Nice whoring of jump back RH in that vid. Looks like Sanford didn’t expect him to try it on wakeup so much.
who is this shrine guy i use chun i always thought gouken needed something a lil extra until i saw this guy
That Shine vs. Sanford video makes me want to experiment on my match-ups with Gouken’s early j.HK more. It seems effective, but it’s hard to tell if it’s because that kick is simply beating out a lot of Akuma’s attacks, or if it’s because Sanford was just using the wrong moves at all the wrong times.
the complete shine at battlefield 9:
shine’s gouken vs sanford’s gouki
shine’s gouken vs damdai’s ken
shine’s gouken vs lincoln’s gouki in the winner’s finals
shine’s gouken vs sanford’s sagat in the grand finals
man shine, you steamrolled to the grand finals.
not many have done so well in their first major tournament at 15 brother.
well done!
im sure chris telling you not to be nervous helped ease the nerves…
:arazz:
edit: you guys should subscribe to frameadvantagedotcom on youtube and visit their website.
their work is really great.
Hey guys I’ve started recording all my matches and posting some up. Havnt been able to make any tournaments and dont know anyone decent so its just G1 matches…
I’m looking for brutally honest criticism. I’m trying to get my Gouken tourny worthy.
Don’t mash parry. I can literally hear you mashing. Also, don’t parry often in footsies, especially against Abel, who wants to throw your ass. If you do, it should be a low parry and be very rare. If you were trying to do a parry FADC combo, don’t mash it out.
Off a backthrow I suggest you learn the j.mp -> cr.hp demon flip reset. The 50 extra damage is very nice.
Demon flip setups are kinda free on Abel, at least on wakeup.
You’re refering to the end of round 2 against moneyfactor? I was going for parry -> super. What you hear is me buffering the super, but when I finally get the parry, no super(cause of the outburst).
That’s my favorite finisher and I’m very guilty of making mistakes trying to get it. I’ve thrown away a few rounds(like that one) trying to force the parry…
Against shotos and other chars that use c. mk alot I do use low parry. Abel not so much.
Will do.
Did you happen to check out any of the other vids or just that one on the front page?
Kikuichimonji, why is it bad to mash kongo?
whatever gets your move out when you want it is the way to go.
street fighter 4 is the way that it is, pretending otherwise doesnt make you a better player.
i have missed plenty of kongos that i would have gotten easily if i mashed.
mashing is a valid tactic in this game against block strings.
a mashed kongo is not quite as good as a mashed dp or pile driver, but it can stop the pressure if your decision is sound.
mashing pisses a lot of people off because it works and they dont think it should.
if something pisses people off, it is probably a useful technique.
VVhite, i noticed that you did a (df dive kick > c.hp xx super) at 1:16 in the first game.
you want to avoid comboing into super like that.
i dont know if it was an accident or not, but an ex palm there would have barely reduced your damage and left you 3 bars.
(jn.hp > c.hp xx ex palm > mp. palm) = 424 damage for 1 bar (2 ex left for blocked ex palm or for fadc ultra)
(jn.hp > c.hp xx ex palm fadc > mp. fireball > lp. palm) = 454 damage for 3 bars and you get to pretend you are shine.
(jn.hp > c.hp xx ex palm > dash > hk tatsu) = 463 damage for 1 bar (2 ex left for blocked ex palm or for fadc ultra)
(jn.hp > c.hp xx super) = 481 damage for 4 bars (not hit confirmable, dangerously punishable)
(jn.hp > c.hp xx mp. palm xx super) = 491 damage for 4 bars (hit confirm on the super, 2 bars left for blocked mp. palm)
if you use a technique that produces accidental supers you want to adjust that out of your execution.
if you do it on purpose, you can see the arguments against it.
My matchups against decent Akumas was limited, but here’s how it looked to me:
jb.rh has a short shelf life because of the startup and the crap active frames. For reference, Ryu’s jf.mk is 6 startup and 6 active. jf.rh is 7 and 7. Which is total bullshit, but that’s another story. Akuma there is the same on startup, but 3 active for his crossup j.mk, which makes it Kongobait – if you want to hit with it at all, it has to come out late on a grounded opponent and way earlier if you want o hit a jumping one. Sanford likely knew this.
Akuma’s BS starts with his DF, which is a guessing game. Palm eats kongo since it armorbreaks, but it requires tighter timing and it seemed to me that nearly any of Gouken’s usual AA options beat it. cr.fp, and cl.hk both. cr.lk into throw is interesting, but the recovery on the palm doesn’t guarantee it. Basically, the power of the palm is the quick recovery and AB.
The divekick lasts until you land, but has a visible startup. So if you time it tight it can also be kongobait. Delay it though, and Gouken’s jb.rh seemed to eat it for lunch. Emptyjump to bait kongo for throw whiff, same story.
Akuma’s DF throw was interesting. Kongo of course is hosed by it. Eats cl.rh because you’re standing. cr.fp eats it, but it’s a reset. cr.lk into throw, possible but iffy. But because it’s a throw, jb.rh beats it.
In general, to me it seemed that you want to use it as early as possible in a jump if you’ve decided to use it at all. As far as i was concerned, the only purpose the move had was as a pre-emptive “stay the fuck off me” move. The passive hitboxes are weird and relatively out of the way, while the active ones swipe whatever they’re sticking out. Pretty much the same reasons it sucks as a jumpin compared to jf.fp.
It’s actually an important part of Gouken’s game as it relates to the Kongo, and how the other person reacts to it, at least in the Akuma matchup. Otherwise, if they’re unfamiliar and they hold back either waiting to see a kongo or try to emptyjump, that kind of j.rh is really nice. If they do it later, it’ll most likely stuff the jb.rh, but be kongo bait.
I bet it was an accidental super… It’s ALWAYS an accidental super. lol
It’s gotten to the point where I’ll just burn meter for the sake of burning it, to not have 4 bars. I’m always getting that damn super off c.fierce. :annoy:
what do you think it is about the way that you do (c.hp xx palm) that produces super?
i have seen lots of people complain about it but it never happens to me.
Yea it was accidental… but it looked cool, so I kinda want to take credit for it:confused:
it has hella range and it kept akuma from getting close in on my too often
Heh, it’s kinda entertaining–on the akuma forums, the consensus was that Sanford just didn’t play the match right and was unfamiliar with the matchup. Personally, I think that’s kind of a bs excuse–Sanford Kelly is Sanford Kelly, even if he was unfamiliar with the match-up, there’s a certain level of skill required to take him on and win like that.
Mad props Shine, get your throw techs down and you’ll be a beast.
I think the notion that Sanford didn’t know that matchup is ludicrous. What nimrod said that?
The kid did great especially with a pad, but Gouken v Akuma is one of the rare decent matchups Gouken has. Even without the wakeup shenanigans which Gouken can sort of handle for a change, the vit difference means Gouken’s fpxxsenku damage actually matters, ultra is brutal, and the fireball game is in his favor.
Whoever said that IS a nimrod. Sanford knew the matchup… he was using Gouken (a damn good one) for a while
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He should have been abusing demon flip punch and he wasn’t. Regardless he knows what Gouken can do since he played him for a bit. It’s not like Akuma is 100% reliant on one thing to defeat Gouken, but he could have made it easier on himself. In short, he could have played it better by abusing demon flip punch.
In the end he went to Sagat and took care of business. It’s not like those Akuma/Gouken matches were landslide victories.
Actually, mashing only works online. Offline people hear you mashing and start blocking and punish your random shit (and faking mash is not worth the effort). That’s why it’s a bad habit, because SF4 has such huge punisher combos that you can’t afford to be baited. Also, if you mash out EX Palm for example you can get a lot of accidental supers. The only way I know of to be sure is to do the original f,d,df motion for the EX Palm. Mashing also destroys sticks with sensitive Sanwa parts very quickly.
Was just watching dudes mash in a Japanese arcade yesterday in Fukuoka. I chuckled to be sure. Also sneezed my face off when I got back to my mother in laws thanks to all the smoke inhalation 
I got to watch Cantona play. Not sure who else I was watching since he was the only one with a name in English.
it has been so long since i played in an arcade that i completely forgot about how much information you get when you are standing next to someone, and how much misinformation you can give!
that aside, mashing kongo is fine because you wont get anything accidentally.
mashing hard enough to break a stick is pretty lol.
chris hu said that daigo was mashing uppercuts during peoples’ block strings during the money matches at seasons beatings 4.
it wasnt a joke.