Gouken Videos

Classic Fighting Games Ultra Street Fighter IV
1141

Yeah you’re right about the hk tatsu and the sweep. The damage difference isn’t as big in an EX Palm combo (although it’s still worth it to me if you EX Palm’d through a fireball because there’s no damage scaling).

But off a backthrow j.mp -> mk tatsu does more damage than just a hk tatsu. That one hit j.mp is something I think every Gouken should do off a backthrow. It’s entirely consistent on all characters as far as I know. It’s not punishable if you mess up the timing anyways. Just want to stress that the j.mp is worth learning, especially if you want to do a sweep for a hard knockdown. 50 damage is nothing to scoff at.

I’m probably gonna sound really mean here but I’m just trying to be brutally honest and help you improve.

[LIST]
[]You know the biggest difference between Wax and you in this set? Wax can jump over your fireballs, you can’t jump over his. Like I was saying before, you need to EX Tatsu or Kongo when he jumps over your fireballs.
[]The way you use the mp/hp fireballs in footsies makes them a liability, not an asset. You can’t afford to throw those fireballs and get hit in the face with hadoukens or sweeps. Good opponents stop jumping into your fireballs. When this happens you need to start abusing Gouken’s lp fireball. When they get a certain distance away I can understand playing charge games with hp/lp fireballs. But when Ryu is at mid-screen don’t do that. Rely on kongo/EX Tatsu to punish people for jumping over fireballs. You had so many opportunities to do this. I mean, I’ll point out specific times if you want me to but there were a lot of them. You did a good job anti-airing him with cr.hp when you got the chance, but that doesn’t mean anything if he scares you into blocking when he jumps over a fireball.

The very occasional mp/hp fireball is good at mid-range but really they’re only good if you do them rarely. Also I know you can legitimately AA people with a hp fireball sometimes on reaction.

Gouken can make it so that every jump is punishable. Don’t let them get out of your fireball traps with something easy.
[]Stop jumping. You took so much damage from jumping at him. A lot of times you even jumped at him multiple times in a row! I know it’s easy to get frustrated versus Ryu but jumping at him is not the answer. Doing a demon flip over a fireball is good but like he showed you he can just jump back fierce to beat your demon flip if you do it raw. (Actually I’m pretty sure you can punish that too with parry -> sweep him on the way down.)
[]I have had a lot of success with EX Palm through fireballs and EX Demon flip -> throw to punish fireballs. These are the tools that help Gouken win the fireball game decisively. EX Palm doesn’t seem to get hit mid-way like the other versions.
[]Don’t be afraid of Ryu’s ultra. He has to almost be psychic with it to catch Gouken because his recovery is so good. Just don’t try charging fireballs when Ryu has ultra. And when you get Ryu in the corner you can do lp fireballs and then do cr.mp xx fireball. Very few people are going to ultra that. If they try to then they’re spending so much time buffering the ultra that you can walk up sweep, throw, or Demon Flip them.
[]Related to the above, when you get someone in the corner just throw lp fireballs. You can punish any way they want to jump out anyways so let them think that jumping is a viable option so that you can punish them for it with kongo/ex tatsu.
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All of Gouken’s strength as a character stems from his lp fireball, his anti-airs, and his ability to punish for massive damage. Everything else is gimmicks or situational.

1142

Thank god I’m not going crazy then, when you told me Vega was 100% I jumped on trials and still couldn’t land it on him. Then got reversed and occasionally landed it on him from the 2P side, still missing a lot though. I could never get it from 1P side either though.

It’s weird :frowning:

1143

haha, pretty much.
i think the major advantage that wax had over me in that set was that he knew what i was going to do more often than i knew what he was going to do.
upon reviewing the set, i was really surprised that i didnt kongo his jump ins more often.
normally i spam kongo.
wax also plays with guyofkaillera though, who is a better gouken than i am.
overall i thought it was a great set to help me study my game against ryu and had lots of good examples of gouken mechanics against ryu for new gouken players.
thanks for your insight!

1144

first to 10 against crazisalvi516’s sagat





1145

props on the vids raunwynn, another hard match up. Still watching the vids now, I was going to say I see why the guy was reluctant to play sagat as I didn’t think he was playing well(wasn’t agressive enough at first imo), but after seeing more matches, I gotta say he’s good.

*watching the 2nd vid now and I see he’s gotten good at anticipating your crouching rh poke with FA and punishing it with ultra. I’m guilty of this sin as well.

1146

[LIST]
[]Here dash tatsu would have won you a round.
[][media=youtube]4usJijgCYUU"[/media], a really good bait is to charge up and then backdash at the last possible moment. This leaves them wide open for anything you want. Even if you’re not sure who started first it’s probably smart to backdash and see what happens.
[]When Sagat say whiffs a TU in footsies and you can’t get a cr.hp combo in time have you ever considered punishing with something like cr.lk xx hk tatsu? And then you could ultra off of it with an FADC if you wanted to.
[]Try to stand block Tiger Knee. It makes many Tiger Knees that would be safe if you crouched unsafe.
[]Look for a meaty TK and be ready to ultra or EX tatsu it on reaction.
[]In my limited experience j.hk and j.mp are better air-to-airs than j.hp. For some reason j.hk works really well for me even though it’s slow.
[]When punishing unsafe TKs it might be better to do cr.lp xx hk tatsu than a normal throw. You can do a backthrow to punish though, the timing is just a little tighter.
[]When people do anti-air focus crap on you empty jump and then ultra. You can also time a neutral jump so that you come down and get a full j.hp -> cr.hp -> ex palm -> whatever. Empty jump throw is great too. Empty jump EX Demon Flip is one ideal safe way to punish. I dunno if EX Palm into focus can get hit out of it easily. Actually that’s something worth testing for me.
[]Very nice job anti-airing with cr.hp.
[]Don’t go for a crossup when you knock them down in the corner. Just throw a meaty fireball and abuse them at close/mid range. You just did all that work to get them in the corner, don’t reverse the situation on yourself.
[]If you smell someone mashing uppercut in your string do a backdash. They whiff if an uppercut comes out and you’re almost always safe if they don’t uppercut.
[]I really think you can punish those jump back fierces against Demon Flip with parry and land and sweep or even just raw ultra when they’re still in the air.
[*]Very nice set in general.
[/LIST]

1147

Given that you tend to try and walk Sagat down to avoid being bullied into the corner, have you tried going totally defensive and in essence attempt to lame him out? Gouken certainly has the tools to be able to do this.

I don’t have any decent Sagats to fight myself to test it out, so would be good to see the results of a defensive approach (even if it doesn’t work in the end).

1148

I really feel like a Gouken with good reaction time to palm/EX Demon Flip through tiger shots can give Sagat a run for his money on the lame game. One psychic Demon Flip in a fireball game even at long range = 40% of Sagat’s health.

1149

you can do that from a little bit farther away, but c.lk and c.hp both start in 6 frames and i hate comboing into tatsu so i am not likely to try that.
i especially hate fadc from tatsu; you have to be close or far, if you are in the middle the ultra whiffs.
if i am too far away to get c.hp xx ex palm, i will usually go for c.hp xx lp.palm, c.hp xx lp.fireball or just sweep and then wake up game.

i block low a lot to avoid eating sweeps and toe taps into fireball.

before the tk hits me?
erm, im 35 years old.
doing anything “on reaction” like that is a stretch for me.
also, i dont really like reversing into ultra or ex tatsu most of the time.
it is too risky.

j.mp is 4 frames, 80 damage, 100 stun.
j.hk is 8 frames, 100 damage, 200 stun.
j.hp is 5 frames, 100 damage, 200 stun.

i think all three are good and reflexively i go to j.hp.
i like the range on j.hk and the speed on j.mp, but j.hp seems to cover the most bases, until you are trying to aa chun li!

normal throw is faster and sets up the crossup demon flip, plus i hate comboing into tatsu.

i think i try demon flip throwing more when they do that.
most of the time i just block but i want to try countering in that situation more often.
most people dont do it that much so it is hard to practice.

sagat is really easy to c.hp when he jumps.
ryu is a pain in the ass.

if you are point blank you cant back dash out of a shoryuken or tiger uppercut, you get clipped.

that sounds right, but most of the time when i demon flip in, i am not doing it to get them to jump back.
i am doing it because i think they are going to get caught fireballing or poking or staring.
it is usually very surprising to me when a player responds to my demon flip that way.
if i think they are waiting for demon flip, i just shoot at them to distract them so i can start demon flipping again.

thanks!

i used to trade fireballs with him a lot more, but he seems to be a lot more comfortable doing that than defending my close attack.
if the sagat is really jumpy, i am more willing to throw fireballs.
that way i can get the hp.fireball to palm.
if he just stands there like a machine gun, fireballing is harder.

there really arent very many good sagats.
he is straight zoning power with very little speed or mix up.
most players seem to have more fun with ryu.
i know salvi doesnt enjoy playing sagat at all.
i bet a lot of people that would play sagat dont because so many people bitch about him too.
its too bad.

1150

Someone do a Fuerte video tutorial, I am thoroughly frustrated with that matchup unless I use a teleport character. Any retard can get on El Fuerte and just splash throw loop my ass to death. More accurately just throw me to death. I can’t backdash, I can’t forward dash, I can’t jump cause I just get hit when I land cause fuerte has no recovery off his throw whiff… I just do NOT get that matchup. What exactly can I do vs his throw? I even got thrown out of tatsu. Shit is ridiculous.

1151

Abuse EX Demon Flip’s invincibility. Also, focus is really good on wakeup versus Fuerte. If you mix up jumping, backdashing, and focus you can get out for pretty free. They can ultra EX Demon Flip probably but you deserve that if you get that predictable.

If you know he’s gonna try to throw you and you just want to get away safely just jump and tatsu out of there.

1152

you have inspired me to make videos of my own Raunwynn =) ill have to look into how to do so.

1153

Nice. I just starting messing around with Rufus a bit and would love to see some videos from you Pistola.

1154

There is no tactic with Fuerte, it’s a pure coinflip. Everyone hates it because it’s just about hoping your char has enough vitality to hold out until either you guess right or the Elf guesses wrong (there’s no real difference) and you put him on the ground and use his lack of vit to win.

That’s pretty much all he even has going for him. He can’t do anything else of note besides hose your combos up with his hitbox, RSF, and that completely asinine ultra. So basically watch the tatsu even more than normal, pray he tries RSF out of a need to increase his own chances of failure, and expect ultra if you dick around on wakeup when he has it and you don’t have time to backjump out of it.

That character is so fucking stupid.

1155

these are a lot of fun to make, share and review.
look up “ezcap” on youtube.
there are lots of instructional videos telling you how to get one and how to set it up.
i spent 13 dollars for the ezcap and then around 10 dollars on extension cords.
the quality isnt perfect, but i am more concerned with gameplay than anything else.

1156

hmm I dont know if I should try it yet seems like there are people with problems getting it to work on win 7 which is what im using.

1157

The Fuerte match boils down to whether Gouken can build meter before he gets knocked down. Gouken can’t do anything without meter to escape Fuerte’s splash mixup. You can punish any blocked splash with sweep and then it’s over for Fuerte though, and EX flip to counter splash and splash grab lands a full combo everytime.

I did a full write up of this a while ago.

1158

Focus is good but why bother with splash when you can just throw the shit out of Gouken. You can’t backdash out of it, can’t forward dash, can’t tatsu, seems like you can’t jump out of it, at least no neutral jump. Your best bet is to guess jump at an angle but even then, whther you jump forward or backwards is entirely up to the Fuerte players since you jump in relation to where he is…

I’m not so sure EX demon flip will allow you to escape a throw, you still come down next to them and Fuerte still recovers faster then you and behind you.

Tatsuing out will probably be no solution at all since Fuerte can just run you down given the god awful recovery on landing.

Just jumping is no solution to the throw cause he just guacamole leg strangles you or whatever it is called… It’s really frustrating.

Can you explain that for me? If he splashes and I EX demon flip I get the free combo, I get that, but what about splash grab? Are you saying the grab?

1159

Forward Habanero Dash > Fajita Buster.

Ex flip dive kicking both of them gets you a free combo if he lands in front, which he will because the flips collision box stops him from crossing over. He’ll only cross over if he overshoots the crossup, so it’s win-win.

1160

[list]
[]You can backdash Fuerte’s throws, the timing is just tight because they have 6 active frames and backdash has 8 invincibility frames.
[]Fuerte’s throw does have a decent amount of recovery, it’s just not enough to punish with a jump-in.
[*]Jumps never get auto-corrected and Fuerte always recovers a bit backwards. Just jump backwards. There you go, you’re out. If you’re worried about the Guacamole Leg Throw just don’t neutral jump.
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Honestly I don’t see the problem.