IIRC, that argument boiled down to NKI saying that regardless of whether you hit or block that you still both have exactly one frame after stun to go for the throw, so why ever block. I forget, but getting hit and blocking a move also may have the same amount of hit/block stun frames, which further fueled his argument.
However, I’m pretty sure that taking the hit may not push you back as far in some cases. If this is true, and if blocking would push you out of throw range, then taking the hit may allow you to still throw. This becomes more important if your opponent has a long throw range than you. You don’t want them to be in a range where they can throw you but you can’t throw them.
Of course, all of this is moot if you use a reversal move instead of trying to counter-throw.
It’s still only a fallback plan though. Most good giefs which mix up which, and how many, normals they do before ticking you to make anticipating on which frame to reversal really tough to begin with. Then, the moment that you show them that you can reversal their stuff expect random non-tick attempts to bait out your shoryu. That said, it’s still a really valuable skill to learn.
Usually when someone stops a tick-throw, they reversed with something. Throw or special. It’s just that the “reversal” message doesn’t come up for throws (basically).
Block Stun lasts a lot longer ONLY from Jump Attacks. Play Gief. Do a Jumping Fierce to an enemy so that your Fierce basically lands on their head (so do it earlier so it’s out and falls onto their head) and SPD right when you land. You’ll grab them. If you do that and they block, you can’t grab them because they are still in Block Stun.
And we’ve all seen the cross-up, walk backwards for a bit, Throw tick. The reason you walk back so far before Throwing because Block Stun is longer. If you HIT the person with the cross-up, you can throw them much faster.
I’m almost positive Block Stun is longer than Hit Stun.
Throws are instant in ST. Most jabs/shorts take 3-4 frames of start up animation before they hit.
If the thrower in within their prespective throwing range they will throw the throwee every single time during the start up frames of the counter jab/short.
Best bet is to reversal throw (if the thrower is within your throw range) or reverse invincible special.
Mash reversal throw is sometimes reliable, but you’ve go to watch out for the mixups a la Cammy or Honda or Ken – they will alternate between doing a throw and doing a high priority reversal type move (cannon spike, jab dp, buttbomb, etc).
SweetJV is right on the money in this issue. NKI proved with his data that hit stun and block stun were the exact same length, which initially discredited sacrifice throwing. However, he couldn’t prove that the knockback from a blocked jump attack was equal to the knockback from a connected jump attack.
In fact, there seemed to be evidence on the contrary, which means that certain characters in certain circumstances may not be in range to get a free throw if they blocked that they otherwise would’ve received if they got hit.
Yea I think it works like this. Say you have Honda and you’re on the left side. So you get knocked down and immediately start holding :l: (back) on the joystick, and the opponent is going for the cross up. At the point in the air where he is directly above you, he now switches to the left side and you’re now on the right, and to pull of a Jab headbutt reversal, you have to immediately push :r: on the joystick (which now becomes back since you’re on the right side), then quickly push :l: + jab. The reason you don’t have to charge again once you switch sides is because you were charing when you were knocked down and it got stored once you immediately pushed :r: on the joystick. Could someone tell me if I’m right? Hope it wasn’t too confusing to follow
Thanks for all the tips guys. Reversal throws plus keeping near the corner against Honda has really worked wonders. Also, getting a bit better at the game and getting better at keeping Honda out of throw range to begin with have helped a lot.
Good thread but still didnt stop me and everyone else in the room getting beat by a Blanka jumping in with LK or MK and comboing that into electricity immediately as he landed for a 2 hit combo. Over and over and over, jumping in and electrocuted. I just couldnt figure a way out.
If I ducked to charge then i was hit in the head and electrocuted as i was crouching. If i took the hit i got immediately electrocuted anyway and knocked to the floor, if i tried to parry the quick repeated jumps meant he was on me again immediately. Sounds easy to get out of but in my few goes i just couldnt get a grip on it with any of my characters, Ryu, Dee Jay, Guile and Dic.
In case i run into this spammer again can anybody suggest a way to get out of this trap with a few characters?
Tried that. As soon as you come out of block stun he his already in the air continuing in a loop.
I mean fair play to him, im just trying to stop a similar thing happening in future and trying to work a way out. If thats the way he wants to play choosing the same character over and over again and doing the same thing over and over then good luck to him.
I tried literally everything. The Blanka jump from the air is just too quick and you cant get out of block stun quick enough to get your anti air normal out. Dic standing HK, Slide, MP,HP all fail. Same with everybody else i tried, especially when trapped in the corner. The Blanka jump happens the instant he hits the floor in a loop. Im sure there is a way but without replicating the thing again i cant think of a way.
