Good partners for Dormammu?

Classic Fighting Games Ultimate Marvel VS Capcom 3
401

A quick writeup of my intended UMvC3 team:
Firebrand (???) / Dormammu (Dark Hole) / Morrigan (Dark Harmonizer)

Firebrand really looks like a character that doesn’t need assists. He has good air control, high priority attacks due to his speed, a small hitbox, and a lot of maneuverability. He can create his own cross-ups from the sky even (OTG fireball, air dash behind your opponent; yes, it works). He can also make use of excess meter very well, and I might even be able to keep him in a permanent state of Luminous Body thanks to Dark Harmonizer. Firebrand should DHC to Dormammu just fine. At worst, he can just stall in the air a lot while building meter via Morrigan. Firebrand’s primary job is to snap in characters that can cause problems for Dormammu and kill them, whether that be a character with a beam assist or a beam hyper.

Dormammu is, of course, the core of the team. With Dark Harmonizer, he can throw out all the Stalking Flares he wants. This is difficult to get through, as those who have played me know. Like Firebrand, Dormammu will be doing a lot of turtling and delaying, because time is on my side thanks to Dark Harmonizer. Honestly, I’ve done nothing but dance in circles around opponents with Dormammu while calling Dark Harmonizer, and it’s hilariously difficult to counter. Part of the core synergy of the team is that in the event I throw out an unsafe Stalking Flare, my first and third characters are both safe DHCs: Firebrand goes into Luminous Body and blocks while the Flare hits through my opponent’s attempted punishment, and I can DHC into Morrigan’s into Shadow Servant or Astral Vision, depending on what my opponent attempted (Shadow Servant beats like…everything, and because she pops out in front of your point character when DHCing, it actually covers the full screen!).

Morrigan is primarily here for Dark Harmonizer, no doubt. However, this is a meta-strategy going here. I really do want my opponent to blow X-Factor to survive the Stalking Flare spam, because that means I have the threat of XF3 Morrigan plus Astral Vision Soul Fist spam. There isn’t much to say here beyond that, since an anchor is an anchor, and anchors are all about XF3, DHCs, and their assists, and I have covered that for the other characters. What makes Morrigan reasonable as an anchor, though, is that she is one of the safest zoners in the game thanks to flight-cancels, and I really appreciate that about her.

In closing, I get my demon-themed team, and I have a neat side theme of Guardian/King/Queen that has always enchanted me for some reason.

402

I love your game plan to a certain extent. you are purely hoping you are not fighting a team with strong invincibility frames or teleport games. your stalking flares are actually very easy to counter and the DHC’s, while safe, are burning meter just for 1 stalking flare in those situations.

I do love the the idea of an assist that is pure meter builder then spamming all of hells soul fists just to piss off the competition. If we ARE talking about Astral Vision in lvl3 then this mean you have 0 assists for this strat. also meaning you have nothing saving you from the new super armor Hypers or any high invincibility Hyper ( Spencer, VJ, Cap’n , HA-DOu-KEEEEEEEEN!, Nemesis, Maximum Vergil and Deadpool, just to name a few). I’m not saying your character selection is poor, just your anchor lvl3 strat seems to be minimally efficient.

I also would like to point out that the new Stalking Flare looks sexy as frack and I can not wait to see what followups we can pull off now that the recovery is about half of what it was.

403

FYI, I use this team now, but instead of Firebrand, I use Phoenix on point. In the vast majority of my matches, no one gets past Dormammu.

I do recognize that certain characters laugh at this, like Dante. However, those characters are the ones I burn X-Factor on the moment I touch them. Then the rest of their team is free. Very few people use three teleporters. Wesker’s teleports are not very good at getting him past Stalking Flare for a punish. Obviously, with UMvC3, there are now two more teleporters in the game who are very popular. Against characters I can’t zone effectively, I tend to rush and just burn 4 bars on level 3 + Chaotic Flame. I DO have the meter, you know. :wink:

It’s not uncommon for me to put 3-4 Stalking Flares in play while also using Dark Dimension twice in one match if Phoenix doesn’t get a lot of work done.

Anyway, you are incorrect that I am “burning meter” for the Stalking Flare safety. This is generally what happens:

  1. Dormammu uses Stalking Flare.
  2. Magneto (opponent) uses Magnetic Shockwave.
  3. I DHC to Morrigan’s Astral Vision.
  4. Morrigan blocks Magnetic Shockwave and takes very little damage.
  5. Magneto eats the full Stalking Flare, and now has to face Morrigan plus her clone, which is not easy for anyone.

Net effect:

  1. I burnt two meters and got full damage from the first and potential utility from the second.
  2. Magneto burned a meter without doing any significant damage, and took damage as well.

Hypers that counter both Astral Vision and Shadow Servant are very rare…I’m not even sure if they exist, to be honest, assuming a full screen’s length.

Stalking Flares are not easy to counter when done properly. If you throw out a naked Stalking Flare, then yes, it’s very easy to counter and unsafe. That is not what I do. I need only land one single blocked Purification, and then I cancel into Stalking Flare. So, let us look at the frame data:

Purification can be canceled on its first active frame and will still come out in full. Realistically, I don’t cancel until about the 10th frame, though, because I need some minor visual to be sure it touched my opponent; though sometimes I just throw one in front of Dormammu to create a “safety wall” and cancel immediately, if I’m facing a heavy like She-Hulk, who has no counter.

Purification has 23 active frames, 11 recovery frames, and is +2 when guarded. So, depending on when I cancel, my opponent is in blockstun for anywhere from 36 to 0 frames, depending on how slow I am with the cancel. Stalking Flare’s total startup time is 35 frames. So, unless I really screw up, my opponent is going to have maybe 10 frames to do something before Stalking Flare is on the screen. That’s not even enough for a Shinkuu Hadoken to come out, and by then I can DHC into Morrigan.

My methodology is very, very safe.

Plus, if I really want to be a dick, I can bait a hyper. So, for example, I use Stalking Flare, then Ryu tries to “punish” with Shinkuu Hadoken. I X-Factor, he gets hit, and then I Mass Change H on top of him for a full combo and kill the character. Or, if he’s closer and I don’t have time for that, I can at least connect a Chaotic Flame, and Stalking Flare plus Chaotic Flame at XF2 damage will at the very least leave him in a very grim state. I try not to burn X-Factor though, because Morrigan really likes it.

Morrigan’s Shadow Servant actually beats Bionic Arm, Mach Speed, and definitely the other hypers you mention, though Shinkuu Hadoken will win if it’s full-screen, since Shadow Servant only goes about 80% of the screen’s length. I think you perhaps do not know much about Morrigan and the massive 29 invincibility frames Shadow Servant has. Plus, Astral Vision is becoming significantly faster on startup in UMvC3, which means I can cancel mistakes Berserker Charge-style.

Against some of those opponents, I wouldn’t even want to spend ground time against them. I would much rather zone out Nemesis by having four meter-sucking fireballs on the screen, for example, than rush him. Even if I did rush him, with Morrigan’s clone plus her, j.S hits 6 times. It will break through any armor below Sentinel’s launcher without worry.

I am also very excited about the change! If the recovery is really around half, then the number of characters that can respond to my strategy begins to fall dramatically.

Thank you for your criticisms and reflections. I always enjoy discussing these ideas and how they pan out in reality.

404

It is very refreshing to be given such clean facts and situational uses like you have just given. I also had no idea that Astral vision had 29IF!!!

I don’t think I have ever had a Magneto rebuttal with a MS before, GS on the other hand very often.

You are correct about me not having a vast amount of information about Morrigan, I rarely play against her and have yet to put more than 10 serious matches in with her. But, you have opened my eyes as to what scary things Dormammu and Morrigan can do together. the fact that she almost negates all the super armor with such ease does intrigue me, as Dormammu has an issue with close up super armor without the help of assists. this weekend I am absolutely going to play with Morrigan as an Anchor, thank you Karst for opening my eyes on her value to Dormammu.

I currently run Dorm/DPool/Dante ( I call them “The Immortals” cuz none of them stay dead). and am most curious if I should be dropping Dante for Morrigan now. and potentially Dpool for Vergil.

Vergil having insane reach and an assist that is almost full floor coverage that looks like it can delay the drop from the wall bounce of Dark Matter( giving a canceled teleport time to emerge in close quarters). not sure what the Stun Decay or scaling will be but I sure it wont be too much. I also love his teleport as they allow for more option than not having them.
-ATM DPool is my way of a mid-ranged hit confirm to launcher( quick work not only hits low but spins the enemy towards you quite a bit) while also giving me an easy combo extension OTG. and DPools keep away game is insanely strong as his rush game is above average.

405

Maybe I typed it wrong, but it’s Shadow Servant with 29 IF, not Astral Vision. Astral Vision is pretty slow, but it’s being made a lot faster in UMvC3. I can’t really use it in MvC3 unless it counters a slower hyper like Magnetic Shockwave or Hyper Sentinel Force.

Enjoy! Keep in mind that Morrigan is a low tier character. She is best as an anchor, but she’s still just not a very good character in this game. She is getting a huge list of improvements in UMvC3, but we’ll see if that’s enough yah?

Dante does offer that really nice Jam Session (I assume you use it for air control), but what always got to me was that it can only enforce space, not really create it, and you have to use it pre-emptively. Though in UMvC3, you can Dark Matter, call Jam Session, then cancel Dark Matter into Purification, and that’s a neat combination. Personally, when I used Dormammu/Dante for a few weeks, I called Jam Session while teleporting constantly - it’s so hard to respond to.

None of Vergil’s assists blow my mind just yet, but we haven’t really seen them in action much.

And Deadpool is becoming much, much stronger in UMvC3!

406

I play Dormammu (Dark Hole) / Wesker (Low Gunshot) / Doom (Plasma Beam).

Dormammu works quite well on point, IMO. Plasma Beam and Mass Change make for fun shenanigans which I can combo off of from anywhere on the screen.
:a2:(Plasma Beam), :rdp:M (Mass change M), :m:, :s:, :uf:, j.:m:, j.:m:, j.:h:, j.:S:, :a1: (Low Gunshot), Dash forward 2x, c.:m:, :s:, j.:m:, j.:m:, j.:h:, j.:s:, :srk: :l:/:m: (Purification :l: or :m:, whichever is appropriate), :qcf: :l::m: (Chaotic Flame).
It does 550,400 damage, which is slightly less than even his most basic b&b, but it has the advantage of building slightly more meter than it spends.

In the corner I can pull off an OTG with Wesker’s gunshot and a second one with flame carpet + plasma beam into Chaotic Flame, doing around 750k of damage and actually gaining a solid 1,5 meter.
c.:l:, c.:m:, :s:, j.:m:, j.:m:, j.:h:, j.:s:, :a1: (Low Gunshot), :qcb::s: (Flight), j.:h:, j.:s:, Land, c.:m:, :s:, j.:m:, j.:m:, j.:h:, j.:s:, :a2: (Plasma Beam), :df::h: (Flame Carpet), :qcf: :l::m: (Chaotic Flame).
734,800 damage while building 1,5 bars of meter.

I discovered you can follow up corner Chaotic flame with an air throw for an easy reset, or even a snapback if your opponent has Phoenix or an annoying assist character.
Probably nothing new, but I thought I’d contribute anyway. :slight_smile:

407

Definitely looking forward to putting Ghost Rider and Dorm on the same team, NOT just because of the flaming heads. I’ve been playing Dorm since day one of MvC3 and Ghost Rider looks like he’ll complement him well.

408

I’ve been playing Dorm on point since a little after MvC3 came out, and I’ve been wondering:
If I have Akuma/Doom 2nd and then Hulk as anchor, what could I do to make the most of that team?
Dorm running Hole, Hulk running AA Gamma Charge, and Akuma running Tatsu/Doom running butterbeam/missiles.
From my experience, I tend to play keepaway with Dorm, and if/when he goes down, I just rushdown…
What can I do to stop getting last in tourneys with this team?

409

If you could share videos of you playing, we might be able to spot some problems in your play.

Hulk is a very bad anchor. He’s not good at opening characters up, he can’t make good use of excess meter, etc. Akuma, on the other hand, is a fantastic anchor, among the best in the game.

So, I would put your team order as:
Dormammu/Hulk/Akuma

or

Hulk/Dormammu/Akuma

My personal preference is to have Dormammu second, but I think an argument could be made either way, since Dormammu really does like that AA assist.

If you’re running Doom, then I think it becomes more feasible to make Dormammu your anchor, because Doom is only a so-so anchor. Just don’t put Hulk there, haha.

410

Yeah, I was thinking of moving Hulk out of anchor to the 2nd slot, irregardless of his XF level3 being godlike… Anyway, most, if not all
of the videos on YT that have me playing MvC3 are old, so I would have to play someone online who frequents the Dorm forums, so that
they know what I’m doing wrong, etc.

I also had no idea Akuma is a good anchor…Is it because he can self-OTG, make good use of meter, open people up AND do good damage, etc.?

I’ll probably run the first team you mentioned and see how that goes.

411

i used to run Doom/Mags/Dorm, try it out.

412

Heh, I don’t have the slightest clue how to run Magneto(or Doom LOL), in any case,
I like the way my team(s) work, as each character I run offers something different.
The reason I don’t know how to run those two characters is because my execution
could use some work… I can’t even do the Buktooth loop yet.

413

That’s actually the problem. Hulk’s XF3 is terrible. He just gets a huge damage boost, and that’s not what he needs. He needs speed.

If you want to see why Akuma is a great anchor, just check out pretty much any tournament stream from the last 3 months. He’s a very popular anchor. He can open people up with a standing overhead, can get full combos off of air throws (not sure about ground throws, might just be a beam from those), and is very safe. His beam hyper in XF3 kills most assists at 100% life (seriously, go into training mode and throw one out in XF3 against an assist).

He’s very good at making comebacks, but needs some meter to ensure he’s competent.

414

I see what you’re saying…
So just run Akuma as anchor and see how it goes?
Also, loloverheads.

415

Give it a shot and see how you do!

416

atm: dorm (a), spencer (b), sent (a)
umvc3: dorm (a), ???, ??? gonna choose from ghost rider, nova, sentinel, spencer and nemesis

417

so, what do people think about rocket raccoon as a teammate for dorm? from the little we can see so far he looks like he might be good…
the one assist i saw of his that really caught my eye was the hammer trap thing that covers the top half of the screen.for complete control off airspace. not sure what his other assists are but im guessing one will be one of his fireballs and maybe another trap.
as far as DHCing goes. (thinking about DHCing into here) the only thing id be worried about is if his Gatling gun super is too low and the opponent could recover before falling into it. i guess you can always DHC early to make sure this doesnt happen. the spring thing… not sure about this im guessing it will take some experimenting before that really shows its potential. his level three. i couldnt see how it hit. seemed to just hit everywhere… but maybe just on the ground so im not sure you could DHC into it from any of dorms super except an early one off of a lucky chaotic flame that caught your opponent on the ground.

he looks mobile enough that he could really make work off of dorms dark hole assist. pop assist jump over for a cross up. also looks like any of his supers could dhc into chaotic flame or flare depending on spacing.

any thoughts? (that being said im still not planning on playing RR, just thinking about it)

418

For Umvc3

I’ll be running Strange (Bolts), Dorm (Dark Hole), Ghost Rider (heartless spire).

419

I think we need to have a better understanding of RR’s trap hyper first.

420

For UMVC3

I’ll be running Strange (Bolts),Dorm (Dark Hole), Vergil (???).

Still don’t know what the best assist for Vergil is yet.