W7E vs W8E. Domain environment. Laptops. They’re i7, 8-32g ram, etc (specs based on user needs). Thousands of users dispersed throughout tristate area. Wireless. We have Microsoft support, so someone who is really involved should be fully aware of all the necessary technical details.
Several seconds difference of start/shut is what everyone seems to praise but that doesn’t even matter, it’s a small fraction of the total computer usage time, and that small difference between W7 and W8 is further reduced if you hibernate. W8 is bloated with unnecessary software which you have to hack to remove (completely remove, not disable nor block).
SMH :shake: at you thinking the transition due to UI is what I’m talking about when I do most of the stuff through scripts and registry.
You flagging posts that don’t like W8 reminds me of Sep running around negging everyone who said anything negative about Sony. If you really want to improve W8 then take a look at your tickets and get more competent/qualified support staff.
I’ll be honest, there was nothing really THAT wrong with it. It was a decent idea (an OS that would be cross platform, and could involve hand gestures similar to what was popular with tablets). The sad fact is they seemed to not realize that tablets worked because you look down at them and swipe with your fingers with your arms resting. Using hand motions on a kinect gets pretty tiring lol. So you get stuck with a weird new UI that takes some getting used to and is a pretty big jump from previous versions of Windows, but you still have virtually the same functionality.
It didn’t seem to offer me anything new enough to warrant the jump from 7 to 8. The fact I will likely never see it in the business world is another pretty big hurdle.
My friend tried to test-migrate some users of his business to large touch screen monitors connected to desktops with Windows 8. It was a complete productivity failure.
At work we’re upgrading our systems, and we use some touch screen features already, but I still doubt we will be using Win 8. Custom Seimens setup. That sounds awful to say out loud.
I’d suggest that 8 was a marked break and 8.1 unwinds that back more rationally. It’ll be interesting to see where things head from here. Rumor mill has been interesting lately.
You said “huge downgrade in performance”. Then you say “unnecessary software”. Those are not the same thing.
Could you clarify the specifics of this “huge downgrade in performance”? Those are meaningful words: what backs them up?
Can I SMH back at your reading skills? I was responding directly to SoVi3t who was talking about “Metro” vs … “Win7”. My comments to him had nothing to do with your comments, other than a brief allusion to my surprise at your statement of “huge downgrade in performance”. Given that I write software for a living, I for one would not expect any rational human being to equate “huge downgrade in performance” to ‘you talking about UI’.
You can cheerily say you fucked Windows 8’s mom and never called her again - why would I give a flying fuck? I have flagged exactly one post on this subject ever, and it is because the comments provided are counterfactual, to put it politely, based upon my knowledge of the area and all external analysis that I have seen. Collating the assembled reviews I have seen and getting to “a huge downgrade in performance” is baffling.
I’m a technical guy. I have always supported and encouraged everybody else at other companies because it is a co-opetition, and other companies making good stuff leads to execs wanting their stuff to be that much better and the world being better for everyone. Much like Nintendo/Sony/MSFT/etc together lifting the standards of what is expected by modern gamers. This is awesome incidental synergy and it makes the world better for us all. I could give a flying fuck about what so-and-so likes or dislikes: the more variance of popularity the more opportunity there is to improve your own offering.
You might hate Bing, for example, because you totally looooove Google and want to marry it, but if you’re a rational being you probably also want to respect that Bing helps drive Google to be better. And vice versa.
That’s unintentionally ignorant trolling on your part. Let’s fix the ignorance.
Hi, I’m zachd! I do not work in support. I am a software developer. I also have been publicly involved in trouble-shooting and helping customers since about when I started my job. I have undertaken many projects to significantly increase the skills of the support staff, whom I have no control nor jurisdiction over, and products have directly gotten better because of this extra channel I have busted my ass to provide. I’ve worked within MS and with other companies to solve problems affecting millions of users (and those affecting just one hapless user - the point is to solve the problems at all levels). I work in the industry to make things better, and have directly and repeatedly worked with “competitors” to help them make their software better because I do not give a fuck what is running on your PC: I for one simply want it to be an awesome experience. My website that some people here like for the fighting games section started out as a troubleshooting guide for a MS product, and still is about as close to a definitive guide as you’re going to find. That probably speaks more to how bad troubleshooting is than to my own skills, but – just to be clear: I am improving support, and have been doing so since I got here. And yet I have nothing whatsoever to do with support: I just help out here and everywhere because I believe that you should have the right to have your computing experience (be it on WinOS, MacOS, Linux, BeOS, or Compy286) kick ass and be what you want without hassle nor frustration. If I recall correctly I believe I was the first dev at MS to add Opera and Firefox compatibility support way back when, completely of my own accord and on my own time, simply because I wanted y’all to be happy.
So yes, I do look at “tickets” and many other much better sources of user metrics and problems and do what I can. Heck, I believe SysInternals may be publishing something of mine at some point hopefully soon which should be a god-send for troubleshooters everywhere.
But let’s move on from that. I believe the above hopefully firmly establishes that a) I do want to improve everything, not just W8; and b) I’m actively doing this shit so you telling me to do exactly what I’m doing is a waste of typing.
You made the statement: “huge downgrade in performance”. Was this just a statement of opinion or was there some factual backing to that?
Allow me to address your large reply in parts via letters:
A)
I know those two are separate. Let me summarize the total three things:
_1) Performance
_2) Bloated OS without ability to remove unneeded features using conventional methods
_3) Useful features removed
Lets now provide examples:
Performance
A sample use case would be a domain user logs onto his/her domain account roaming profile (fairly small), performs work such as video conferencing into online meeting, then signs off. After migrating to Windows 8, here are some observed differences. The system starts several seconds faster, but the speed differences reported for Office 2013 between Windows 7 and 8 are not noticeable by our users. What is most noticeable, is that migrating from Windows 7 to 8 (8.1 with all security updates as per network access requirements) is that profiles take over a minute longer to load, computer responsiveness is slightly noticeably slower, and the domain users experience slightly longer log off times. For this scenario, while consistent for many, was also tested on a single PC, with reverting between W7 and W8 using our images. Please don’t start blaming non-MS software such as “your wireless and graphics drivers aren’t perfectly compatible with Windows 8, etc” because that won’t make W8 look any better.
Bloated OS without ability to remove unneeded features using conventional methods
Examples such as Defender and Cloud Integration. I’m not going to discuss how good or not good Windows Defender is, but users should be allowed to simply uninstall it and not just disable/turn off. I know you will say it’s for “security” but they should leave it as an optional windows update/feature instead. Every business I know has superior commercial protection and home users can still do better with free non-commercial use software.
B)
I didn’t say I hate Bing nor did I say I love Google. I like neither actually. I also said competition is a good thing and that XBOX should stick around, which you would have known if you would have read my posts.
C)
SysInternals… I just want to inform you that it was great when all the source code was available and Microsoft promised it would still be available but then they assimilated SysInternals and removed all the code. I still blame Microsoft for it. If you really want to help everyone and make the world a better place, you should be for open source, not against it. You should be supporting Linux.
Anyways, I’m not personally blaming you for the huge disconnect between Microsoft and its customers, regardless if it’s business or home users. I also personally do not care about the “rumors” you mention. Many businesses are not ignorant and won’t completely buy into the next new shiny toy that Microsoft advertises. We will test the products first. For now, Windows 8 is an unsatisfactory operating system and businesses won’t increases their costs of operation and lower their productivity to migrate from Windows 7 (which is currently a great operating system). While I do like Linux, the total cost of ownership for many businesses would be much higher if they wouldn’t use Microsoft products, but if Microsoft continues the path it’s on now, many businesses may migrate to other products.
This isn’t a rant, just random off the top of my head words.
I believe as the technology advances, the lines between PC, Mobile device, TVs and so on will blur more and more until they are all one device for the consumer market. I don’t think desktops will be obsolete any time soon. And the software will eventually have to make that bridge before the hardware dose. I just felt it is too soon and too poorly executed. But its a step that needs to be done even if its done terribly.
Any ways since Win 95, Windows always had that pattern of having one good OS then one Crap OS. Good Windows OS 95, 98 SE, 2000, XP, Win 7 Bad Windows, 97, ME, Vista, 8.
Yeah you know its bad when a known Sony Fan Boy who wants nothing more than the end of the Xbox starts to defend it.
I don’t know anything about the issue you’re referring to. What’s the SR number on it? I personally find that my domain profile loads up lightning-fast, but then again we are on different systems. If you’re experiencing some notable regression in your homogeneous-ish environment that may be an artifact of something unique about that configuration. Clearly I wouldn’t know fuck-all about that. On the flipside, this is not a general issue that I’m aware of, which again points back to “that’s an interesting problem you’re having - I wonder what is unique-ish about your setup that leads to that”. Which is where SE/support gets to come in and track stuff down.
I don’t why I would blame anything. I’m a software developer. It’s idiots who don’t know shit about trouble-shooting that jump to blaming stuff. Everybody smart notices the problem and then tries to unwind it.
I’ll stick with ‘it seems irrational at best to call “roamed profiles taking longer to load on our configuration” a “huge downgrade in performance” as a global statement unless you have an axe to grind’. I’d posit that most people aren’t using roamed profiles for starters. But I don’t know what SE knows here since you didn’t provide a ticket number. It’d be interesting to get their current level of insight.
I do have performance numbers, and you can see third party reviews of 8 performance. I believe most all are positive. A “huge downgrade in performance” seems like histrionics.
Taking what you say at face value: you and I both know that your awesome plan falls apart of users do not go get that ‘free non-commercial use software’, and then every single other person on the planet pays the price.
That seems like the shittiest possible design imaginable.
As re: Cloud: I love Final Fantasy. More seriously: meh. If it gets in your way, contact support. Given historic support trends, it turns out that stuff like “backup” and “restore” are amazingly useful. You as the super power user might not want to go that route, so don’t. Maybe that feature is not for you. It turns out that you and I are in the tiniest possible minority.
Time is money. Could you be precise about what’s still missing there that you care about? The thread meanders and I’d rather not have to dig the specific meaning out from it if I don’t have to. Things change. Keeping code written back in 1995 around can be fun, but it’s not always a great plan.
(added A and B for clarity)
A: Uh: I don’t know anything about that. That’d be Mark’s alley.
B: That seems counterintuitive to my general interest in everyone in every industry being paid for their work. That’s part of a larger discussion on copyright and payment and the “race to the bottom” in the modern era, but I’m firmly on the side of “hey let’s pay people for their actual work” which is why I’m part of the ~1% these days who doesn’t pirate. If you want to get in to that angle, we can talk about it over pie at Evo. Generally I support your interest in that and have my own firm interests that do not get in your way.
Well, there is one company that kept code from 1991 till 2004.
Edit: Actually, longer if you count the psp ports.
Joking aside.
Listening to small group that barely work in the industry, bad idea.
Investors usually don’t understand what is going on inside the companies and what half of the projects would be used for. They’re in to get money back nothing else. Rarely, you’ll see one throw money out for a project and not expect it back.
Investors don’t know anything, Xbox 1 is projected to sell 9 million units for the next year. Which is a huge install base. Course PS4 is projected to sell 12 million units during the same time frame. But they’re both great numbers.
The fuck happened to this thread? It originally started as Sonicabid’s usual “M$ MUST BE DESTROYED!” dribble and now it’s EG vs Preppy in some debate over Windows 8 lol
