Good enough TV ping for pre HDMI games

My current HD monitor is a PlayStation 3D TV technically not a TV because there’s no tuner. Its measured at 31 milliseconds of input lag order relieving people who understand network ping, TV ping.

Someone told me at Xbox tech help that milliseconds of input delay could be measured by both gray to gray pixel delay, combined with whatever display frequency is used for the monitor at the time of the game. If that’s the case and if all TV console games play at 60 hertz then the shorter the great agree time the shorter the TV ping.

Is there a general fighting game community standard which says a TV is quick enough we’re gamers don’t have to alter their local training if they train for something on a CRT TV. 27 trade for Street Fighter 2 new challengers for SNES on the real SNES hooked up to a CRT TV and then got brought to the wii u version (let’s assume no one has the Wii component cable for the Wii U or composite or S-Video or RF or CRT TV). What Ping time or gray to Gray would be considered close enough what is the ability to beat level four on one credit with any character is unhampered.

Press Your Luck, National TV'S first hand-eye reflex game, and ping testing

Would this be considered a sensitive test of ping. I played game show Network’s Whammy flash game when it was out on my computer pre-loading in dial up. And when I played the non-synced with television version I found a strategy that work pretty well. A strategy I thought of as a kid watching the originals at home.

I noticed one square always had big bucks and a spin in the second round and no whammies. That is one square you always want to stop on if you have a choice. you choose when to stop the board by yelling stop and or pressing the buzzer front of you. When tried to stop the tape on the betamax sometimes when I was early I was able to stop it and sometimes it was in between frames where it’d be tough to determine which one I’d stop on. in other words I was staring at the square and hitting the pause button as soon as I saw that square light up.

That was different from the famous Michael Larson name where he memorized enough parts of enough of the patterns where he could always stop square on either big bucks and a spin or is the second option a safe always get a spin square with minor bucks.

Larson also thought abiut this theory with a VCR because when when he practiced at home he had the lead the square because the VCR takes time to slow down to a stop. so it’s first spinning the game he assumed he had to do that in the studio and hit away me. Then he realizes mistake and it was all big bucks from there.

Probably Michael Larson had an easier time because he knew what to look for a new when it was coming which is kind of like bit trip runner base ping time. I was using a more Street Fighter ping time strategy out staring at the big bucks square and hitting it as soon as I saw it.

I played Game Show Network’s Whamny flash game for fun originally and I could easily got scores that were similar to Michael Larson score using the above technique. And on the Larsen reunions episode what is the true original losing contestants Michael Larson’s brother James showed up and hosted made it a point to say oh by the way James we completely randomized aboard now so the patterns your brother learned no longer apply here. The point was the was little patterns on the real show and probably no wheel patterns outside of doing the random seed at the home version.

Plus it was made harder than the real game show by the fact that there was a spin “shot clock” where you either press the button before the shot clock runs out and have some choice of when to stop or you were at the mercy of whatever came up when the clock hit 0. Sometimes there wasn’t enough time to sit around and wait for the big bucks square sometimes you had to take the next best option, usually looking for a backup safe square.

So considering I had no patterns to work with and a timer to work against. I got Larson like scores on the show where most of the squares except the big bucks squares were smaller dollar amountsbecause made for cable game shows were generally cheaper than broadcast network ones, had random flashing patterns and had a shot clock that could just wait and sit all day.

not bad considering they were millions of players I was ranked better than #100. By the way, there were 10 scores that were million plus and the number one score was 10 million. So it’s not just me who thought of that strategy but others have too.

The point is I got a great score on a game that you could do well at if you’re very quick hand eye reflexes, was in 100th place out of a million people with their best number one score. And I did it on a Macintosh at the time now I know is a CRT Mac

Many years later when I actually had high speed internet I tried it with a faster connection but unknowingly then with a LCD panel McIntosh. I had a real tough time finding square. I thought my reflexes diminished.

Then I heard the news of the CRT delay that came up at around 2012 so I dug up the old CRT Macintosh found Whammy on a retro flash game site. And got the typical Larson like score expected. I could have gone for more but my point was made to myself. CRT does.

Is there such a thing as a 3D monitor that is quicker ping time than a PS3DTV? I heard there were some 3D monitors but they required to be hooked up to a PC and other things needed for to the spike 3D which means they couldn’t display 3D from a PlayStation 3 any other console or cable or satellite that add 3D. are there any non-3D monitors that are considered quicker than a PS3? I heard they were two different PC syncing methods of 3D. Does it matter which one I get if I use it as a second monitor for a Macintosh or use it as a console monitor even if I do use 3D or is the singing method only relevant to PCS?

Theres a dedicated thread for this with model numbers that are recommended

You gotta search.

Gotta go. Co main event starting ufc 244

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I searched the stk search undet the term “low ping monitor” and found 20 mentions, and none of them as a primary topic.

There is a diiference between grey to grey, which is how fast a pixel change occurs, vs input ping, of how many milliseconds it takes for your block to register. Seems like most time, outside of a CRT, the only effective strategy in blocking is either:

A) guess when and hope for right height.ll

B) block opponents going to the well once too often.

C) doing LOTS of research and practice. My game competing fruendcwad turbed iff hy the anoubt of studt going into the gane. SF2 could be won on natural skills and instinct. But as time went on, when TV ping was added, practice modes were added, and long combos were given to you. But ping hampers execution. That’s when colleges have fighting gane classes. SF4 was the transition period was SF4, were s mixbof CRT abd flat TVs were used.

And if you doubt my reflexes, I can get Larson-like scores on the Whammy flash game, as long as u was on a CRT TV. On an LCD, ny strategy NEVER works. Out of a million people, less that 100 have a better score than me.

The strategy is staring at the “always big bucks and a spin” square and stop the instant I see that square’s border light up. The is no pattern involved, and the show even told Larson’s brother that, so i assume the flash game has no pattern, too.

But it only works on a CRT. Any flst screen is too delayed.

If SRK has a modern monitor review for HDMI games, and retri games I couldn’t find it. And I searched. Link, please?

What is low ping for a minitor? Nothing, Ping isn’t used out of networking as there nothing to Ping on a Monitor.

You want to look for Lag or Latency. As in Low Lag or Low Latency.


We’re getting pretty technical here. most people assume when you mean paying you’re talkin about it’ll why doesn’t matter whether it’s Network delay or minor delay. that’s an easy early way to relate the fact that non CRT monitors have delay by using the term ping, a term Network gamers associate with.

I don’t know where the origin of the word pain came from I heard as something to do PCS but then again I’m a Mac person starting in 1999 and before that my only computers word Apple iiE an Atari 800XL. I never experienced the network game until the Dreamcast playing ChuChu Rocket on my dial up.

Ping wasn’t an issue with dial-up. Dreamcast had some pretty good games for being dial up only.

So why is the term ping incorrect but the term delay or leg is when referring to TVs but not to networking. How do you say people to be so petty as a correctness using pain when it’s understood a means delay.

but then again this is the same bunch of people who ride my ass for suggesting a right-handed fightstick might be good in some situations and for me most situations.

Because it does matter. Ping is only used for networking as Ping is a Return signal. There no Ping for video signals. Also major point, Google don’t know what you mean when you use the Wrong terminology. And to continue to use the wrong terminology is just going to get other people mislead and confused. Hence why you only have 20 results with no information instead of the one actual relevant result.

And no one cares about your theory, use the right terminology.

Irrelevant, learn the terminology.

Also I gave you a link to a thread with a list of threads topics in it, the Intro thread. Your relevant threat is posted on there.

Hey @tripletopper,

To answer your question:

Is there a general fighting game community standard which says a TV is quick enough [for] gamers[?]

Yes, there is! Check out the website called Display Lag. They test computer monitors/TVs and determine the amount of input lag they have. They also give each monitor/TV a rating to describe their playability for gamers. Click the link below for their database:

Note: “Stick to displays marked Excellent or Great for the best user experience, as they provide the lowest input lag when set to Game Mode.”

Is there a 3D monitor [that has lower input lag] than a PS3DTV?

I don’t know but DisplayLag has tested A LOT of monitors/TVs, their website would be a good starting point for you.

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Yes i did visit displaylag and I couldn’t accurately compare a PS3DTV which is neasuted at 31 ms input time to s monitor with 5 ms grey to grey time.

the first concerns both the display and your input while the second only factors the display. How do I make an accurate comparison between a PS3DTV and a 5 millisecond gray to gray Monitor? It’s apples to oranges.

Finally I heard there were ways to take composite S-Video and component inputs and bring them into a CRT monitor that was considered VGA or some derivative standard. I know some things and a slight amount to delay like a VCR hooked up to a TV could throw your light gun shot off by a few pixels,. And games for the PlayStation and Saturn and beyond compensate for death with screen calibration so VCRs will work accurately. But assuming I don’t necessarily need to play light gun games is a composite S-Video or component to VGA adapter considered low ping enough tonight Europe any game other than possibly a light gun game?

this is because I heard some Modern monitors have to convert standards to go from 480i to us entered a monitor with except and anytime you convert pixels it delays it so VGA probably does accept 600 x 480 except it’s p not i. Does progressivizing a signal cause enough delay when you can feel it in non light gun games?

By the way, i did search low oing monitot on google and found displaylag. Bi was srarching SRK ti see if there was an internal sub page withij SRK, but thete isn’t.

Yes i know i should use terms thatbpeople knoe. But since i never used a PC, i thought ping was more generic.

And in a sense if ping implies a round trip didn’t the roundabout way I could justify using the word ping. it goes from you to the button to the computer to the screen and then back into your eyes so it starts with you ends with you and the round trip goes through the video game system and TV.

I know that’s kind of a smartass way to shoehorn the word ping and technically be correct, but yes using similar terms does help with the Google ranks.

By the way, Google did find me display lag so I guess Google knows ping is close enough to what I want to bring it up when I put the word monitor and ping in the same search.

The PS3DTV is considered great. The only game i notice ping vs a crt tv that effects my score greatly is Press Your Luck.

31 ms is good. That’s less than 1 frame in a 30 hz game, or 2 frames on a 60 hz game.

The PS3DTV is probably the lowest ping 3d monitor for consoles.

2 frames is terrible
You want sub frame. Smallest amount possible.

I noticed at most tournaments the gamer’s local screen is usually a small screen my 15 inches if 4 X3 or 24 in if 16 by 9.

my iMac 15 incher does not feel that heavy and there’s a computer built in with the monitor.

the iMac has a handle on top that you could carry a CRT TV with one hand. Put that in a mitered CRT TV and you got something.

I would ask if there was a way I could just use my iMac as basically a CRT monitor like if there was such a thing as monitor OS which does nothing computer wise except directly display.

The only time I see a real big monitor is for display for large local audiences.

I guess the only reason why they don’t make CRT TVs anymore is because the federal government made it a legal kind of like incandescent light bulbs.

they brought incandescent light bulbs back why can’t we bring crt’s back in a 15 inch portable size?

is it supposed big TVs don’t need little pig you don’t have to make big TVs in CRT. I noticed most gamers prefer gave me about size monitors

They have to be big enough so you could see every detail but small enough so you could see the whole picture.

24 inches for 16 by 9 or 15 inches for 4 by 3 seems to be the perfect size.

I got the ultimate test. Look up old flash game websites and try to find game show Network’s Whammy. Anna crt tv I can pull off Larson like scores easily.

Newer iMac it’s near impossible to get beyond 20k consistently.

Now I got a nap I could road test new computer monitors with.

Now the question becomes if I get a low ping monitor but pretty much everything except light gun games,. can I hook up analog hookups like ntsc RF, composite S-Video and component, just like a regular analog TV and lag that’s the only measurable by pixels off your shot on a light gun game, if it were a crt tv.

By the way I noticed a VCR pulls a light gun to the right about eighth of a screen’s width, and quite a few times a DVD recorder doesn’t register hits because of the delay’s too long.

Light gun calibration in games for the Saturn and Playstation 1 onward till the end of CRTs, was designed to compensate for minor VCR delays.

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just buy a Benq Zowie and be done with it

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Yes i heard BenQ is the company that first sold low lag as an intentional feature. Will any BenQ work, or only certain ones?

A good advertising slogan would be something along the lines of saving virtual more virtual lives than all other display companies combined.

I will probably try a BenQ. New cheap ones are $150 at Best Buy. Plus would ANY monitor with the BenQ nametag be a good thrift store find for low lag monitors.

Is tge a way to hook up games with NTSC RF (Atari. Matell. Bally, Coleco, etc) Composite (NES SMS. Genesis) S-Video ( from SNES to Dreamcast) can and component (PS2, Game Cube, Xbox Prime) to be considered low enough lag to play like a CRT for rverything except Light Gun games ( needs sub microsecond delay, vs 5-10 ms) and possibly Segascope 3D games ( issues with shutter timing need sub microsecond too.)

Just to get a frame of reference, ate built in iMac monitors from 2008 and 2013 cosidered non-gaming optimized monitors? Whay’s quicker, a PS3DTV or a typical iMac Monitor? Will a typical thrift store older BenQ be quicker than those 2?

The only thing I can’t play is Sonic Genrrations 3D for 360. I don’t think BenQ makes 3D gaming monitors.

I did sumbit an idea to BenQ USA about 3D add ons that sense the ping from anywhere from sub microsecond CRT to 480 Hz highly procesded screens of 1 s ping. And sync a 3D shutter signaler snd turns any 2D tv into a Shutter 3D system. I known I can provide a shutter. Depending on what can be done with polarized filters, there could be a polar version too.

BenQ USA people lived the ifea, but couldn’t do anything by themselves, so they sent it to world HQ in Taiwan. They will emaill me when they come to a decision.

Add 3d to any monitor. neither be forced into buying 3d nor be price out of the 3D market.