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You primarily want to turtle gief and stay AWAY from gief lol but if you knock him down a neutral jump roundhouse will beat lariat… i know you have been working on hhs, and in this matchup you need it.
I am aware of what a safe jump is. Perhaps I misinterpreted that as bad reflexes of my opponent. Do not accuse me of deliberately spreading false information on this forum… we’re trying to help each other here.
I play sim and i’m thinking about your argument here and am not really sure what i could do on wakeup to an emptyjump that threatens with ultra 2. aside from having ultra bar and punishing a whiffed ultra 2 with reversal teleport into yoga shangri la. But that is it.
Even so, its pretty damn difficult for a honda to get in on a sim. Sim can pretty much keep honda out with the very long range AA way before moves like b+HK and b+mp ever become options for sim. tough matchup for honda i would say. Although if you get the knockdown… its to the races lol.
Ok, I’m going to push my self out of my rut and start writing character match-ups again.
Who do you guys want me to write up?
Abel. It may not even necessarily be character specific for me but I just don’t understand Abel’s game. between tick into command throw or step kick into my ass being kicked, i’m having a hell of a time.
Claw, Ibuki
Jewelman: Thanks man. I know it’s scrubby as hell, but if I don’t have meter, I don’t know how to beat a jumping fierce from Gief:(
I’ll have Claw done by Friday, and sometimes you can either trade with a well timed standing Jesus Chop meet him air to air with N. :mp: (If he isn’t using U2) or Just Block.
Against gief block the jump in fierce and backdash its tough timing the chop and its not a good trade unless its FTW, i spoke with a vega player and after a non-ex wall dive he CANNOT slash twice and your FA will normally escape his izuna drop
Rose please!
Yes, wtb Rose. High end rose players can be hell for honda.
No rush on this but DeeJay or Cody would be a nice add. DeeJay in the right hands can be particularly hard once he has meter.
*-new
This is how i would approach rose…
if you block a spiral in a string and she doesn’t fadc back, you can punish with jab xx hhs
Fierce hb goes over her slide hit box and she eats 160 for free
*- Jab xx hhs only hits 6 times against rose while she is standing, and you CANNOT link st. hk. You can, however, link the roundhouse if she is crouching.
Roses love to backdash, you can ex hb on reaction. If they like to mash on backdash (i.e. backdash til they’re full screen) pay attention to their dash patterns and get a free fierce hb.
Do not chase rose by jumping or random hb’s or random splashes, her jumping fierce is on the same level as boxers/ryu and isn’t to be messed with unless she’s jumping at you then by all means aa ex hb
-Be careful aa jab hb, her fierce hits really deep (ala claw boxer dictator rufus) you need to get it out early if you do
-If she’s running away (which rose should do in this matchup) you must get comfortable fierce hb’ing through fireballs, not randomly, but actually pay attention to her fireball timing and make an educated decision of when to hb. Risk- eat a fireball. Reward- 160 dmg/ 200 c.h. dmg
*- Rose’s cr. hp is REALLY good, like boxer/guile etc. but it is noticeably very similar to ryu’s, and has potential to beat all of you jump in’s and splashes clean. But if you expect her to down fierce your j. mp, jump from max range j. mp, but don’t press the button. She’ll whiff… MAKE SURE YOU PUNISH THE WHIFF CR. HP. It has like a year of recovery
*-St. HK is a deceptively good poke. Everytime you play a solid rose, you’ll be reminded why. Its range and hitbox is very similar to boxer’s. It can stuff honda’s st. hk/hp very easily as it has better range and is pretty fast. Know the max range if roses roundhouse. When you’re walking up to rose make sure you don’t go walking in blindly to heel to you face. Its good to walk up to her just outside of that range and see if she is going to press it. Remember that when you crouch or press any normal you widen your hitbox. I know it sounds weird but walk up to her and just stand there to see if she presses anything. If she whiffs anything punish it with a st. hk. Beware of the spiral and fireball in this situation. It may seem that rose is air-born (unthrowable), but she is not. You can actually jab command throw the startup of it from really far away, I dont suggest using this as your main way to deal with it, as a mistimed throw by a frame or two ends with you eating the kick.
*-Cl. mk has an air-born frame which makes it unthrowable. A lot of rose players like to walk up to you on your wake up and press it as a c.h. combo setup from baiting a tech or wakeup command throw. Ex hb or any splash beats it clean from point blank. It can stuff all normal hb’s.
-Patience is key (as is with most matchups with honda against fireball characters), the cold-hard fact about rose is that if she really wants to get away from you, she has a lot of good options (like chun), and she is probably going to get away. Respect this fact and you wont give up 500 dmg a round chasing her. Instead of jumping/dashing in and trying to kill her before she gets away and eating all that counter-hit frame trap b.s. dmg. Walk forward and block for a little bit, don’t try to setup some sick command grab, just punish her bs and patiently walk her into the corner. You may have to block 20 fireballs and 30 block strings, but in the end you haven’t lost more than 1/5 of your bar and you have her in the corner where honda can end it in 10 seconds.
-Rose has an amazing throw game, which she is used to mopping people up with, DON’T let her toss you around. Now if you have a complete download on her throw timing, don’t tech her shit over and over again, eventually she’ll get 1 or a c.h. combo from baiting your tech. If you KNOW, and I mean KNOWWWWW that the throw is coming… reversal. Ex hb if you have the meter, lk splash if you dont (or dont wanna use the meter). Not only are you getting the damage, but you’re throwing her out of her element and making her reevaluate what she wants to do to you.
Ultra Selection
Rose U1- Against honda this is by far and away her best option. It is huge damage that AA’s just like sim’s U2 (A PROBLEM!), meaning, if you jump you’re risking eating a full damage/unscaled ultra. If you get caught jumping and she activates U1 DO NOT PRESS A BUTTON! You land 2 frames earlier if you empty jump which might save you from the ultra, and if they’re on their reaction times you’re going to eat the ultra but you wont give them the c.h. damage. U1 also beats headbutt and splash for free, so like I said earlier, be patient and know that everytime you hb or splash or jump you’re risking eating that ultra.
Rose U2- If you’re playing a rose that chooses this ultra, you have the right to laugh hysterically to yourself for them giving up their best move against you, only to gain a little shenanigan that you’re just going to block. I’m sure you guys have seen all the wakeup U2’s, and crossup soul throws with this. Its your responsibility to know the shenanigans that come with that ultra and block them accordingly. Don’t try to hit her out of the ultra if you have a significant life-lead, because it can end up being big damage if you get caught by an orb. Now with that ultra, and if you’re playing in america, the rose is going to wakeup ultra at some point (almost guaranteed if you walk up to them on their wakeup). As long as you have more than 1/4 bar, I suggest walking up to her every wakeup until she burns it.
The 2 most likely scenarios after she wakeup U2’s:
a) The player is a dumbass and slides into you trying to get a c.h. combo or tries to soul throw for a cross up, but since you were the more intelligent player you blocked it, right?!
b) Rose player has a brain, and chills for a second to see how you react to the ultra. A lot of roses do this ultra just to get up for free, and think they’re so clever when they jump back and “get away”. But in all reality, they just burned their biggest damage potential because they were too afraid to block on wakeup. Not only that, if you have a bar and they jump back, punish with a late ex splash before she hits the ground. A lot of times you beat her clean if she’s close enough to get the invincibility of the splash (corner makes this super easy), or you will get a trade which is in honda’s favor imo, depending on how charged her ultra is you may take more damage (not much), but you k.o. that ultra and you’re knocking her toward the corner. Now if the rose doesn’t try to cross you up, attack you, or jump back, she’s probably going to create space by walking back or back dashing. A lot of roses think is cool to throw fireballs at you at this point because they may think you’re “afraid” of the ultra… See Section below for further details.
Leading to Honda’s Ultra selection…
U2- In my honest to god opinion, I think this is a completely garbage ultra that only has 1-2 viable uses in high level play. I know all of you have had the whiff’s and frustrations of the move attributes, but the move to its core is nothing more than a shenanigan. Ya, it’ll work on some people, and hhs facd u2 is dope and all, but its so easily avoidable and most good players aren’t going to get hit by it. And as for punishing with u2, its a decent move at best. The terrible range, along with the fact that you need to buffer the motion in a jump/dash/normal is going to limit the possibilities of when you can actually land the move against a higher level player. Once they change the motion to hcb, reevaluation is warranted on a matchup basis, but until then quit trying to empty jump 720.
U1- I really think that this is our bread and butter ultra, that any honda should use is all matches besides the mirror (unless you’re gdlk, at reaction 720’s in block stun to punish moves that are -3, -2, or -1, then i can see some viable uses i.e. gief using u1).
Back to uses for U1 against Rose…
-Fireball punish! Rose has one of the easiest fireballs in the game to U1 for honda imo. I can’t teach you how to correctly reaction ultra a fireball, it takes time, practice, patience, and serious concentration. But set yourself up for success, dont just stand there with a charge all the time and wait for her to throw 1 because she’s going to whiff some normal to try and fake you out, then you activate and look like a dumbass. Pay attention the whole match, from “FIGHT!” to “K.O.”, know when she is most likely going to throw one. (Its very common for people to throw a fireball after they block a headbutt. so when you get a 3 hb’s blocked in round 1, and she reversal fireballs every time, remember that so when you’re in round 3 and she blocks a headbutt and you see that “reversal” icon pop up under her name, ultra that shit. If you have rose in the corner knocked down, look for the wakeup U2 scenario and walk back to 1/3-1/2 screen to give yourself plenty of space to react to whatever she does. Look for that fireball, and U1… the rose player will be noticeably distraught for throwing such a bad fireball I promise you. At this point she’s probably dead, but if not she has no ultra and you have her knocked down in the corner at bare minimum 1/2 lifebar.
-Jump/whiff soul throw punish!
-A VERY educated reversal. You can think of U1 as a 500 damage ex headbutt… Its not the fastest/highest priority move, and there are a lot of ways around it, but if a every time a rose slides at you and she follows it up with a button (throw, another slide, cr. mp, backdash, ex spiral, fireball, etc.) Go for it! Dont do it every time!! but if she isn’t going to respect the fact that you have that reversal and keep pressing buttons right in your face, blast that hoe for a c.h. U1. Now she’s afraid and will probably try to bait it out next round, and that’s when that command grab comes into play 
A personal rule of thumb I use when deciding to Ultra 1: If you were to throw an ex headbutt out at the situation in question, and you feel very strongly that it is GOING TO HIT because of how your opponent is reacting to you and previous intel you may have from playing/watching a player, it is a legitimate risk to ultra especially when in a comeback scenario.
Other tips for success with U1 as a reversal:
Don’t wakeup ultra (99.999% of the time) as a random coin-flip reversal, only use it to punish RETARDEDLY poor crossup/safe jump attempts
Don’t Ultra every round, unless its a guaranteed hit (i.e. ultra/whiff punish)
Don’t be predictable- Don’t have just one setup for the ultra, people catch on and you don’t wanna be that idiot that gives up match point on the big screen on some stupid ultra setup
THINK! This game is more than just who can press better buttons at the right time, its about knowing when to do the right thing at the right time. Do NOT ever press a single button without knowing the risk-reward. Buttons now, ask questions later is a 1-way ticket to the losers lounge. And as always, when in doubt… block and tech! Reversals are a double edged sword, used correctly and they win you the game, used poorly and you look like a scrub while getting sent to the loser’s bracket.
Complete side-note to all honda players:
I don’t care what the excuse is… YOU MUST LEARN HHS!!! I’m telling you right now, that you will go ABSOLUTELY NOWHERE at this point in the game without jab xx hss. Its his fastest punish, good range, great damage, you don’t need a charge, positive frame advantage on block, great chip, builds tons of meter, and once you get good enough at it you can jab O.S. xx hhs as a footsie tool, where if you dont hit him with the jab you don’t spend 45 freaking seconds whiffing hands as he’s jumping in at you, instead you just whiff a jab. Not to mention the 100 different setups you can have off of hhs on block or hit.
Sry for the tangents, hope this helps you guys! :tup:
*- new
Awesome write-up for Rose, Destruct1ve! I just wanted to add that jab Hands is also one of the best ways to hit-confirm a Super out of any other Super in the game (if you’re like Namameso you can hit-confirm off the first hit of hands), it spaces you perfectly for an empty jump in Ultra 2, plus you can FADC it to Oicho/Ultra 2. Lastly when you’re using it as a blockstring it buys you enough time to weigh out your options and figure out what you’re gonna do after hands ends. Opponent’s jumps? Sumo slam. Opponent backdashes? Headbutt. Mashed reversal dp/Ultra? Block and punish him hard, son.
Vega match-up added. Lemme know what you guys think or if anything else needs to be added.
Destructive: Awesome post
Mr. SNK: Much appreciated:) Any chance of Ibuki also, or were you only doing 1 char?
I’ll see if I have the time, have a tournament on Saturday and need to practice up.
I might be able to Squeeze in Cody/Abel/Ibuki if time permits. Just don’t wanna burn myself out like last time.
The vega one is excellent. Lots of stuff I didn’t know. I have only been playing Honda a couple of months so I really appreciate all the write ups. Keep them coming when you can, I read them all:)
Glad i could be of assistance 
, I forgot some points about rose’s cr.hp, s.hk, and cl. mk, I’ll work on it in the next couple days if SNK doesn’t mind amending it for me on the first post
*Added a couple more points about roses normals
Only important thing to add, you cannot link roundhouse or hands after fierce hhs against standing rose as a general rule. The 7’th hand will almost always whiff, meaning you can do a tight link to crouch jab if you’re close, but know your distances.
Thank you for reminding me! I have no idea how that slipped my mind :tup: