Karin General Thread: Elegant offense for a more civilized age

[Genistar]

Can karin’s up kicks anti air?

[R-D]

Technically yeah, but the part that hits upward takes a long time to come out, so in practice, it would be unlikely to happen outside of accidents.

[Tsumuji]

I think that if you have the opportunity to anti air, you should. I’m still trying to figure out what AA to use in each situation, though. Always has been a weakness for me.

[ilitirit]

Just posted a vid that shows how Ryu can Fuzzy Guard Break Gief and Birdie with j.lk/lp.

Vega General Thread: The Masked Narcissist Enters The Tournament

Ryu can use j.lk and j.lp as instant overheads (fuzzy guard break) against Gief and Birdie (Ken can’t do this). Dunno if it works on anyone else. You can do it SFIV style, meaning forward jump attack, backward jump j.lp/lk. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J17_yELvfRk

Karin can do the same with j.lk. I recorded a vid that shows instant j.lk overhead on wakeup vs Gief.

Gief/Birdie can avoid this by doing a crouching wakeup move or blocking high.

[HiyaMaya]

Hmm, do you get enough time to fuzzy j.LK off a blocked jump in at all?

[ilitirit]

Hmm, do you get enough time to fuzzy j.LK off a blocked jump in at all?

Yes.

[Tsumuji]

Can he air SPD you on hit though?

[ilitirit]

Can he air SPD you on hit though?

Yeah he can. Tight if he Tiger Knees it, easier if he just jumps and does it.

Jumping lights do so little damage especially vs Gief and Birdie it’s probably only worth it as a round ender anyway.

[LunaKage]

Or if the next hit will stun. Full combo off of an instant overhead, NOW WE’RE GETTING ANIME!

[c_nul]

About Anti air :

I thought just frame tenko was pretty decent as well if it was a more obvious jump in.

Normal Tenko vs Just frame tenko vs Ex tenko

https://i.imgur.com/tS3fDbh.jpg

[melflomil]

Took a look at Karin St.HP you have to do it late so it can AA properly. The 1st active frame which is in frame six is over her head.

[Muttonman]

Took a look at Karin St.HP you have to do it late so it can AA properly. The 1st active frame which is in frame six is over her head.

God, it’s only 1f though; that kind of sucks. Frames 3-6 of her cr.hp are pretty good though although a deep jump in or crossup blows them up.

[RagingStormX]

Yeah man her s.hp is really specific to use properly. Where is my A3 s.fp

[noosetester]

Apart from having better AA coverage, is there any point to JF tenko?

[R-D]

Other characters wish they had something like JF tenko in some cases. Can be used like a limited kara DP, or SF4 Sakura SRK, and like those moves it works 100% against some ambiguous jumps that would normally confuse regular AA attempts.

Have to be careful with the range though, only really for far jumps.

As for reasons why JF tenko exists from a design perspective, they didn’t want to give you that from max range without spending meter, I guess. It also reduces the juggle damage on things like max range whiff punish xx dash, or when you’re hitconfirming a single normal into tenko/shoulder and therefore have to do the tenko late.

[TheBlackHombre]

In the long term, your ground game is only as good as your antiair. Take that lesson from SFxT if nothing else.

So no, “just blocking” is a bad idea. But keeping yourself out of the dangerous ranges would help. If worst comes to worst, you can take a strategy of reacting to crossups with command dash, which low-profiles the jump-in and brings you to safety, at expense of positioning.

Standing jab is very good against close jumps, but has to be done late. That’s both a negative and a positive though - it means you can do it late and still succeed. Realizing that this normal existed reduced my anti-air worries by a lot.

At slightly further range from ideal jab AA range, standing fierce would clean-hit just about everything even from Zangief’s various jump-in options. But the range where this is the best AA is fairly small.

At these two ranges, jump back MP is probably her best air-to-air button. Jump jab is slightly faster and the hitbox is aimed upwards, which may be a bad or a good thing. Jump MK/RH had more range but also worse hurtboxes.

For further ranges than that, extending into max-range jump-ins, low fierce tended to be a steady option. Although you could catch some of those long-range j.RH with oddball things like s.MK, I wouldn’t rely on it.

If you’re ready to use it, probably the best AA for max-range jump-ins is instant launcher because it also works against empty jumps. EX launcher will also work and give you juggles, which is a nice way to call out people who are trying to bait a low fierce with an empty jump, or people who neutral jump trying to catch you doing something.

I don’t really like using EX reversal for an anti-air because other options will usually work, and it’s not any better against crossups than the fierce buttons are (whiffs often), but it is the most reliable way to deal with divekicks, and it’s also the only thing that’s going to work if you’re too late with your reaction to get a normal AA out in time.

Useful info. I’m sure I’ll end up maining Karin in sf5. She’s really similar to Sakura (my sf4 main) in terms of play style and her anti air options are very similar to Sakura so I shouldn’t have much time adjusting. I haven’t put too much time in with Karin but it seems like she has strong anti airs, just situational. I’m itching like Tyrone Biggums to play more sf5, I didn’t get a chance to play beta 3 sadly because I was visiting family during the beta weekend.

[ilitirit]

Karin frame data from Beta 3:

http://watissf.dantarion.com/sf5/boxdox/stats/cbt3_steam_megapak/CD7

[c_nul]

Thanks !!

[Super_Sonic]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VvskRVewq9I

[melflomil]

I’ll actually might give Karin a chance but it depends on what Capcom has done with Laura between beta3 and release