I guess cl.LK, cl.MP frame trap is even better now, its actually a true blockstring. And we’ve got a high damage move for close 3f punish situations (not many of those though), and with a fuhajin stored its a decent damage punish too. Also a 3f move available regardless of fuhajin stores is always good for links.
The original pinwheel buff was a little too good, in its current form it will still be of use for the purpose of extending combos, although we lost the high damage options from it. Lets just hope they snuck in some FSE bugfixes (and didn’t forget to buff close.MP in FSE mode)
Edit: Just to make sure everyone read it right, they’re saying you are at +6F advantage after Pinwheel FADC. The previous changes said you get +5F more advantage, giving +8F advantage overall. So they nerfed it a little to prevent linking cr.HP or Ultra2 after.
I’m really happy about the cl.MP buff. That, along with the cl.MK buff, will most likely make hit confirming far easier. I can hit 2-frame links 8-9/10 times, but I’m too inconsistent with 1-framers to rely on them, and I felt one of my biggest problems with my Juri is hit confirming, which is why I was desperately hoping for some buffed normals. Now, I still would rather a jab that universally hits crouchers, or a s.LK that had the same amount of advantage as s.LP, or even quicker startup on her c.MK/c.MP. But I’m not complaining, as cl.MP is still going to be a very nice usage, and I’ll certainly start using this normal more often.
3 frame strong? Finally we have 3f attack while fuhajin stored. Yay for us.
I wonder why the pinwheel nerf… I was kinda hoping they would make U2 a bit easier to land (like 2f link instead of 1f) considering how easy is to land some ultras. Maybe they want people to use FSE more. Or maybe they will come up with another way to land U2…
This is fucking stupid why did she get nerfed, those initial changes were exactly what she needed to maintain a good damage output, not only that but they fucked up everything in the process:
The combo Cr.mk xx Hk pinwheelx2 FADC Cl.mp xx Hkpinwheel, does 294 damage, pathetic, replace cr.mk for cr.hp and you get 334, i laugh at that.
They made the first hit of Expinwheel +3 again, WHY, WHY, WHY!!! When they made it +8 that was going to prevent it from trading with moves in their favour and the opponent gettingn combos off of it now its +3 again, FUCKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKK.
Bet they dont change the startup on FSE close mp either, bet it stays at 7 frame startup cz they are idiots. If that also becomes 3 frames it might fix the issue where it whiffs on alot of crouching characters, although it also might make it worse i duno.
This was pointless, gief +8 back plz. Oh wait its still there, +8 on second expinwheel hit, 3 Bar Ultra 2 hype…
Maybe they thought it was a little too good. Even if it was a 1 frame link, that wouldn’t be a problem at the highest levels of play.
Being able to link U2 off a simple cr.lk, st.lk, cr.lk xx Pinwheel FADC is pretty beast. Juri can already combo into U2 but only via jumping roundhouse, ex dive kick, jf.mp or fuhajin store FADC. But that’s not nearly as good as hit confirming into U2.
And pinwheel FADC into cr.hp was also kinda “broken” I guess. You would be able to do the same damage as Super or U2 with only 2 or 3 bars.
imho Juri doesn’t need to do damage like that. Add the FSE, close st.mk and FA buffs on top of everything and you got a pretty broken character. That’s probably why they nerfed it to be +6 instead of +8. Still sucks but I can understand why they thought it was too good.
Some characters shit out that kind of damage for free, but i can see what you mean. Either way bringing expinwheel back down to +3 is fucking lame as shit.
cl.mp buff is a random one, i can see it now as the go to button for trying to score counterhits up close, but only up close, which makes it sub par, Juri already had a 3 frame move up close while as all her far normals are still slow, have shit hitboxes and frame advantage on hit or block and hardly any of them special cancel.
But as you were asking before lk pin does whiff on some opponents. No adjustments were mentioned about fixing the hit boxes for the move.
Look i’m happy you can at least get something outta a fadc pinwheel, though when mike put it into perspective, you’re better off saving your meter for an fadc after a fireball stock much more +frames to do whatever you like.
There are plenty of character that can confirm into big damage when they’ve got two bars, I don’t see why you’re making it out to be such a big thing. Due to how Juri’s normals are frame-wise the only way to give her that damage is to give her big advantage on hit, otherwise they need to start changing cancel’ability and startup, and seeing how good c.hp is as an anti-air I don’t see reason as to why they would want to make that faster just to make it comboable from pinwheel. tbh it would make more sense for them to change her cl.hk to become 5f or something and cancelable, that would make her combo look more unique and give cl.hk a use outside of FSE. Of course this is all just pointless speculation on what could be.
The only thing we’re left with is the cold hard fact that we lost something we never got to enjoy to begin with.
I have a difficult time seeing how that would be broken/OP for her to have unless they buffed her walkspeed enough to become a solid footsie-character like chun/sakura/akuma etc.
I suspect they lessened the advantage so that she wouldn’t have all of that advantage on block, but then again, yang probably retains his advantage from his slashes fadc…
I suppose the other use for 3 frame Mp would be being able to plink a 3 frame punish, but once again this is really only limited to close range, which is actually alot more limited than it sounds.
There’s always the chance they might go back on that Pinwheel nerf after the loketest, though I’m not naïve enough to actually think that’ll happen.
I’m really disappointed by that, it was the buff I was looking forward the most to, and I really don’t think everything else will make up for it, specially when everyone seems to be getting massive changes.
We’re talking about styling. In terms of how moves look cl.mp looks pretty gdlk when you see it, but the damage is ass XD
Skatan, that’s capcom for yah. Nobody gets to have fun, and RIP Yang ;.; I hardly knew yee.
Juri has an okay footsie games, you gotta have a stock to make it effective in close range (And that’s if you even get a hit to begin with, whiffing it is no bueno). I dunno how many chances we’ll get to hit an opponent with cs.mp and not eat a cr tech or another 3 frame move with +4 on block. Cs.mp is -4 on block as it stands now, but it is special cancelable. It’s just a little food for thought now how we see us juris using it in the close range footsies game. (Outside of fse at least)
Now in terms of her overall footsies, Juri’s best pokes are the far standing moves. Her far standing lk is the only viable move that is sp cancable and would be useful for our new fadc pinwheel combos. Far standing jab, the other sp cancable move, has more +frame, but becomes ass because of it’s limited distance and character specific hitboxes. So let’s take a look at how fast these mid range pokes come out. Far standing lk, 5 frames, and far standing jab 4 frames. In the spacing game juri wants to use the faster move to counter hit and beat an opponent, but with those slow moves she is gonna lose since. Most of her harder match up feature opponents with 3 frame pokes that have much better reach than her pathetic jab and will beat her far standing lk (which will cause us to trade =). What needed to be change in terms of viability was shorten the start up on far standing lk to at least 4 frames, something reasonable, or make jab 3 frames (standing or cr. jab). Fs.Lk is a good move one of Juri’s better pokes, but it comes out so damn slow that far standing mk is the better go to poke in the mid range distance. This is why i was hoping for another far standing move to be sp cancelable, it would give her more opportunities to make things happen in the mid screen and fadc pin would be hella useful here. But since far standing lk is the only effective mid range move that we can special cancelabe, we’re looking at 1 frame links here (lk pin starts up at 4, mk pin starts up at 5) and if you mess up the pinwheel and it comes out late you have to fadc, especially if you do mk pinwheel.
Capcom gave us another 3 frame move so we can go in on people they just forgot most of her other pokes are fucking slow. For us to even go in on someone we need insurance (fuhajin stock). cs. Lk is a 3 frame move that has plus frames on block, but most of the time we’ll have a stock up. Cs.mp (unless they change it on block) is -4 on block and we can’t spam it since it takes too long to recover, and the active frames are terrible too (they should changed that to make the move more viable, like makoto’s gdlk cs.mp, that shit has 7 active FRAME, and juri’s only 4 active frames -.-;; So essentially when we’re in we have to spam cs.mp which will be 9/10 be blocked and we’d have to either stock or release and we push our opponent away so we don’t get punished (like wtf). Chip damage for all that effort, then you gotta do the same shit over and over again, it’s why most people do not play juri, she’s a difficult rinse and repeat character with a slow and ineffective footsie game. (Still love her to bits though)
Her new 3 frame move is just the same frame trap, nothing special here. I only see it being useful as a strategic meaty on an opponents wake up, but don’t whiff it so much, the active is still ass and recovery is 14 frames. If we’re gonna use it as an effective tool on an opponents wake up throw out a few cs. lk and then the meaty cs. mp. FSE users will reap the benefit of Cl.mp. (U2 HATES YOU FOR BEING SO GDLK! Here’s lookin at you kail >=) If they block they block high, you go for a low attack. They block low you sekku, it’s pretty nifty yomi.
Like what other 3 frame move do we got beside cs.lk, with plus frames to plink it too? (close standing jab?). We’re crappy on block with that move, you gotta special cancel it so you don’t get jabbed by someone with a 3 frame poke. You’re right, it’s a lot more limited than it sounds out side of FSE. It’s only effective in FSE.
What can you do off a far lk? With this change you can fse xx pin fadc xx mix up. In the past the mix up was just the high low. Now you can train your opponent that you will go for guaranteed damage off. You can also complete combos off it or…use the extra frame advantage to start new mix up opportunities.
You’re forgetting also that scmp is 3frames and frees up your kicks. Would be nice I’d you had a low hitting quick move… But now your strings are tighter with your fuhajins. You can create huge lock down opportunities with 3 fireballs with hit confirmable offense with much tighter strings.
I’m more interested in the pinwheel changes for fse to be honest. Mixed in with fse meter gain…were looking good.
Fse I’m telling you. It’s not guaranteed damage but makes her so much better! Her far mk is special cancellable. How sick is that?! Far mk xx lk pinwheel fadc fse combo.
And her dash changes!!! Really???
Everytime I think of that change… I want upper… Immediately
These changes are going in on TOP of the alpha changes, right?
Based on some people’s reactions, it sounds like that’s not the case.
I don’t see what the big deal is. Sure, the pinwheel hit frames went down a bit, but we’re getting a nice normal buff, plus all the good stuff for FSE.
And Pinwheel FADC U2 will still be possible, (but tight) right?
All the other things stay, yes. Pinwheel FADC U2, well, technically, but only by FADC’ing the second hit of EX Pinwheel, which is of unknown difficulty and takes three bars.
We still get lots of cool stuff, especially for FSE. But it is worrying if that will be enough, considering the crazy buffs other members of the cast have gotten o_O
