The only thing that bugs me about the 720 into HCBx2 is that nowadays everytime I’m getting a mixup/reset(like from seth or sakura or a “crossunder” from many other chars) I can go for a U2(no matter if the opp is in front or behind me), but if the change sticks I won’t be able to do that anymore 
Of ocurse, if they jump I’m still screwed.
Also I found the 720 easier after some practice(and I go for the same direction no matter where honda is facing).
Technically, they ARE safe on block, they just leave u at a frame disadvantage
no technically they’re not cause they can be punished by command grabs that are 2 frames or less. Unless you meant against guile in which case you are correct.
p.s anybody have any tips on deejay? I’ve only fought a couple online and find them to be harder than Guile, I actually had to go back to using Rufus to beat this one deejay online which is something I only do for chuns.
I just put my foot in my mouth. I was indirectly referring to the Guile matchup but clearly i forgot that there are moves that come out faster than 2 frames >< good catch i dont want to spread misinformation.
just for posterity I suppose, sagat can block buttslam and be able to punish with c.jab xx whatever he wants since the fucker’s tall and buttslam doesn’t hit as meaty
@gutabo: I think you’ll find it made up for with the higher consistency and other new situations where it can be used. Easier commands are almost always better.
i remember before super came out, one of the notes on honda ppl took was that it was harder to do hands. honda isnt played as much as most of the cast, so chances are then and this time, some guy who isnt good at doing HHS or playing him in general, are taking notes.
i dont think honda needs any nerfs, shit theres still stuff that needs to be fixed (ex hands and charging = fail). It would suck if he did get a damage nerf, the only characters hes a problem for are underpowered. I cant imagine how hard chun would be if i did less damage and couldnt go into HHS. =.=
Anyone else thinks that if the U2 is HCB x2 they will change it so your opponent can jump out of it even after the animation (like guys/rogs/ibukis grab ultras)? Kinda makes sense.
not necessarily as rogs ultra is a 720 motion so there isnt really any common denominator there
if they do they’ll successfully make it useless. the whole point is that you shouldn’t allow him to get that close to begin with.
that, and the fact that if they’ve already put in a move (special/normal) before you get the ultra pause, it will successfully hit honda out of the ultra altogether. don’t get me wrong, it’s not easy to do, but you have to be really damned close in order to hit it anyways, and most players won’t let you get that close with honda to begin with. it’s good as it stands now, imo. not too ridiculous, but useful.
input motion has nothing to do with how easy it will be for the to jump out of the ultra, frame data…
Honda’s U2 is a 1 framer, while Rog’s on the other hand… is 5 frames (I believe)… pretty much, Honda’s ultra 2 is pretty much like Gief’s Ultra 1, just with a lot less range.
It’s true, Ultra 2 grab people out of specials and normals because of its fast startup. I’ve grabbed Rogs out of rush punch, Chuns out of sweep and this one time I somehow safejumped a Gen that was doing c.RH (not the sweep but the anti-air) and grabbed him out of that. Empty jump U2 is such a simple, dirty setup hehe.
Yo s1d that is a sick avatar. And to think I was just starting to love his man-baby pajamas costume.
hahahha ^ very true… i too have also grabbed people out of normals, even guile doing his foward roundhouse (upside down kick) while he was in the air.
my reaction when this first happened " … LOL!"
What i was saying is that they may make U2 more then 1 frame because it is going to be an easier motion.You know, to compensate. There aren’t any 1 frame grabs whit such an easy imput in the game atm.That’s where I’m coming from.
Gonna share some things I’ve gathered today playing against a pretty decent cammy player.
I prefer not to try and crouch-tech until I’ve gauged the Cammy player’s skill level, most decent Cammys still have a boner from the Sako Godsgarden vids and will try to use s.mp or a TK divekick to hit you out of your crouchtech, she has approx. 1.5 hours of hitstun off a counter-hit s.MP so its pretty easy for her to hitconfirm (blocked)jumpin, (counterhit)s.mp, c.mpxxspecial or s.mp, c.hp, c.mk if he’s got his combos down. And the TK divekick gives her a free c.lk->c.lp->c.lkxxspecial, the “sako” combo or whatever combo he feels like, you don’t want Cammy in your face because you will either A. Get thrown B. eat a combo C. You block and she comes back at you. Luckily her footsies are shitty just like honda’s so you can try to beat her out there, she’s also pretty easy to anti-air if you’re sitting on meter (you won’t really need super here due to her low health, and divekicks will beat out improperly timed lp.headbutts and s.hp, so I like to spend my meter here)
There’s also some weird spot where a drill kick from cammy is safe if spaced correctly?(not entirely sure but I tried c.lpxxhands and got DP FADC DP’d)
Not sure exactly but a decent rule I started using is the “if you have to guess, don’t bother punishing” Cammy’s a great character in this game but its really hard for her to get in on you if you can slap her around a few times and sit on the lead
Also, lesser (bad) Cammy’s will do that stupid hooligan thing (usually EX lol) and either, mash the shit out of throw in an attempt to catch you standing up and get you on your back, or b. fish for the slide into DP in the corner. Everyone knows you can just crouch and avoid any of the follow ups, but it does get her in your face which isn’t what you want to deal with, if you have the meter, I like to just EX-headbutt her away and continue my down-backing, I tried S.HP and lp-headbutt and got thrown, might be me timing it wrong, not sure.
Anyhow, I hope someone got something from this, I know guys like Sidthesquid, Mr.SNK and others won’t get a whole lot considering this is already a relatively straight forward matchup and is (thank god) in honda’s favor, but Cammy is becoming a lot more popular due to her stupid mixups, all the Japanese picking her up and the fact that (like honda) her damage remained high while vanilla’s top-tier recieved a fat bag of nerfs.
Also, Any advice against dhalsim or chun li? I’m convinced the Japanese tierlist makers either A. Don’t play the game B. give honda a lot more credit than he deserves. we have a lot of favorable matchups but honda/rufus isn’t 5-5 honda/bison isn’t 6-4 and Sim vs. honda feels like 7-3 as does Seth vs. Honda, this might be matchup inexperience considering I’m an online player but I honestly feel honda is high-mid tier or worse considering all the matchups that take the patience of a monk and stupid luck to come out on top.
Well considering the poor range on it, I doubt that they are going to change the frame properties.
Carltwo: If Cammy’s SA (Spiral Arrow) is spaced properly, it’s safe. That’s why you got CSed (Cannon Spiked).
Also, you are 100% right about LP HB and ST Fierce losing to her Cannon Drill. Only EX HB will save you when she’s on top
Her Hooligan throw, same thing. LP HB will lose to her throw every time.
And finally Honda DOES beat Bison. The only non fireball char that actually beats Honda is Rufus. This is also assuming you know the matchup.
Your HHS chip worked wonders against Sim. The cool thing is HHS, c.jab xx HHS works on a standing/crouching Dhalsim so try to tack on as much damage as possible if you ever land a jump in. I prefer to do c.jab xx HHS after the first hands because it allows you to retain a d/b charge and lets you do a special according to how Sim reacts after the second hands (whereas if you finish it off with standing RH all you have is a back charge). For example, if Sim teleports you auto-correct headbutt. If he jumps, you can do buttslam and continue your wakeup games. Finally, if I find that Sim players are doing obvious patterns like following fireball with standing fierce, know that Honda’s own standing fierce done early can beat Sim’s if Honda is outside of Sim’s fierce range. Oh yeah, for Ultras in this matchup I think it’s player preference and skill. If you have sick reactions, you can Ultra 1 Sim’s teleport. Otherwise, if you’re really good at dodging limbs and fireballs and anti-airs and can get in his face, empty jump to Ultra 2 is better. I’ve said this before, Dhalsim players are some of the best at teching throws. If you empty jumped him on wakeup his first reaction would probably be to throw you. If he did teleport on wakeup, what could he do? A standing fierce, that’s it.
What do you do against a Gief? There isn’t enough information on the first page