or second but sooo much stronger if anchor. So they play anchor on the highest level along with the top 3.
The second row to the right is the best point characters in the game. They also play anchor really well but due to their damage restraints, I would always put them first or second, but primarily first especially K.ā
The third row(along with takuma being the best of this area imo) are the characters that have TODās or can blow you up if they get started. However, they can get zoned or safe jumped because of no real options besides game mechanics. Can play secondary and point at really good levels, but right behind the characters in second row (right).
Third row right(including Liz and Robert) are the gimmicky characters that can really force you to do stupid shit and punish you big time for it. Probably should have put Kim on this side, but he has faults due to zoners on this specific row. I say they are the best secondary characters because they build meter well for your anchor, and if you are good enough, can beat the opponents second and get their anchor to 50% if not 25% life before they go down. Even if you do get them there, they are good batteries for anchor because theyāre going to build meter regardless unless you make an HD mistake or something similar.
Fourth row left(including Ryo and Chin) are the weaker(yet still good) characters in the game that play point more well than any other position. They are here because of the damage constraints, unsafe pressure, and as well as the ārandom neomaxā options that can fuck you up. Chin is an exception because he has stronger strings and gets better when he is drunk. He is the best of this bunch imo and probably a lot better than I have displayed him.
Duo Lon I think is the weakest character because of his unsafe strings, low damage output overall. He is still good with his instant overheads and his CD glitch, but I donāt think he is as strong as everyone else. I was going to put Mai down here, but due to new game exploits and her stun combo, she shows herself to be very dangerous in the right hands. I still donāt think she is in the Upper-Mid bracket yet.
TBH though, I think this game would probably need a matchup list instead of the ABC list. I want to make one but I am still unsure on some of the matchups in the game. However, I do know most of Claw Iori, Kim, Ex Iori, Beni, both Kyoās, K, Andy, Shen, Joe, and Hwa matchups. But thats not enough to make a matchup list lol. I would like some feedback as well if anyone has anything to share.
what Mai ānew game exploitsā? I still think even with her stun combo sheās meh.
You have Mr. Karate and Benimaru at the top, and Duo Lon at the VERY bottom, definitely below other characters. Then you have a bunch of other characters in between.
This is exactly how Iād make the list. Karate+Beni are fucking stupid (I honestly donāt think Kyo is on par, but heās not far behind, so w/e), and I think Duo Lon is DEFINITELY the worst character in the game.
Iām with it.
EDIT- Looking a little closer, I wouldnāt put Clark anywhere near that high. Iāve been playing with him for a little while now, and his game is WAY too one-dimensional to be that good. He loses to good footsies, decision-making that is WAY easier than it seems at first, and just overall knowledge of the character. I think Clark is only as good as how scared/ignorant you are of him.
Really good list Nagato I agree with the majority of it. This past week I have started to group Kyo up there with Beni and Karate. Although he might not be as good as them, he is close enough to the point where he can be grouped with them.
I also like what you did with the rows and explaining what each row does well. I do think it is hard to really make a standardized list with this game with the values of each character varying by position (point/anchor/middle).
A few things I disagree with here and there but mostly pretty minor stuff which is going to happen.
Didnāt know Duo Lon was so shitty though, I have never played a Duo specialist yet so I donāt really know much about the character.
I wouldnāt say Duo Lon is āshittyā. Heās still a very solid character.
Remember when the game came out, and EVERYONE used Duo Lon?
Notice how, now, NOBODY uses Duo Lon?
He has shit defense, he doesnāt do damage, his āmix-upsā are paper-thin see-throughā¦ risk/reward on them are hardly even in his favor, just damage-wiseā¦ take into account the fact that anybody with even alright defense wonāt get hit by it but maybe 1/10 timesā¦ I donāt see how heās not the worst in the game. Heās punishable in his standard offenseā¦ I meanā¦ I just donāt see it.
I said it on twitter last night. Duo Lon is smoke and mirrorsā¦ but heās like 95% mirrors, and not that much smoke, because I can see the mirror pretty clearly, and just block.
Actually in our community thereās only one Duo Lon player (Jozhear) and he does quite well still, he even runs him anchor believe it or not. He did not pick up on the first day around here, and to this day is still the only Duo Lon player outside of myself (and I would not call myself much of a Duo Lon player).
Iām not saying heās not the worst character in the game (though personally I do not believe that, I would give Mai or Terry that baton and even then, theyāre still quite good at what they do).
And while you do bring up good points, particularly about his mixup (as everyone has gotten used to the st CD bullshit by now), you also omitted the fact that he has command normals that go both fullscreen and 1/3 screen, allowing him to really pester someone from a distance, or super cancel as a punish that most characters do NOT have available. As for defence he has those normals, a good cr C, and a fully invincible (-throws) EX teleport.
He might not be great, but heās not shit.
Those concept sprites looks awesome.
I noticed today that K9000 is in the background of one of the stages. The clock tower, cog type one. Set in England.
Heās on the first round. I guess that means no chance of him in the game laterā¦
Duo Lon isnāt shitty, heās still good but you really have to watch what you do with him. ALL of his Rekkas are unsafe and the damage is very poor. I like his instant overhead options and his neomax is a command grab, but other than ex teleport, he has no really good moves. Foot stomp to stop zoners only goes so far in a match. I have seen good Duo players like MAD_KoF, iirc he mains him. However, heās not enough evidence to make me change my mind about the characterās ability.
As for Kyo being top 3, I was near that conclusion before I made the list and before I started playing him as a main again. I found a setup that guarantees that if I catch you with on BnB combo, and i have 100% drive afterwards(and I will be promised a safe jump after reverse DP+D), it is 100% STUN next time I hit you unless you do something Iām already trying to read. If you even run away and get out of the safe jump option, and I shut you down with Jump 2Cās or just keep pressuring you, the next time I hit you in the corner is 100% stun. This is really useful against characters like Takuma, Clark, and even Benimaru(he better EX Benimaru Collider(command grab) my safe jump or he will be stunned if I have 100% drive). Kyoās stun combo does 95 stun points. Meaning, all you have to do is land a combo that does 25 stun points or more, and the next combo after that (if you have about 80% drive or even 70% actually) in the corner is a stun combo. This opens more options to his play because now he can do EX command grab from empty hop since you are scared to get hit, if you try to jump back, i can 5C that or even DP if my reactions are good enough, the safe hop with B basically gives you enough time to stop a raw roll attempt, giving only 2 options for most of the cast, and those are guard cancels, and guard cancel attack just my be blocked(not sure, need to try it).
As for Clark, I have played some of the best Clarks in the US imo. The South plays a lot of clark, and there are about 3 I can mention that makes that character stupid good and especially a certain person who makes him stupid good on anchor. That is why I placed him that high.
Thanks for the feedback guys, I will try to tweak it a bit in the weeks to come.
Jozhear was also winning throughout SF4 with Vegaā¦
I think Duo Lon is legitimately bad. I donāt believe that about anyone else really. Thatās just me though.
I started playing Duo Lon but recently dropped him. He really is a mix-up character. You donāt really get damaging combos with him, but thatās because his reset options are pretty crazy.
As a counter pick against zoners like Athena or King Iād say he does the job.
I know Poongko had a pretty sick Duo Lon at one point. Not sure if he still plays him. Seth of KOFXIII? XD
I like duo lon. Iāve never felt handicapped by picking him. heās got amazing mobility and his his comand normals are boss.
My team is Iori claw / Kā / Duo Lon. i save the meter for EX Teleports, EX Rekka and anti-airing with EX Super.
his J. cd is amazing and really easy to combo into EX super off CH, and he has good reset pressure and mixups.
kinda like vega in sf4 it sucks to be KDād and cornered though
I think heās decent.
frankly i find it funny that at one point falken was thought to anchor with the worst character in the game (leona) though none of us really believed it, and now iām thought to anchor with the worst character in the game (DL) - i donāt believe it. Iāve always thought Mai was weak.
i think ppl get the wrong idea about duo lonās offense thoughā¦ rekkas are unsafe but you donāt have to use them as part of your offense. I hit confirm into them and sometimes iāll use them as a āwallā move since they have decent horiz. range and a good ground-to-air hitbox, which also helps me move forward. you can space them to be pretty safe.
I also think people neglect to mention Duo lonās j f+lk. the fuzzy guard stuff is gone but itās still an amazing move in terms of ālockdownā. itās just a long-range jumping normal that can lead into good damage from afar.
duo lon has low damage but i have had more success locking ppl down in the corner lately than outright mixups. once u force ppl to be impatient and try to escape, you can get some easy damage. otherwise you can crush their guard if they are too complacent
idk, iām not convinced heās worst, i think mai is definitely worse
I thought I was one of the odd men out with thinking Dou Lon is one of the āworstā characters in the game. He pretty much excels as a battery because his options doesnāt get much better with meter other than ex rekka combos, ex super and being able to blowback/roll out of pressure. Itās not that heās a bad character itās just that he isnāt as good as the rest of the cast.* He does have good corner pressure and control but even when he makes the other guy mess up heās whittling him down with punishes instead of pounding them for mistakes.
Hereās my tier list I made about a month ago or so. Top tier on the upper right, high tier just below, mid tier on the upper left and the āworstā characters at the bottom. I have Kim and Daimon in the middle because I feel theyāre the two characters out of the entire game (maybe Takuma as well) that are on the fine line between mid and high tier. Iāve seen them dominant in matches and look frightening but Iāve also seen their weaknesses exploited by being zoned out. I think theyāre very strong characters but I donāt know if their weaknesses are big enough to be cast in the mid tier sea. *
I feel Duo Lon would only be bad because of his damage. If he does what he does in XIII in 98 with 98 style damage, heād be high/top tier. This game is dictated by damage outputs really. His spacial control is great, but doing 15 air to air checks with j.6A or 20 j.6B instant overheads donāt mean shit in XIII.
On different news, I have temporary internet and I played Sparkster in 98 yesterday. I suck even harder than at the STA invitational. I havenāt played in ages and itās pretty fucking discouraging. Not only was it 98, it would be more so in XIII since I donāt even play the game (although I want to) and having things like worse cr.Cs and SF style Guard Break making me less patient and choking would make me even worse. RIP my KOF talent, whatever talent I had in the first place anyways. Then with how my job is, my only day off is Saturday so I really canāt make it out to tournies or whatever. I have the money but now I still canāt play games.
Very, very ugh. I hate it.
duolon just needs safe pressure (old blockstring into super safe foot thing) and his command throw back. in arcade he made sense cause he had the fuzzy mixup but without it he doesnt make sense as a character. hes supposed to be a character that can do what he wants and has a lot of different tools and mixup but low damage, like yuri. problem is his crossup stuff can be osāed so he has to just force throw/cr.b mixup, and then of course the damage will matter since thatās really all he has in the end
what you guys say definitely makes sense
Duo lon is so cool thoughā¦ i will main him regardless!
I am having a really really tough time against 13 Kyo right now. I have a few matchups I really need work on (Hwa and Clark are probably the notable others). At first I realized I was letting him push me to the corner too quickly where he is insane. So I started trying to play more solid against him mid screen but it always seems his buttons mess mine up and everything pushes me back 97329797 miles aka the corner again lol.
I remember asking Juicebox once on his stream and he said a general tip is that there is a range you can stand where all of Kyos hop pressure whiffs or something?
I play Benimaru/Kula/Claw by the way. My Beni has the least trouble against him because j.D is so busted but my Kula loses to him free and my Claw struggles pretty bad as well (not as bad as Kula). Any help would be great.