What will this change? So now, you will have better chance trying to land it randomly in match?
Except the damage nerf on SA2, all your Chun suggestion are bad. You’re tweaking the bad parameters of the moves.
And you can’t remove any kara unless you want to add some char specificity in the game engine which is just dumb.
For Alex, you already can’t be thrown out of PB, unless you’re talking (and i’m pretty sure you are) about its startup which is also a dumb suggestion.
Her sweep pushes the opponents so far back that this wouldn’t even change a thing. If anything, it would only make it even easier to punish with Chun’s SA2. Her cr.MK reaches quite far so adding a couple more recovery frames on it wouldn’t change anything. And “fast recovery” is the last thing on the list regarding her b.HP. Delete her karathrow? Do you know how karathrows work in this game? Like ESN said, that 15% damage decrease to SA2 is probably the only sensible thing you’re asking for, but even then what about her options afterwards?
So you’re saying make his normals charge up less meter, or have him just build less meter no matter what(like hits/throws/blocked moves)? Sure it’d make Geneijin harder to charge, but it drags down Yun’s playstyle a lot.
Why?
WHY? They both have terrible recovery anyway, and if you can parry Urien’s EX Tackles, you can sure as hell tackle Q’s EX Dash Straight. EX Low Dash catches enough people and look how slow it takes to connect that.
You’d might as well just say “Take Hugo out completely”. I can kinda understand the gripe about SA2 not connecting fully from far range, though. “Cannot be thrown out of Powerbombs”? Hugo can get thrown out of fuckin’ Gigas Breaker. Why should Alex get any special treatment for a regular special?
Remy can already cancel Flash Kick into SA. Cold Blue Kick has its purpose as both a poking tool and a juggle move. And I don’t get why cr.HK needs to have something like that. That doesn’t sound like a good enough tradeoff for an unsafe sweep.
He can already do this. In fact, I’m surprised people don’t ever bring up the fact that Necro actually has below-average health(the same as Chun, Remy and Sean).
He already has more than one. And again, people don’t seem to bring up this fact much: Twelve has even worse health than Chun, Sean, Remy and Necro.
Let’s just keep him bad. It’s obvious he was never meant to be a serious character; it’s like saying people are mad because Dan’s low-tier all the time.
I wish there was a way to make Twelve not horrible fight against
seriously, that match is not fun
That’s more a character design flaw than anything. It’s been brought up time and again: he just doesn’t flow well in 3rd Strike. Kinda like Viper in SF4…if Viper never got good and she was stuck in low-tier hell like the first few months of Vanilla.
I’ve never understood this “doesn’t flow well in the game” What does that mean? Is it just a synonym for being a shitty character? Because both Viper and Twelve could be regarded as such.
A friend of mine has been taking quite a liking to Twelve as of late, but we both agree that there is something immediately off about his character design in 3S. I’m used to him now but he seems better suited for Darkstalkers. The exaggerated squash, stretch and morphing animations, the playstyle w/ instant air dash and poke game all seem to give a different feel than the rest of the 3S cast. However, I have no grips against him and I love watching talented Twelve players do well.
In terms of a Twelve rebalance I’m not ashamed to admit I don’t know the first thing that would make him a viable mid to high tier character. A health boost would be nice and maybe create more hit confirm set-ups to land a SA. I think that could be a strong start but really in terms of normal tweaking or damage/recovery on certain moves. I’m unsure of what would make him a good character.
In fact many of the things I would like to see in terms of a rebalance would be subtle. I’d like to see them work on things like altering the characters stamina ex. Ken having 1200 and Ryu having 1120. Why on earth does Ken more stamina than Ryu? His million plus hit confirms, great recovery, Jinrai, and super damaging combos were not enough? Although these characters stamina rating are not overly dramatic in difference, it’s things like these decisions that make me scratch my head a little.
I would even go as far as tweaking some of the taunt attributes for some characters. As a Q player my whole goal beyond actually winning a match is revolving my game around safe and situational times to taunt to gain defense boosts. Many decisions have to be made as to whether or not I go for extra damage and maintain pressure or taunt instead. It’s bothersome to me to know that Chun-li has a taunt variation that boosts her stamina to 1400. I know it’s rare but for a match that is such a defensive grind it’s a really troublesome thing to know I gotta knock off an extra 200 some points of damage if that taunt comes out.
Beyond that I would like to see some characters supers fully connect. Although it is rare Q’s SA2 drops from time to time as if landing it was not hard enough you loose a big chunk of damage. Alex SA2 whiffing entirely after the first hit is lame and needs and vaccuum effect this is so players don’t have an eternity to decide on how they wanna punish him. Or even increasing Remy’s stun gauge would help him. Small things like that would really help out some low tier characters. Handing out a nerf bat and changing the way a characters being played is not always the answer. But I think if there are subtle tweaks it could help out the roster on the lower end and not anger the community greatly.
So if a character’s gameplay mechanics differs so widely from the rest of the characters in the game, he doesn’t fit in?
Depends on the game, but it doesn’t necessarily have to mean the character is bad as a result. Look at Gill. They gave him a ton of overpowering nonsense and it’s obvious he was made to be as broken as possible. Yun in AE also feels like he didn’t fit in with the rest of the game. Same with Seth(but in Seth’s case he WAS originally a boss char).
Putting my own feelings aside regarding Twelve, I do honestly think he’s just overall flawed. Even then, I’ve seen some amazing Twelve players persevere and make it really far in tourns. Yamazaki managed to reach Tsuwamono in the Danisen rankings, something not even MOV Sean could achieve.
Yeah, I don’t understand. I think Twelve is just a garbage characer in a good game. It’s not like the game or it’s mechanics makes him bad, he doesn’t have anything predictable or whatnot that you can parry with ease for example, he just suffers from crappy everything. I still think he’s worse than Sean.
Perhaps I’m misinformed, I pulled the stamina stuff off of eventhubs (first thing with a google search), which I guess need some updating. I do really think Ken’s stamina should be lowered (not a ton mind you). If we are talking hypothetical re-balance I don’t think it’s that’s a tall unrealistic order. Let him keep all his other junk and don’t lessen him in terms of options.
Does Chun have to complete the taunt in its entirety? Or is there a cool down where even if she is hit she effectively receives the boost? Could she not land one say after a successful SA2?
Let’s be clear when I encourage some supers to have a vacuum effect (nothing extreme) I do not mean all of them. In fact the vast majority of them are absolutely fine. But let’s face the truth, SA’s like Q’s or Alex’s hit they should hit in their entirety. One hit and the character falls out or does not receive the full extent of the damage cheapens the super and it’s effectiveness. Especially if the opponent is lined up for a punish. Where was the reward for landing your super? Every character earns their super and if they happen to land that super it’s rewarded. No matter how one perceives the imbalance or effectiveness of the super.
If we are talking about leaving things like Ken’s SA3 and Chun’s SA2 untouched within the game (which I am) then there should be things about other supers that make them just as effective. Whether your idea of balance is reliable hit confirms, consistency, or universal use. Everyone should have something beneficial and dedicated.
Don’t get me wrong I like my game the way it is and I am not pining for huge nerfs like other board members. If we are going on “what ifs” I think that is a semi realistic approach no?
give ryu strong->fierce target combo.
BROKEN AS FUCK.
(are you reading this Flare)
Eventhubs is a terrible site. How do I know it’s terrible? It rips info from other websites and STILL manages to get the info wrong!
Lowering Ken’s stamina…it could work, but I dunno.
If anything, I’m surprised nobody ever brings up Makoto’s stamina. She has the highest out of all the females, and has as much as Ryu and Ken, and yet she dishes out bursts of damage and stun almost as good as Akuma.
I’m not exactly sure when the boost takes place, but potentially eating a Dash Punch->Super from Q is not worth boosting stamina to 1400…not to mention that particular boost comes out randomly. There’s a reason that Q players need to know when to taunt: that first taunt will not make up for taking not only a massive combo, but also potentially be in a bad spot.
For the record, I missed saying this but Ken’s SA3 does not vacuum: all of his kicks just reach really far and he travels a pretty big distance inbetween them. Makoto’s SA1 does, however.
Also, that’s just the tradeoff for some supers like Q’s SA2. If anything though, the first hit of SA1 will make ALL of the Super connect. That’s some Shippu Jinrai status there, not to mention it has better invulnerable properties than Shippu.
Let’s make one thing clear: I do understand that Boomerang Raid not vacuuming can be frustrating as shit. However, I also feel that Boomerang Raid itself is a bad Super that should be used sparingly, just like Yang’s SA2.
All the characters have beneficial/dedicated traits to them, though. People just never see it because they like to complain about how “Chun and Yun’s overpowered, nerf the shit outta them”.
That’s fine, and some subtle changes could possibly help benefit the game. I’m just saying I haven’t seen any changes I agree with.
I prefer a logically half missed super cause you’re out of range than some stupid mechanism forcing the game to register an entire super even if you actually hit nothing at some point.
OMG what asshole necro’d this?
It’s not enough these get banned like monthly?
You can find the answer on Page 8.
Just to play the devil’s advocate what changes would you consider? I’m relatively new to the 3S scene, but I know you have been playing awhile and probably have a good understanding of what could benefit rather than hinder 3S’s future. Part of what I most people consider to be a major fault is the weird divide between low tier (Twelve, Sean, Hugo, Q etc.) and the high tier (Chun, Yun, Makoto, Ken etc.) and the shear amount of tools and options they have over the lower end. We know from watching awesome Japanese videos week to week this mentality does not really exist as strongly in Japan. However, it does here and some players imbalance has killed this game.
I’ll have to think about that, because there are a lot of things that need to be taken into consideration when suggesting changes.
I’ve constantly admitted this though: Alex’s SA2 does look like it should vacuum. Why that doesn’t and Makoto’s SA1 does is beyond me.
Safety is a big factor in character strength.
Things aren’t 100% even but they never are. Imagining a possible 3S v.2 is just a waste of time. Who here has the complete system knowledge and experience playing at the highest level to really have the perspective to make those kinds of decisions?
but honestly if you’re not regularly putting up $100 to play in events then i don’t see why balance is at all important. oh no, you lost to chun again. so what? press the play button, put in another quarter, hit rematch, etc. and keep playing. games are about the total experience. the graphics, the music+sound, the story+characters and of course the gameplay.
if all the tournaments lacked any kind of money involvement i don’t think people in the US would care nearly as much. if all it ever was was ranbats and danisen and shit there wouldn’t be such a big stink about tiers.
I’m going to make one last chime in here then i’m unfollowing this POS thread and i advise you let it die also.
This is a 10 year old game.
The ghost has fled the corpse it’s purely a casual only game anymore.
Play for fun because any other discussion is futile and pointless it will never be revisited by devs no matter how many sleepless nights it cause’s you.
Build a bridge and get over it the issue is done,the rubble razed and the ground salted to forever remain fallow.