True story… you know how to do that? Craigslist and Ebay, no joke. Here in Indy, I could buy a 360 Arcade, 20 GB HD, and a couple games together for like under 120.00 from some poor guy needing a break… you go check it out first, mak sure its legit and you’re good to go… Craigslist might be the place for hippies and crazy men pretending to be ladies to get laid, but its also the place where the city wide garage sale is… and it can be pretty awesome. (If not scary…)
After playing HDR on 360 since it came out and recently getting a PS3 a few months ago there are a lot of bugs still on HDR on PS3. Rooms do crash a lot more and connecting to players from farther away is a lot more dicey on PSN. Some of this may have to do with more PS3 players playing on WiFi (since PS3 has it built in) but even when this isn’t an issue connections get dropped a lot. Seems they never made a patch for PSN like they did for XBL (the patch fixed most of the room dropping problems on the XBL version).
On topic: I don’t think we will be able to grow HDR much more past where it is now. With SSF4 coming and Capcom’s obvious lack of interest in promoting it, getting new players will be difficult. That’s fine, though, because there is a fairly decent size community now, and that community is very dedicated. HDR may not ever have the numbers that SF4 has now, but I think that in the end HDR will outlast it. I don’t see the long-term dedication in the SF4 community that HDR has.
If we could just get the ST players that refuse to even give it a chance to play then that alone would help the community a great deal. I don’t understand the refusal to play it because it “isn’t ST”. I still love ST, but I also still love HF’ and CE, loving those didn’t stop me from playing ST. In my opinion any new SF2 is good thing and should be embraced.
First of all I really dont even know why I am posting on this site anymore. Honestly just tired of all the bickering, lot of egos, people only help you so much, etc. Anyhow I have no problems with you blitzfu but I also have both a xbox and a ps3. I play both because everyone is not fortunate to play on both systems which is why I bought both games on both systems. But seriously man the PS3 version of HDR sucks on sooooo many levels. I have no issues on 360. The issues I mainly have on PS3 is mainly connection issues though. There might be warping as some people say but I have not experienced that. There also are random disconnects/network error and not being able to connect to anyone which is frustrating. And my BIGGEST problem with PS3 is I can see all my friends playing HDR and guess what I can not join their matches. I have to wait for an invite first. How ridiculous is that.
My suggestion to help revive the scene would be have dedicated tutors to a character and playing with them. The goal would be the tutor would tell you how you need to play against/with thier character, how to set up your moves, what moves cancel what. Yes you can go into training mode, yes you can watch youtube videos, yes you can go to shoryuken and post a question but there is something more you get playing in real time which does all of the above at the same time.
This is my biggest problem right now. I feel I can dominate any beginner or intermediate player. But once I play advance players I get overwhelmed. I honestly feel that all characters are tough matchups which means I need to learn more but how can you do that when you lose and have to wait. You can only record so much.
Yeah, That’s the hardest stage. I’ve been stuck at that stage on ST (I don’t play HDR) for more than a year. I’m finally starting to be able to hold my ground against non-beginners/ non-intermediates within the last 6 months or so. And It really does deter many people from playing. I know I plowed through that stage, But I also know not many people would. (I always give the example that I’ve gone on losing streaks of more than 60 in one sitting against the same player)
Do you have any local players that play ST or HDR?
anyway back on topic: Merging the communities would probably help. But It probably won’t happen. the People on PS3 won’t get an Xbox for the same reason why I won’t get an Xbox or PS3. I’m simply not going to pay $150-200 for essentially one game. I hardly play anything else. and I have Vanilla ST on GGPO and SF4 for PC (even though the competition sucks now…) (I just hope SSF4 comes out on PC and not 6 months after consoles like SF4 did)
Holy crap. Thanks!
What? I wrote essays helping you out man.
Simply put, to be the best, you have to beat the best, or at least get accustomed to them. Seek greater opponents out and ask yourself why you lost. Analyzing what worked and what didn’t is important to getting better.
Ok, so one thing HDR is really lacking are notorious rivalries. Find people who are obsessed with beating each other and tape them and all the hype behind it. You will get more people.
I like the rivalries idea… You know what, in that vein, after a couple weeks of WWL results, I’m going to totally start writing up some little stories to filter out there, get some trash talk goin’, rivalries… man that’s actually a really good idea. Get people to pick sides, get them invested… have their fans ‘settle’ the score for each other, brag when the big dogs go at each other…
Where’s Damdai and DGV when I need them…
I might have made myself a bit understood with how I feel on HDR. HDR is my favorite version definitely I just have a lot of experience with the lifespan of games and can predict where it is going to go. I am not a fan of loops, vegas walls, some characters needed to be toned down, and more. Sirlin actually did an excellent job and just needed to do more. The graphics are also too dated for me on ST.
The current ST community is nice and supportive besides a few people while HDR has drama constantly. Anyone who plays ST on GGPO will tell you there is competition everywhere you go and the competition comes to you. They will also tell you that when GGPO is having a good day then the net code is the best out of any game and lag will then no longer be an excuse.
In HDR you have to search for the competition and the competition constantly tries to avoid you so you do not damage their ego. Most on GGPO could care less about their reputation but HDR it is everything to them. Why play HDR when there could be a place like GGPO that is a scrub filter and takes away most of the lag factors. I tried to even purposely hurt my reputation in the past for HDR so I could be considered tainted early on and so I wouldn’t have to worry about being perfect because any flaw you have will try to be showcased.
I have played trash talking games in the past and no game has ever gone as far as HDR with the trash talking and making things public. I removed all of my HDR friends from my list and stopped returning messages so that I could have fun and not worry about any drama. Doing this still did not help because people will find other ways to get you. Does any of this really affect me? No I could care less what anyone thinks of me because I know what I am doing is not serious and has no effect on anything. I will still try to defend myself though but even that is getting boring and kind of pointless because who really cares it is just a game.
Also I wasn’t trying to say silver rain is terrible I was just trying to show how stupid attacks look so he wouldn’t pull that on someone in the future because he could see how ridiculous it looks. Hopefully someone doesn’t pick apart every sentence here and refute everything like has been happening to my posts but I have no agenda so it doesn’t matter much to me.
http://incompetech.com/gallimaufry/care_less.html
Nothing personal, but this irritates me like nothing else.
Ha ha. I’ve always wondered about that phrase.
Nothing personal, but people who hang on every single word need to go fall off a bridge.
ST on GGPO is predominantly made up of clowns. Plain & simple. Not saying that there aren’t good and mature players on there, but there is ALWAYS stupid drama & rhetoric in there 24/7. Even legends like Graham get their fill of that stuff. When someone calls you out on HDR it’s not quite as bad because in all likelihood, there is a greater percentage of that individual being a “casual player” at best who mains other genres of games besides fighting. On GGPO that is hardly the case. Being on GGPO presupposes you’re hardcore. Casual gamers have no reason to venture into a ST room, because, well, they would never even hear of the program in the first place. This is why the ST community on GGPO is suspect. Why? Because you guys know better, you really do.
To answer the question posed by the OP, Mad Possum brought up a great point. There needs to be unity amongst the ST & HDR communities. I think the HDR community would be willing to play Classic Mode, but would the ST community be willing to concede New Sprites and (possibly) Widescreen? I know Watts is down, but what about everyone else? Is the ST community even willing to start running some Classic Mode on HDR offline tourneys? Ponder all but gave the ST community the “key” to having ST back at Evo…but I think it fell on deaf ears. Are guys willing to be pro-active to make Classic mode a reality? Are guys willing to relocate their matches on GGPO to XBL/PSN?
Beyond that, players need to actually show up to events. I find it comical when I hear the following, “yea, I plan on going to Evo this year” but said players wont even attend local majors or tournies. If you are not dedicated enough to drive 15 minutes to and hour for a major, then why would anyone realistically believe that you would “fly” and “book” a hotel for Evo? Seriously, let’s be real. That being said, I would love to be proven wrong at Warzone & NCR in the next few months.
I think additional for the ego saving comment, there are legitimate guys that get mixed up in there that are simply trying to avoid a laggy competition.
For example, scrub wins with lag, thinks he’s the shit. Pro-player leaves. There are 2 types of pro-players, ones with tempers and ones without. The tempermental ones sends hate mail. Scrub constantly tries to go after the pro-players but can never get a hold of them. Scrub goes on SRK to complain about it. Meanwhile, the calm and collected one knows it’s lag he can’t do anything about, avoids the situation altogether, gets called out too.
I notice a lot of ego saving personas here. I mean seriously? Ever notice the top 8 guys hardly ever get into the petty bickering? I definitely agree with Vintage here, online competition is nothing compared to real live tournaments. In the meantime, I have a group of local guys here who are trying to promote HDR especially with all the SSFIV hype going on this year. Last thing I want is HDR guys bumping heads.
Nuts. I thought you guys were talking about eggos. Man I’m hungry.
Its unlikely that GGPO players will migrate to PSN(is this a joke, really are you suggesting this?) or XBOX, since GGPO tends to have better netcode. In fact there have quite a few HDR people who have started playing GGPO lately, at least PSN players.
Would you really consider the player with a temper that sends hate mail a pro? Wouldn’t he just be a scrub that knows how to play the game somewhat properly?
Its like human civilization, SF pros get special treatment. Like immunity to the stigma of sending hatmail. :tup:
No, I was specifically suggesting GGPO players migrate to 360. The fact that GGPO has better netcode is irrelevant in this case. The principle of growing the scene is more paramount than “having better netcode.” There is nothing wrong with playing on both mediums, but majority of the players are on console. Thus, you need to convince those players that Classic mode is worth trying. Playing on GGPO exclusively is not benefiting the scene at all.
Vestax,
So true. If guys came out more, they would realize how pointless the online bickering is. I know I’ve had my slip-ups in the past where I lost my cool online. However, the more I’ve attended tournies the more I realize just how stupid it all really is. I mean, when you actually go to a tourney and TALK to people, you soon realize, “Damn, it’s cool to see other old guys like myself who still have a passion for this thing.” And all that other BS just goes away. Really, if more guys showed up, so much drama would be squashed.
I’m looking forward to chillin with NorCal Inc. at WCW. You gonna bring a quarter & string, Vestax? :razz:
Vintage, I don’t think GGPO is that bad. You’re quite right though that maybe 80% of the time, there’s someone there ready to spew trash from behind their monitor. These people should know better but it’s best to just avoid them. There was one good player who mentioned to me that he was sick of GGPO because of the constant drama and I just told him to ignore it by rationalizing their emotions. Some of these folks are awfully insecure because they don’t enter tourneys at all/frequently, as vestax mentioned. A large number of players are in the same situation and can calmly contain their egos but these few pitiable folks, while they may try to act all tough, have such low self-esteem that they feel criticizing others boosts their own stature. And that’s what causes much of the drama (although I certainly contribute to it by goading the other person sometimes, hoping to get an intense ft5 going, which may help me deal with pressure situations later on in tourneys).
But if you really consider why they’d be wasting time calling you out, there’s no doubt they’re fragile on the inside with a basic fear of your superior play, causing them to resent you. You can bet they’d never talk like that in real life to your face and I’ll wager none of them were close to beating you either. In fact, some of these players seem to have such low analyzing ability that they don’t see any tactics that are occurring in the match itself (from my experience, I’ve been called out by folks not seeing held back moves or obvious testing sessions with repeated variations of moves).
I think pretty much all of the really good offline players have a basic set of standards and principles so they’ll stand up for you and refrain from any trash talk. Many others are just there to play and improve. For the few who act out, I try to rationalize with them but most of the time, these players are simply blinded by the cave they’ve chosen to stick themselves in. In fact, it’s normally the better non-offline players who are the most insecure and talk the most trash; that’s why I always encourage everybody to enter tourneys and see how players really are offline.
As for community, I think PSN HDR has the best one around. Pretty much everyone is chill and enjoys playing. It’s actually the opposite of GGPO ST since very few play offline but they’re still friendly. I encourage them to play in tourneys too but regardless, they exhibit camaraderie instead of hatred. It’s possible the audience here is comprised of older folks who may be married/with children and thus have a more mature outlook on life. XBL HDR has a few infamous bad eggs and a bunch of good players that while not as close as on PSN, are still very cordial. But you also start to see some better online-only XBL players start to lash out. And if they played in some tourneys just like the GGPO haters, I bet they’d have a more open perspective on the community.
But it looks like we’re all in agreement with the view that tourneys = better player and better person (well, unless the person was good already). Interesting how universal that ideology is amongst tourney players. 
As for HDR right now, I’m ready to switch back to ST with any settings (well, no widescreen please). But as much as I want to, I think this is still too early to call for change yet. This Evo and the other majors ahead will be the test for which road SF2’s future will take.
This is the difficulty. Do we remember how much acromony there was over wide versus standard? I mean if you have to go back to ST I think DGV is on the right track that it should probably be done in classic mode of HDR. If only because it does look nice and I do agree that classic ST ‘shows’ its age. In the era of really good recording and competition in the space, I’m not sure ST looks that great on a huge screen in a big tournament. HDR does look good. I do understand its sort of a Wind Waker thing… When Zelda went cell shaded people either loved it or hated it. I didn’t like it for Zelda but I thought it did look good. I understand the UDON comic look is different, some like it, others don’t. I don’t think though you could expect to do an update to SF with today’s economic pressures and not update the graphics in someway.
Of course for the record I want to keep HDR just the way it is, which I understand only contributes to the acrimony. I say this though as someone who came back with the release of HDR who loves HDR for what it is and not what it isn’t. I also understand that my opinion and what I think about it in the grand scheme of things means very little in reality.
I do agree that at some point, this divide needs to end. The question is should new players be brought back or should old players be brought forward?
Old players need to be brought forward. The new players we did gain, Silver Rain is a good example, won’t want to go backwards. It would be easier for the vets to man up and go forward. As much as I love ST, I think HDR is the better tourny game because every character is viable now. I seen way more Cammys, Feis, Hawks, etc., played at high levels than I ever did in all the years ST was out combined. I don’t know (don’t care) if it’s the new moitions or the balance changes, but now they don’t just seem like dead weight.
Look at the last EVO, you had Cammy (Sirlin), Ken(Damdei), Gief(Damdei), Fei(Sirlin), Honda(Thelo), DeeJay(Afrolegends), all placing near the top. Yes, I know Afro used a lot of Rog, but he’s still a Deejay main. I don’t really want to go to back a bunch of boring Vega and Rog mirrors, LOL.
The thing that happened to HDR is we all got our expectations up to unrealistic proportions. The hype was so big, and the wait so long, that the game was never going to live up to expectations. People couldn’t just take it for what it was and just relax and enjoy it. Us old schoolers are to picky and critical. If so many people can enjoy the obviously flawed SF4, then we should be able to enjoy HDR!