less gimmicky game play would be nice…
no I don’t wanna see 93459345435430 tech throws. I also don’t wanna get thrown out of my special move.
Makoto is an extreme example. Take a look at Ibuki in 3S. Her walk speed and dash are both great and it doesn’t cause a problem.
Its a good balance but shes the type of character that needs it. She isnt top tier. I dont think every character can be built like Ibuki is in 3s. Imagine Makoto with that fast walk speed and her dash?
Its really depended on arch type. Imagine Zangief in SF4 with Akumas walk speed and Makotos dash. He would be ridiculous! lol
Man I’d really like to see a mid-game evil hado takeover for Ryu, just to see how dope they could make it look.
Better stop playing FGs then that happens in EVERY FG. Why shouldn’t a throw beat a fireball if close enough? Not like grapplers don’t typically get the shaft enough in FGs.
All I want is FADC and unblockables to be. Considering Capcom’s track record with both, that shouldn’t be hard to implement. Failing that, can we get hard knock downs that last forever. Maybe 20 seconds is enough?
Funny to see how people still don’t realize Arika’s characters don’t belong to Capcom.
That video is from the infamous Kaxblastard that nigga is lagswitching trash and his opinion shouldn’t ever be taken seriously lol
sf4 has a retarded throw system. MUCH worse than any other previous fighting games. never bothered me in other games but in sf4 its noticeably annoying.
its not just fireball nigga. pretty sure I got thrown out of blanka ball and psycho crusher before. assclowns use throw as anti air too. like instead using a proper anti air or blocking a cross up, they just mash throw instead. and apparently it works.
I couldnt even finish watching the video. Faggot character this and faggot character that is all you hear. I was like yea, let me close this this trash now.
I think that strikes should beat throws if connecting on the same frame, just figure out a different way to make throws better like shorter tech window and/or slight frame advantage for whoever initiated the throw after a tech. Simple stuff like that could go a long way in making the game more offensive while also not making it too good.
i wouldn’t mind bigger general throw ranges and shorter tech windows. I don’t mind crouch tech since it works both ways. But normals should be better overall, less recovery and more active frames all around please. Less ways to alter jump arcs are good too. Smaller reversal window and less hitstop on block/hit too. We don’t need shit like dans/ryus/shoto cl.mp’s that freeze for ever. Better walk speed too while your at it. I wouldn’t mind a game well centered around footsies, whiff punishing, bulding meter for being active, but being punished for being too active and pressing buttons without thinking things through. No auto block is good too. And a 3s parry would be the cherry on top.
To be fair anti airs in SF 4 are kinda shitty soo…
I admit I dunno about Blanka ball in ST but Bison PC it was possible in ST, Alpha and CvS2 and same with BB in CvS2/alpha to throw him out out of startup as there was a period of time before active he was still grounded. If a move isn’t airborne on 1st frame or fully invincible until active typically older games you could get throw period.
Throws are one of those things that can’t be added in a vacuum, unless you want the game to be centered around throws. You have to consider what mechanics you want to characterise close-up fighting. In KOF, it’s hops, command grabs (certain chars and versions only) and frame traps (in later versions). In SFII, it’s throws and command grabs. In the Alpha series, it’s guard crush. In SFIV, the close up game is supposed to characterized by frame traps / throw mixups, but it’s ruined by the relatively ease of throw breaking, 3f low abare crouch tech, and the numerous escape options. I remember that Daigo once said that in previous games, close-up fighting was much more dramatic. I suppose he meant that in older games when an opponent rushed you down, something interesting was going to happen. You were either going to get thrown, have your guard broken, or be forced to deal with a high/low mixup.
There are a lot of things to consider when determining throw mechanics.
If you use 1-button throws (not a distinct button), you get a built-in OS. While it is possible to give1-button throws whiff animations, the general rule is if throws are activated off 1 button, there is no whiff if the throw is not successful. You end up with with a normal instead, which may not be a good thing. Even worse, sometimes you can get a invincible special OS instead. For example, in SFII Ryu can do a DP/Throw OS off a tick. After ticking, hold forward then do QCF MK ~ LP. If the opponent is throwable, Ryu gets MK throw. If not (eg. if they try a reversal), he gets a kara-cancelled DP, which beats the reversal. This is inescapable in some situations.
For 0f throws, you have to ensure that most moves don’t leave you point blank at -ve frames on block. Otherwise everything will be punishable with simple throws, or in the case where teching sets you back to neutral, momentum will get broken too often (happens in SFIV too often, eg. after DP FADC). In games with 0f throws, most special moves are generally + on block, and or they leave you safe from throw range.
If you allow throws on wake up, characters with no throw-invincible reversals will get thrown to death by characters who have better throw ranges, unless there’s a throw tech system that prevents this, but then this also has the potential to ruin the flow of the game. It’s for these reasons that many games do not allow immediate throws on wakeup. Also, if you allow throws immediately after hit/blockstun, you’ll get the same effect (see: Bison vs Blanka tick throws in ST, Sim Drill ticks vs anyone in WW). One way out of this is to give pre-jump frames throw invincibility. Many games do this as well.
For the throw tech system, abare via crouch teching can be reduced by assigned throws to buttons which cause slow OS’d attacks (eg. HK + HP instead of LK + LP). This has the potential however to make counter-tactics like parries and focus attacks too strong on wake up. Other ways to avoid abare are to make light attacks slower, force standing when you attempt to tech, or remove throw teching altogether and replace it with throw softening.
Assigning throws and throw techs to different inputs avoids the OS tech/throw problem. The idea here is to make throw teching an intentional, punishable choice.
In games with reversal throws, the throws generally beat meaties. This may or may not be a good thing for close up battling.
There’s lots more that can be said about throws. The point is that it’s generally other factors that determine what the the throw system will end up looking like. You can’t just decide on a throw system, add it to a game and expect it to be fun. Although personally, I’m a fan of 0f throws with recovery (multiple button inputs), and throw techs that don’t break the flow of the game.
Does Capcom even pay some attention to this forum? I think you have very good feedback, with different points but interesting as well.
Capcom can’t read.
They do however process typed dribble quite well, of which they mop up by the bucketful from Capcom Unity and EventHubs.
In all seriousness, I expect they glance across this and other forums from time to time. Their community interaction however is pretty much non-existent (despite trying to claim to the contrary) though there’s no doubt they might stumble across some good ideas that they consider roping in and claiming as their own.
Chun being able to hurl out over 9000 fireballs seems like a tasteful concept borrowed from one THC infused Marvel playing poster for example.
I hope not. I’ve heard some pretty ass retarded things on here. They do read the Capcom Unity forums though, and that message board is much worse than here.
ok.
great stats but you forget how juri’s dash has unique properties that chun and others don’t have.
most notably it low profiles.
she can dash under certain fireballs not to mention get out of corner situations like sakura and dan tatsu blockstrings.
she can dash under certain special moves like hugo clap etc etc.
so no.
juri and makoto have the 2 best forward dashes.
my original point is this.
people were happy over the faster wake up and wake up “backflip” roll recovery implemented in V to diminish possible wake up vortexes.
great.
but if you increase walkspeeds while keeping forward dashes then…call me crazy but…wouldn’t you then need to increase the wake ups even further?
I mean, no point in making wake ups faster in V if you increase the walkspeeds/dashes thereby negating the faster wake ups.
am I right?