I disagree. As I am learning both the twins, finding out their differences, and how the Yun vs Yang matchup work is a good thing.
Thing is Thirtyfour, Yang is very much equal parts Yun and Fei put together. He has rekkas, but his bnbs and fundamentals are much more akin to Yun, and distantly Rufus.
Anyway, time for a change of subject. Yang vs Shotos/Sagat. Hasn’t been touched upon a lot yet.
@Wonder Chef
I strongly disagree. I actually feel that finding the differences between the twins is a good way for us [prospective Yang mains] to figure out how to deal with Yun in a match; in other words, it’s a good way to learn the match up. After all, Yun is pretty common at the moment so it’s definitely worth noting what works and what doesn’t. Any info we get helps. Yun vs Yang is far from a mirror match lol.
I’m almost very certain Yun has faster dive kicks that come out at much lower altitudes than that of Yangs. I even notice the difference when I use Yun. Yang does have a solid ground game but he doesn’t have a solid AA game against dive kicks like Ryu/Sagat. His lk roll kick is strong but it’s steep angle/hitbox makes it more prone to whiffing/being baited. In other words, it’s risky (though we do have the option to FADC if it does connect, which is very good). Yang is more fundamentally solid than Yun (less risky, stronger ground game, builds meter w/o taking much risk at all). Yangs corner (not overall) pressure is more solid than that of Yuns but the reward Yun gets for taking the some risks is great due to his overall damage output superiority. These are some of the differences between the twins that, to me, are very apparent. I can’t say what the match up ratio between Yun vs Yang is… but I feel it’s going to be [slightly] in Yun’s favor due to dishing out greater damage.
As far as Yang vs Shotos/Sagat goes, I haven’t played against either characters apparently (all I play against is Yun’s lol). So I’d rather wait till I actually do play against them and/or learn Yang a bit more before I post (less than obvious) worthwhile information. There is a vid of Nemo (Yang) vs Mago (Sagat) which is worth checking out (in the video thread).
Honestly, I’m finding that the height restriction on Yang’s dive kicks are only ever, ever, ever so slightly more than Yun’s. I’m almost certain that I was doing LK dive kicks so early today the difference is nearly neglible. I’ll give Yun the benefit of the doubt as he is airborne more often.
Regarding Yun having greater overall pressure, I cannot disagree more. Yun’s divekicks may be “better”, but thats basically all the pressure he has outside of his 123 combo. The differences in the DKs are overstated, IMO - Yang’s DKs are almost as good, and the rest of his pressure (ground, corner, air to air) just simply superior. If Yun’s Dks are 5/5, Yangs are 4 or 4.5/5.
About anti-airs, Yun cannot really anti air without meter, so he’s in the same boat there. Like you said though, Yang can FADC, so advantage Yang.
It all boils down to who you find harder to fight against. Dive kicks are very easy to be predictable with, so then we come to the issue of fighting on the ground. Yes, Yun gets some good damage for being risky and blowing meter, but the BNBs of the two do pretty much the same damage.
Screw this “who is better” crap. I know I started it, but I’m tired and I think so are all of you. Let’s just call it even or neglible, haahha.
Regarding s.lp to cl.mk. It works well in the corner, and I also landed it against Hakan today. Great confirm to U1 off of nothing more than a basic jab jab hit-confirm.
That’s what I was saying…
Eh. The point is that it’s not about who is better, but what exactly the differences are between the two. The shoto forums have these kinds of discussions all the time.
What do you guys think about close standing fierce after mantis slash xxx two fadc as a frame trap?
Cl.hp was what I used as a frame trap off cr.lp/cr.lk when I first started playing Yang, but I find cl.mp to work much better (overall as a frame trap in almost any situation) since you can confirm [on counter hit] into another cl.mp > cr.mk xx hp slashes. With cl.hp, you’re forced to cancel upon the first hit with lp slash because there isn’t sufficient time to confirm the hit into hp slashes.
@Wasted
How many jabs did you land before the cl.mk? If you got at least two, that’d be a great confirm into U1. I’ll try it out tomorrow when I get the chance.
Okay cool, just was talking with some friends about it.
nice info.
I’m pretty sure it was just one jab into launcher. I’m going to mess around with it again tonight and get a better idea of distance.
Cl.mp links into itself? Very nice find, will have to play with that too.
cl.mp into itself into cr.mk? Are you sure it wasn’t far mp? Either way that’s really amazing. We could really have something there.
cl.mp links unto itself on counter hit (I should have clarified. My mistake). I’ll try to see if it links on to itself normally since I haven’t actually tried it. I doubt it.
Too busy getting my ass handed to me to really try anything new.
Saw another Yang player get jab to launcher midscreen on Dictator. On a side note: WORST MATCHUP EVER. Maybe I’m overeacting, but it’s a dick ass match when all your air to airs and normals lose. S.mk and s.hk trade with dk and reset you to about half to 2/3 screen.
On divekicks, I am now convinced that there is no height difference between Yang and Yun. I’m hypothesizing that they may just have stricter timing for Yang, though.
i played both yun and yang against bison. really it’s hell, might even be his worst match-up. there is no height difference for dks between the two it’s just that yun’s is faster. It really isnt a big deal though since yun needs that more than yang because of his weak ground game.
Haha yeah, you just have a massive problem putting any pressure on the guy. He gets away almost free since the twins have next to no answers for far backward teleport. Yang u2 is good for tagging after a stomp I think though.
Haven’t played a Dictator but just thinking about the match up makes me cringe… does anyone have an idea of how to punish/OS some of Dictators wake up/reversal options? Let’s first start from there…
Someone dedicated needs to make a match up thread soon.
You don’t. Pretty much. low short beats yours, so if you tick throw or try to crouch tech, you lose. Yang has no real answer for far wakeup teleport, and you can’t punish LK scissors. Haven’t tried anything vs EX scissors, I never see it used.
Played more Yang today. More findings:
-Rolling Kicks and U2 punish Viper’s burning kicks since they home in. Also, I kept stuffing Thunder Knuckles with cr. mk.
-Well, it looks likes EX Command has ZERO HIT INVULNERABILITY after much testing against cr.lp happy players lol.
-I think EX Command Dash can escape Blanka’s U1 after you block it. I’m going to try it later this morning.
-If you anti-air Roll Kick at the tip, you can juggle with EX Roll Kick without having to FADC.
I’ll post more findings later.
If I had an AE cabinet close to where I live, I would spend all my time there instead of making a thread about match-ups that I might not even had a chance to play yet. (Being Arcade and all)
That’s a pretty sick juggle. I wonder if you can do an MK roll kick juggle after it.
Anyone played around with any meterless things Yang can do after cl.MK? Yun is fortunate enough to have his Genei Jin ender back (his F+HP into dash punch juggle). I can get MK roll kick, but that’s about it.
I’ll try that out later today. As far as cl. mk stuff is concerned, you can cl. mk>JC>jf. hk or hp or cl. mk>HP palm, from anywhere for a good chunk of damage.