pretty much the bolded part is what I was after. I made it too long but oh well shit happens
The two things I’d like to see corrected about FSE would be cl.MP not whiffing and st.HK’s hitbox to not change (a little less important to me).
The main difficulty with FSE is that it’s hard to use standing moves at certain distance because when target-comboed the distance vary depending on your previous normal and you can’t really tell if you’ll be using a close or far normal.
Fixing at least one of these two would allow to bypass this problem and allow for more BNBs.
Right now to my knowledge the consistant BNBs are (…)MPxx2MKxxHK which consistantly lead to cl.HK, but MP can whiff when it’s a cl.MP. And all crouching combos which won’t cause far/close problems.
Otherwise they are combos that “works on X character at the Y exact distance if the character is/isn’t crouching”…
Cl.HP not whiffing would be nice too, as it can lead to decent resets.
Store>EX Senpusha not fully connecting is a bit annoying too, I guess. Otherwise I’m happy with the changes, the dash looks amazing, and the Senpusha changes are great as well, if the frame advantage is also added on block it’ll make her even stronger.
Shit got** real** with Juri. Can’t wait.
The ones in bold are your only important points. Doesn’t matter that Juri loses her ability to tech or LK pinwheel if she has a L fuhajing stored. That’s how she was designed. So it’s useless to even mention it. And I don’t think “biblockables” are a Juri-related problem.
You have 4-5 points/problems you want to communicate. Do 30 seconds segment per point. Your vid should only be 2-3 minutes long.
If you recoded that video yourself, from your console straight to your PC?
i play juri and ken so i know what i’m talking about, so stop assuming that i don’t know wtf i’m talking about dumb ass. and why the fuck would a ken player switch back to ryu when ken have coward copter plus more? it’s like not ken have a better low forward, better inside game, and once ken knock you down he is more threatening than ryu. also, ryu doesn’t have coward copter back, he can only use the extra “break” frames to adjust it for more offensive use. it’s still punishable as fuck if tried to use for corner escape.
as for sak and juri, why are you listing general weaknesses about them that i already know? i’m saying with the nerfs to twins, fei, gouki, that sak and juri will easily move up in placement and regardless of “ease of use” they’ll more than likely be used just because their pros will outweigh their cons. and also most of the cast that was neutered won’t probably be as good as them. so basically you wasted the second half of your post for absolutely nothing.
also why do you keep mentioning “they’ll never be easy to use” like thats an factor to most tournament players? there is a reason why viper is highly represented in most tournaments and she is one of the most difficult characters in sf4. good players look for characters that will reward you for effort spent regardless of execution barrier. get that scrub shit out of here.
This patch is pretty meh. These are minor tweaks that aren’t going to improve her match ups much. Sadly the best buffs Juri gets are nerfs to her opponents. Her Ex Pinwheel doesn’t need to be godly but considering you need to expend meter it should be more reliable than it is. The list of buffs looks impressive until you realize that it is mostly FSE related. 15 seconds during FSE is not enough to help her bad match ups. .
I don’t feel they analyzed her bad match ups at all when deciding these buffs as characters like Bison will still walk all over her. Even making her fireballs quicker to store and release would help, it’s not desperately needed but if Bison is going to kick the crap out of her up close then make it so she can keep him out easier.
Oh and I don’t buy the whole Juri needs more time to develop stuff. Characters like Rufus were found to be strong and yet top players who have used Juri just keep missing whatever it is that makes her good? A year and a half and still rated low… she just has issues.
http://www.eventhubs.com/news/2011/jan/30/complete-ssf4-arcade-edition-tiers-daigo-mago-tokido/ 4th from last, 4th from last, 3rd from last
Regardless I like her and will continue to get better with her but with some of her bad match ups getting only buffs in the patch I still think it’s going to be fairly frustrating to be a Juri player.
PS This is just my opinion so don’t have a hissy fit if you don’t like it, just try to respect it.
I was watching the Guard Crush stream and Floe was in the chat. He said he was going to play Juri/Sagat in 2012. I remember when Super first came out that he played Juri. I think he fought Valle’s Ryu in a tourny and lost, but he played her very well.
Found the video. This is part 1 of 4
[media=youtube]sjp39rswJdc[/media]
I’ll respect your wish and your opinion, but it’s so funny smh. Def need more of this.
I only have one problem with your post. At one point you say, "Sadly the best buffs Juri gets are nerfs to her opponents." But then at the end of your post you say, "but with some of her bad match ups getting only buffs in the patch…" So what i get from this is her bad match ups are getting buffed but her only buffs are that her opponents are getting nerf? " yeaaaaah…i’ll go back to respecting your opinion.
But if you don’t mind I have an opinion to, so i hope you respect it too…=)
You seriously have no idea what you’re talking about.
Thx man and good luck with juri.
And last night at the Break KDZ said he may be playing Juri with me in 2012. But then he also said he doesn’t have time to train characters that aren’t top-tier, so I don’t think he’ll be playing Juri.
Wow everyone going to play with Juri, now because of her changes what about Cody that guy get’s mega boost up. But, I believe Juri might close to the top tier or Solid A at best. I wanna see Sako play with Juri because she always using females also, find some new technology I know top players like Justin Wong might pick her up as well or stick with Rufus. Year of Juri begins when the patch comes out and Cody’s lol and Hakan fucking beast xD Ken’s gonna be on top I’m thinking because of his changes and Sagat is going to be back up there too can’t forgot about him now lol maybe Ryu japanese players love Ryu. I know I talk about a lot of nonsense I’m sorry it’s late at night lol xD Dan got some great changes Troll mode Dan activate! 
It seems to me like the C-tier is in alphabetical order (because no one really cares).
I don’t mind other people playing juri, i just don’t want people to say, hey she’s good lemme play her and then found out she’s “ass” and don’t wanna play her. Cody is actually getting better, so when 2012 drops i’m going to hit the lab hard against him and work up some anti cody tech.
Oh, and either throw invincibility or more strike invincibility on EX pinwheel! Having both would be nice, but I’d take just one or the other.
All the Juri bandwagonners will drop her when they realize you have to play smart and put a lot of effort to win. Most people want an easy win-button and Juri ain’t it. So I don’t care if a lot of people pick her up because 90% of them will drop her anyway.
Juri isnt ass in 2012, even for people who refuse to use FSE they can do well with her simply based on damage output now. With 2 bars she can easily extend combos off any pinwheel into bigger damage. For 3 and 4 bars she has access to over 400 damage midscreen, in the corner with 2 bars she has access to just over 350 dmg using a fireball and pinwheel FADC, but because of the pinwheel FADC buff theres going to be more opportunities to push people to the corner. If she has ultra though thats even more damage for just 2 bars, both midscreen and in the corner. She had access to it before, but only with fireball, now for a one frame link (with reversal properties) you can easily pop Ultra 2 at the end of any combo with 2 bars, midscreen and corner.
She has her weaknesses, but every character has that for balance reasons, you just have to get used to them, even Cody, as beast as he is now has shit defensive options, a backdash so bad its not even worth OSing against (which rules out focus backdashing aswell), a invincible reversal he cant plink, mash or use whenever he wants. Bad spray can be easily covered as well, even with FADC buff, it doesnt affect any of its defensive properties.
Its not a bad thing that people want to pick her up, its good, because it implies shes more competitively viable, those who picked just because of low tier appeal will have to play someone else, sorry. I for one welcome the new changes with open arms, because especially the changes on FSE, are going to make specifically myself OP.
You say that like it doesn’t mean much but in reality it’s quite significant. What changed to make Fei Long and Cammy so good in Super compared to Vanilla? Do you think +20dmg on an uppercut turned Sagat from mid tier in Super to near Top 5 in AE? Nerfs to your opponents are a big factor, and getting some high dmg combos with meter isn’t anything to turn your nose at. Just because it’s an FADC combo doesn’t mean you can downplay it, if Ken’s SRK FADC Ultra was buffed to always give him his full animation he would hands down be #1 in 2012. And you can FADC with Juri into 350+ dmg combos anytime and anywhere in 2012, that’s massive.
It’s the reason why we keep getting rebalances to the game. People aren’t happy with what they. I mean it should be expected, but overall juri’s changes helped her overall game, PEOPLE FSE IS PART OF THAT SAID GAME EVEN IF YOU DON’T USE IT SO STFU AND STOP CRYING ABOUT IT! Of course there are plenty of things juri still needs fixed and i agree mike, juri has weaknesses, but that is part of balance. Juri can’t be 100% perfect with no flaws, she’d be broken and people would flock to her in search of a easymode win character. Juri requires a player to be smart and think outside of just lk pinwheel spam.
I agree with all of this post. But, Juri weakness is Bison lol.
As of right now, no doubt, worst matchup. In 2012, it gets a little better, EX PC can be punished with lk pinwheel if blocked half way through its animation, its a small punish but with 2 bars that could lead to Ultra 2 in 2012 or cr.hp xx Hk pinwheel. With FSE on, you could probably block it point blank and do dash up xx st.lk, and as it is right now Juri cant punish poink blank EX-PC unless she has super. Also her damage will generally be better, though id still use U1 in this matchup, but really its a toss up, niether Ultra nets any particular advantage against Bison.
Also that reminds me, anything that could only be lk pinwheel punished before can be extended with 2 bars, so stuff like blanka balls on block and EX PC as i mentioned above.
Id still probably pick Abel against Bison though, fuck Bison.