Because it’s fun to speculate and exchange ideas. Don’t like it? Too bad, go troll the very same topics at Gamefaqs and Eventhubs.
Anywho…
I’m not a frame whore but the general idea is to give more recovery time to Chun’s best normals. I think that’s only fair. And it would be possible to delete her kara-throw, simply nerf the range st.MK has. Done. Damage nerf on SA2 is easy. She’d still be good, but not retardedly good.
Yun: Specifically? Normals charge less meter. Especially when whiffing. That’s only fair.
Elena: Why not? Her LP Mallet Smash is worthless, it’s a good poke all things considered and all other variants of Mallet Smash suck because of startup. If she can link into SA2 and it’s 1 frame then what’s the big deal?
Q: The idea is just to give him something quick he can use to punish without using Super, it wouldn’t be broken at all because he’d have to use meter. Regular punches would still suck.
Alex: Sensitive much? Glad that you agree on SA2 buff but here’s the problem with Alex compared to Hugo when it comes to his Powerbombs: (1) If he lands even LP Powerbomb he gets pushed away to half screen distance and has to work at getting back in, the Powerbomb is only truly effective if he has them cornered and even then many characters (Ken, Urien, Twins) can easily get out of that corner. (2) Powerbomb has a little less than Kara-throw range, Alex’s Kara-throw range is significantly better than Powerbomb. (3) The damage on Powerbomb sucks. It does good stun but that’s about it, damage-wise he’s got nothing on Hugo. Buffing the Powerbomb so he can’t be thrown out wouldn’t make Hugo irrelevant by a long shot.
Necro: I honestly don’t main him and was just throwing that out there. I’m exposed.
Remy: My mistake with supercancelling but I do think giving him the option of comboing into EX Cold Blue Kick would be good for him, set up some oki after the knock down, plus it gives someone a decent option if they don’t want to charge partition. The Sweep is easy; 1st hit doesn’t knock down, the 2nd hit knocks down because it combos off of the 1st hit and comes out a lot faster, so much that you have to red-parry the 2nd hit. Just making the sweep a little bit safer on block.
These three aren’t “fine” at all. All Makoto needs to do is land a single reset in order to kill everyone in the game, Ibuki’s air game is horrible and the damage she takes from her command dash is insane, and Elena? An entire book could be written on her problems. At the very least something needs to be tweaked about her standing animation to make parries less of a painful task for her.
I would leave it alone because that’s what 3S pros want and as we all know 3S pros are the only ones qualified to talk about 3S because there’s no bias or conflict of interest there at all.
What could you even give Elena to make her better? I agree it’d be cool if her animation and ability to parry would stay consistent. And as I already mentioned, have mk go in SA2 so you can have a hit confirmable low move (lk works but it seems pretty tough to confirm off of). I dunno really what else. She doesn’t strike me as a bad character, just not as good as the top tier people. I’m never in a situation with her where I’m like “man I have no answer for what that guy is doing.” Dive kicks online I guess, but that’s because it’s online. I don’t think she has any unwinnable matchups, even as she is currently.
Third Strike Balance change list (UPDATED ON 25/09/14)
Disclaimer For some of these characters I don’t play or play against and have either left blank or put changes others have suggested. Not all of these revisions are mine as some are taken from other forums on the matter and in the sake of Ibuki 4rd strike. Some characters I’d like particular assistance with balancing are: Elena, Ibuki, Necro, Alex, Hugo and Remmy.
Universal Changes
All characters now recover from block-stun both standing and crouching at the same rate.
Slightly increased the window with which command throws can be teched by regular throws. (Not to the amount where jump light punch or universal overhead aren’t useful options but just something for all characters to deal with command grab pressure.) This does not apply to command grab supers.
New HUD alert will pop up saying PUNISH when a character hits an opponent out of a moves recovery frames (be it from whiffed , block or hit)
Change hit-spark/ effect colours to signify whether an attack hits high mid or low. (P1 side High is Yellow, mid is orange low is red. P2 side High is cyan, Mid is blue, Low is purple)
All characters health bars now corresponded to the same distance per damage, and instead the health bars are longer/shorter. (This immediately shows differing health for each character and makes judging damage easier mid fight.) (For those like Q who can add to their defence they will get extended health respective to how much though this is done via some not straight figure eg: Per taunt Q gains x% more health x how much he has not just Q gains 50 health per taunt.
After throw-tech the person who initiated the throw (hit throw first) is at an extra -1 frames. In the case of frame perfect inputs both players are at 0.
Removal of option selects, if you go for the throw the game will accept no other inputs same for option selecting parry. This includes hitting down-forward to parry both high and low hitting down forward now counts as a low parry.
Increased window for quick rise input by 2 frames before you hit the ground.
Standardised ligancy for half circle inputs before some moves had more strict requirements than others this has been equalised. (Eg before doing Donkey Kick and Machine Gun Blow had different feels now they will all be the easier input like Machine Gun Blow Alex Power-bomb)
Chun Li
Super 2 now has only `1 stock
Her cr forward is now harder to confirm with (same as kens)
Lowered priority on some of her pokes.
Make her crouching hurt-box slightly larger though not radically so.
Ken
Light Shoryuken now does less damage.
Forward Dash slowed by 1 frame
Hard Hurricane kick now -8 frames on block from -7 but now -2 on hit instead of -3.
Yun
Genei Jin now has a larger stock (same length as oro super 2) but still lasts the same duration.
Zesshou Hohou (QCF +P) is now -16 on block up from -11
Damage on super 2 increased.
Makoto
Super 2 no longer hits high
Super 2 juggles more consistently when it hits airborne opponents (get 2 hits and launcher)
Input window for hitting normals after command grab is more lenient by 3 frames (done via buffering early inputs)
Dudley
Can’t be hit off the ground via shoryukens similar moves after throw.
Ex Cross Counter doesn’t take any damage off Dudley when it’s used. In the event that Dudley is defeated when using a regular Cross Counter and that Cross Counter KO’s the opponent it will now count as a double KO rather than Dudley’s loss.
Forward Roundhouse (overhead) has an additional frame of Start-up to make it more reactable.
Urien
Ageis Reflector reduced to 5 hits
Unlockables removed
Akuma
Hard Hurricane Kick now -6 on block from -5
Air Hurricane Kicks air to air followed by a standing attack will auto-correct.
Air Fireballs have 2 frame more recovery when Akuma hits the ground to balance this they also cause 2 more frames of block-stun for opponent.
Yang
Forward+MK (overhead) now throw invincible while in the air, moves further forward and upward so it avoids most sweeps.
Super 2 hits more reliably after roundhouse roll kick juggle.
Teleports now have less recovery going from 28, 33, 42 frames respectively to 20, 25, 35.
Ryu
Fireball now fully safe on hit at point blank range
Target combo now lands full hits at max range against regular sized characters
First hit of air.MP can be cancelled into air tatsumaki on hit.
Oro
His bread and butter launcher combos now work on the entire cast no need to shorten if for twins or smaller characters.
Land more hits when comboing into spirit bomb from launcher
Fireballs all now 2 hit increased tracking ability on EX
Unblockables removed
Elena
???
Ibuki
Wall jump added
Air throw added
New chain cr LK cr Mp cr HP super jump cancel able
Necro
Better mid-screen game
Increased grab range
?
Alex
cl MK can now combo into strong slash
ex air command grab higher priority beats dive kicks
jumping forward command grab now grabs crouching opponents
Hugo
ex claps faster
opponent can’t quick-rise after his throws
Q
cr.MK now special and super cancellable
Fierce dash punch now -2 frames like the jab and strong (can no longer be punished be Ken super 3)
Ex dash punch now at 10 frame start-up from 14
Upon using Q’s third taunt Q will perform a different animation his eyes will change colour and his idle animation will increase in speed to signify this.
Remy
Ex LUV into fierce LUV repeat should be a valid combo from midscreen or closer.
Can combo neutral throw into super 1 from full screen (not all hits)
cr.MK cancellable
Improve super 3 (counter)
Twelve
Increased health now at 1250 (little more than ken) from 1050.
He can now wall cling for a maximum of 45 frames
After air dash Twelve can still parry
He can now drop down faster to the ground by holding down
His taunt now has much faster start-up, after he turns invisible he is immediately free to move and block. He can now safely go into taunt as long as it has a setup similar to Q. He can now activate his taunt while he is in x-copy.
Dives are safer and have higher priority.
Increased walk speed.
Better damage all around.
Sean
Increase priority on all of his special moves
Sean kicks are safe now act similar to Dan’s in sf4 short -1 forward -3 roundhouse -5 on blocks. Knockdown on hit.
He can successfully combo from his cl.HK and s.HP into DP on all characters.
DP returned to how it was in second impact. (He can no longer be thrown out of its startup for one)
Tackle is now unparryable and does significantly more damage.
After the rebalance as some future goals (note most likely will never happen)
Every character has their own unique stage with the new stages taken from second impact eg: Oro would have his cave, Twelve would have Necro lab stage.
Inclusion and rebalancing of Gill and Shin Akuma these characters are in the games files already just not playable or balanced.
Tools I’m using to mod.
PALMOD
X-COPY
HxD Hex editor.
oh I forgot about this thread. I don’t agree with most of what you wrote but eh. I doubt whatever I wrote three years ago was particularly smart.
all I can think of at the moment is I wish all the short characters were a little taller when crouching. I hate that shoto far strong whiffs over Chun and the twins heads!
oh and no move should be punishable on hit. that’s pretty silly.
Meh, I’ll bite. As a Remy player, I’d say let’s give his moves more stun without have to taunt and make him just a bit faster (and make his low Forward decent!)
Well i’m currently modding Third Strike and adding and trying different stuff and wanted opinions on my changes and possible other changes. I honestly forgot I made an account and when I went to make the above post (after reading through the majority of this thread) was actually surprised. Hence why the 2 year gap.
give remy a real fucking sweep.
if remy had ryu’s sweep he’d be dope.
give him the donkey kick thing from sa3. i don’t know how it’d be useful but it looks rad.
crmk being cancellable is just dumb. he’s not a shoto, get over it. a sloth can hit confirm low LOV, there’s no need for crmk to do the same thing.