The only request/change that should matter this late into the cycle development
SPECIAL MOVE - Bushin Izuna Otoshi :(the Follow up command of the) Elbow Drop
as a physical striking special attack must meet the requirement of causing physical damage to your opponent’s guard for the sole purpose of placing Guy towards being a more finished/completed character
i feel this is hardly an unreasonable request or expectation simple due to the fact that anything else above this change is strictly seen by the most of the other members of the community is constantly seen as over powered and by some accounts will brake the character. This point can easily be proven if someone were to go and suggest for Guy’s neutral/forward throw to have an optional back throw interrupt/follow up command akin to his old one. But as we know given the fact by whats been now lost and by what is yet next to be taken away by popular feedback, don’t the rest of you guys feel this is best time that this 1 issue of the Elbow Drop to be addressed?
The next question i pose to the rest of you is, how can we get capcom to take note of and act on this omission?
I can tell them at NEC since the loketest will be there if they can fit that in if they haven’t. after seeing that Gouken’s and Akuma’s demon flip kicks do chip, this is definitely something required even if it does like 10 chip.
I said nothing about 0 frame ultra (and if I did, it was obviously said in sarcasm). Rose has a st.MK that doesn’t even look airborne and is invisible to throws - I guess that’s stupid right? IT’s a standing medium and I think her far one is also airborne - where as Guy’s fw.st.HK is damn punishable and to make it work like you’re suggesting, you have to do it from a hefty amount of block stun…or you’ll just get hit by crouch tech or any other button.
You can’t spam it cos it would have huge negative frames on block.
The point is, Guy can’t do **shit **if he suspects the opponent is about to throw him, except for tech, backdash, or jump away or neutral jump and come down 2 years later whereby the throw whiff would have recovered - all in futility. OTherwise, he can just mash light tatsu for petty damage, and risk a HUGE punish if it gets blocked…OR mash ultra…yeah you’re gonna do that?Whereas most of the characters can DP cancel into ultra anywhere on screen, or command throw you…or at least just DP cancel into safety.
My point is, there’s still little to fear against Guy - and if you’re happy having to land 6 to 10 combos per round, to win you matches, then go ahead - while other characters blow you up with 50% combos.
And blood - this is a freaking discussion board - so yeah we’ll voice our opinions about what we think will improve Guy’s chances. You keep going on about what Guy “doesn’t need” like someone put you in charge of how the character is balanced and only you get a say. Step off the high horse mate - none of us here claim to know the most about Guy, or to be the best Guy player - and neither should you.
So why is that I’m not complaining about the things you’re complaining about? I’m not on a high horse but I’ve considered where my character stands and what I can do about certain situations, its called adaption I continue up my game for what my characters has and what my character lacks, if I have to make a hard read and go all out to get someone off me I’ll take it because I’ve grown used to that due to the older games if it’s my best option to do so. Did you watch Dreamhack this past weekend. Daigo hit gamerbee with at least 15 HP Dps knowing what the risk would be if he didn’t get a hit. I stated the 0 frame ultra as a change people requested which isn’t necessary.
Sure Ninja sickle isn’t very usable unless you have people who delay tech (which people do a lot at high level play) but its since then been changed to 9 frames. However you all state this is still unusable… yet everyone does cr.hp still for a frame trap which is also 9 frames. But what you don’t realize, Guy is still considered grounded during this move for 14 frames, his foot is still clearly on the ground. Rose and Cody BOTH are jumping after on the startup of their moves. Guy may be -9 but how many characters can honestly punish this from midscreen? You can’t expect everything to come freely for a character that dishes out at bare minimum 180-220 on a hit confirm depending on your bnb, that will lead to a 4 frame safejump for no meter. On average a punish will be 300+ for 1 bar if you are going for damage (Bushin Chain). You would have to land 3-5 combos to win outside of playing footsies. Most characters don’t even dish out 50% without the usage of 2 bars and likely having to be an FADC or the usage of Ultra/Super. The fear around Guy is having to read what he is aiming to do, which means you as the player has to be unpredictable. Or the fact that you’re a solid player with immaculate defense and strong offensive makes your overall game a threat because you obtain a high degree of patience and resilience.
The problem with voicing your opinions so largely is that you end up being hypocritical on what you’re saying and asking for. You don’t want Guy to be broken or OP, and having a bandwagon come to the character. Yet you want some things that won’t even look correct. If you gave Guy all that you don’t expect him to broken? Or even top tier for free? Granted Guy is a very unseen character but you’re rating him as if he’s bottom 5 without these “necessary” changes. Yet Yun after the AE nerf was still top 10 and they can’t even FADC their DP yet they still throw it out there in situations.
I dont play Guy, nor do I aspire to. I just felt the need to share with somebody the fact that every time I glance past the name of this thread on the recently active list, I read “Gay Ultra SF4 changes” and go to click it hoping it is a fantastic scrub created thread about all new changes to the game which they hate. Multiple times I have been disappointed when I actually read the name a second time.
Is it wrong for me to want Guy his 2nd hit of his TC to have more range so it can be used a bit more liberally. Saw it still missing on stream and it annoyed the shit out of me. Also want the cr.mp back tbh…
Yeah I did watch dreamhack - and those daigo DP’s were not as rash as you might think. He was in winners, and it was early in the rounds where he had full or close to full life, so even if blocked he would still have plenty of life left. Did you watch how he walked up DP FADC’D into ultra to win the whole tournament? That’s the kind of fear factor I’m talking about.
Guy can have full meter, and I can go in on him with **NO **fear,attempt to throw him with no fear, because at most, he’ll hit me with ex tatsu for 170 dmg or whatever that does, and the situation is reset. That’s the point you fail to see.
His walk speed helps his grab game and pokes more only his pokes are good but not great which makes alot of guy players think we need DP FADC.If they wanted to buff guy anymore without making him broken or top ten make his jump have less frames or make Neck Flip -4 on block.
Guy is still has run command to stop jump ins that are too close for far St.hk to stop, he got a really good buff I hear Cr.mp goes forward now so +3 on block with a 8 frame sweep and 8 frame poke would help abit.
Hmm if 6 frames is a mistake, and it was already 4 frames, then what exactly do they intend on changing EX tatsu to? My guess would be either 3 frames or 5 frames. Or maybe they didn’t mean to change it at all? I’d be more than happy if EX tatsu was left exactly as it currently is in AE 2012. And if far st. HK beats Condor Dive clean, then that’s pretty much all I need to confirm how good that move is now. I’ll need to have a play around with cr. MP to see what use I can make of that before I’m 100% happy with all these Ultra changes. But after hearing these new updates and Pedro’s thoughts on the location test, I’m more than happy with how Guy’s future is looking.
They just need to fix those freakin’ new characters hit and hurt boxes, because they all look broken as hell at the moment. Elena’s crouching hurt box seems to be the same as Blanka’s command low profile duck move. It’s ridiculous, there’s gonna be so many things they need to test and iron out before this game can launch. At this rate I honestly think we’ll be lucky to see this game out by Autumn next year, by which time a lot of people are gonna be torn between the new consoles. Unless they’re planning on doing a next-gen port of this game to keep people interested, I can kinda see Ultra dying out before it’s even got a release date.
I’ve had people hate playing against me even when they have the pressure/upperhand on me because the moment their momentum drops, whether it be a reset of the situation or I gain the upperhand, they know exactly what my character is capable of. His threat is that at any given time he can score a HKD and they have to wary of that. Guy’s threat is being capable of unpredictable pressure, you have to get into your opponents mind, make them flustered and cause mistakes and punish largely for it. That’s the fear, it’s a different type and not like other characters because his strategy will always allow him to be in your face but pushing you towards the corner. Also it doesn’t matter if Daigo was in Winners or losers, he was going in with HP DP he’s done it before in Losers and in regular matches. Throwing out a DP in some of the most bizarre locations and connecting with it. He’s been doing that since SF2.
i haven’t been watching anything, does ex tatsu work better as an anti air now? they made it sound like you’ll get more hits consistently which justifies the use of bar. and between that and new st.hk, he doesnt seem in bad shape as far as anti airs go.
and for fucks sake, guy doesn’t need ex tatsu fadc. shut up and go play the other characters that have it if you want that. the game doesnt need to be homogenous with dp fadc and you guys should just accept that blocking+teching well is a key part to playing guy.
Marq Teddy has double checked with ComboFiend, EX tatsu is going back to 4 frames, still possibly receiving some type of hit box buff and/or suction effect to increase effectiveness when used as an anti-air.
Also target combo buff and elbow drop hitting low profile moves has been removed as it was considered broken. So in all those situations where target combo whiffed on shotos, Sakura, Cody, etc. the same still applies. Also worth noting is it also whiffs on Hugo (lol at this!) and crouching Elena.
This sounds like a barely playable test build of the game, I dunno what kind of feedback Capcom were expecting but so far all reports on the new characters are they are a broken mess. Hopefully they step it up before offering more loc tests.
People ask for tatsu FADC so it can be used offensively. BLocking+teching is universal in this game for all characters, as is the DP FADC for most. Guy’s style is not “whacky” for him to be exempt.
I heard combofiend mention twice that down HK is airborne - but I doubt he means its airborne from startup. I asked that it be fully airborne so you can punish throws- even though its a big risk anyway, because if they didn’t throw you but went for a blockstring, you’d get counterhit. This is nowhere near as good as having a DP into Ultra - but at least it would make people think twice before going in on Guy with no fear.
I just dunno if the grapplers would be able to punish it on block with reversal specials. Giefs normal green hand looked fast - i dunno if they changed it.
ninja sickle is more airborne that sounds cool with the buff it already has.I think better footsies would solve guy’s moveset problems vs low profile he be too good maybe?