GGXX:Accent Core Thread! [AMERICAN PS2 RELEASE, GO GO GO!]

Current Fighting Games Fighting Game Discussion
1841

Acctualy most the stuff for GG IS BEGINER type stuff. alot of the more complciated stuff is not known. How many people know how to store stances, so you can control if your hit ducking or standing? To store damage buffers from one move to the next so your combos do more damage, to store jump installs for the rest of the round? How to make your attacks unblockable? How to make your moves invincable, or how to give yourself more time to “reversal” then normal? etc etc…

So in fact most the beginer stuff is known. A lot of the more complicated stuff is not.

Alot of the stuff I think you guys think that are complicated… are all really simple stuff. You guys are just makeing it complicated. Its all really basic stuff. GG is not that complicated of a game. So yea I think alot of the guides maybe you guys think arent for beginers well they are.

1842

Yeah… I feel the same way a lot of the time.

It’s not that hard to look at a move and see what it might be good for, then try it… does it work, does it not work? The broad, basic crap is all really easy to figure out in like 5 minutes, you don’t need someone to tell you that kind of thing.

And there is NO “beginner” level stuff that is relevant, if by “beginner” you mean not using basic system stuff. All the good stuff that doesn’t use (F)RCs or JI or whatever crap people are calling complicated is generally HARDER than learning a simple FRC.
When people ask for “beginner” stuff it sounds like they want to learn crap like 2Px4 into sweep, not how to play the game. It’s pretty much not a game where you can get away with not learning basic system crap- but the basic system stuff is EASY, it’s just timing and you do a lot of moves kinda fast sometimes so it sounds complicated on paper if you haven’t played GG games before.

Then you actually practice the game for like an hour (total) and it all starts falling into place.

1843

honestly the best thing to do is:
know what all the system mechanics are and what they do (basic grasp of them)
know some “basic”, versatile combos to use that do some decent damage
play the game vs people, and then do this, and then do it more, then go back into training mode and learn better combos, then play some more, and more.

gg is a game you have to sit down and play to learn because while a lot of the things are easy to grasp (aka every system mechanic), you have to learn your character more than anything else. you can’t pick up GG like you can another Capcom fighter and know a movelist, the system mechanics and some basic combos in 4 seconds, and take your fundamentals and apply them. here you have you actually know what your character can do, and how to approach situations before you can really touch intermediate level play.

gg is not a hard game to learn, but a lot of people don’t seem to want to actually LEARN it.

1844

While definitely a daunting game, Guilty Gear isn’t a hard game to learn per se. I mean, you can definitely make it hard for yourself - for instance, trying to learn I-No - but for the most part, as long as you’ve got a friend who knows how to play or access to Dustloop (and are armed with a degree of patience since it IS an internet forum), you should honestly be fine.

The hardest part about learning GG is getting over the hump with all the seemingly daunting mechanics, like what is burst, FD, IB, JC, RC, FRC, dead angle, and so on. From there it’s understanding your character, whose difficulty is all on you. (Might I add that GG’s gatling is so much friendlier than CVS2, for instance, where EVERYONE is Slayer) And from there it’s the same with any fighter, just finding competition and playing the game, learning offense, defense, how to play, fine tuning your execution, and getting experience with character matchups, which is very important (and can be tough) in Guilty Gear since there are so many diverse characters. But all those last parts are a part of being competitive in the GG community, and part of the fun. For me, the difficulty was getting over that initial hump of all the different mechanics, but once you know them, it really does make a lot of sense.

And <3

1845

So you don’t want a guide that locks you into a specific style and you don’t see something wrong with a guide that tells you, definitively, all of the properties of all moves so that you understand “everything” about them? You can’t learn everything without experimenting on your own and no guide is going to substitute for that without being so incredibly overloaded with peripheral information that it’s gigantic and unwieldy. The thing is supposed to be a starting point for new players, so is saying “these moves are good for these reasons” really any worse than an exhaustive list of properties for all moves?

By the way, I play Street Fighter too and I’ve read the Versus A2 guide and everything, so none of what you’re saying is new to me. That other guides have done it a certain way is not an argument for that style of instruction.

1846

I-No is a character you need to learn after you’ve gotten a good grasp on consistently performing FRCs and using them well in combos with other characters… She’s not beginner friendly in the least.

As for normals:
6HS early can be used for anti-air, as well as 6p I think (as long as it’s still got okay upperbody invinc)

2S is one of her good pokes, hits low, combos into Chemical Love (632146k)

(far)5S is an interesting normal now, kinda cool to fish for a counter hit

jHS is good for mind games, using her dash and whiffing jHS not high enough to actually hit then going into 2k-combo [mix it up with jHS/jS that are high enough to hit high too, obviously]

Her note projectile is a big staple of hers - learn the FRC. Also, tiger knee the motion so that it comes out in air and you don’t have as much recovery and can air dash in to get close while directing the note with up and down. (2147P or HS)

I’m not as familiar with her in accent core but basically you pressure with notes and fish for a knockdown… Then you shoot an optional okizeme note (preferably FRC’d) and dash in… From here I-No has endless tricks for their wakeup… Useful FRCs that come to mind are note projectiles and her throw (learn to split the dash motion to get a dash to come out the fastest - i.e. instead of HS(throw) … FRC-66 you’d do HS(throw) … 6FRC6.

Dash up jK, land, 2k, 6p, combo of your choice* or start it with a whiffed air normal/no air normal after the dash, land, 2k, 6p/5s, combo. Or dash in higher and land more than one air normal, i.e. 2k, 2s… or use the interesting 2d after all that for a little extra height to keep you from landing, hopefully trick them into low blocking. You can also cancel her dash into an airdash since she’s airborne and I believe the motion is 6696.

*2k, 6p, 5hs, Chemical Love (if you can, learn to FRC and airdash right after and combo some more)

*2k, 6p, 5s, JC, jS, jHS, 236k (there’s a way to air dash cancel it, learn that because you can ADC then land another air normal cancelled into another 236 dive, though I don’t know if it’d work in that situation)

Lastly… Just watch some Koichi videos. :lol:

1847

The problem with writing a good guide for guilty gear is that the game and characters evolve so often, especially here in the US where your playstyle may get rearranged when you get into a new matchup for the first time. I can tell you from experience that after I wrote my slash Anji guide it’s was obsolete and unlike my playstyle within 2 months of completion. I spent a shitton of time breaking down the basics and trying to explain the most begginer portions of the character, but even those things changed fairly quickly to an extent.

Good guides take a LOT of free time to complete. I was unemployed while i wrote mine and it still took me a good 3 weeks to finish. To keep the guide current takes a lot of effort and revising just to make things proper. Your best bet for getting beginner strats is to just learn about who the best players are for each character, and try to ask them your most prominant questions. It takes a good while to get used to guilty gear, so don’t get discouraged if gathering knowledge takes a bit of time and effort as well.

1848

I mean watching vids has always been the quick fix to learn how to play a givin character. GG is really fuckin easy to pick up and the training mode is pretty extensive.

1849

It may be easy to pick up, but I think there’s still a decent skill gap in the game.

1850

Like others said, it’s one of those games where you just gotta dick around with it for a while then it all magically becomes clear. When I found out about Dustloop, the only trouble I had was some or the terms and techniques like JI and 1-frame jumps because I had never heard of those before.

1851

Is there any set rules for the way characters are juggled/tech flip? I am mostly speaking of the system the game follows. Is it a universal thing like Alpha 3 (where they are hit as long as you dont hit a neutral state), or does ech character have his own set of air hitstuns/non-tech time? I just think it would help my understanding a bit better. I do see that counterhits tht launch you dont let you tech as early/at all. Or characters like Ky that keep smacking me against the wall like a damn ping pong ball while I keep jamming on the flip button…

1852

when in the air, moves have hit-stun, when it ends you can tech…pretty basic. Theres a lot of variables that decrease/increase hit stun though, one being what you eluded to…A CH.

1853

Each move has an associated level, 1 through 5. Level determines the amount of hit/block stun a move deals. As long as the guy hasn’t teched, you are free to hit them as much as you like.
http://www.dustloop.com/ggac/data/teching.html
http://www.dustloop.com/ggac/data/hitstun.html

Some moves ignore the standard system and follow their own special rules.
http://www.dustloop.com/data/ac/select.html

1854

haha i just realized the dust loop character frame data page is the same layout as ac character select screen

1855

its not as well known because not everyone has the means to lurk down japanese bbs for the info:wonder:

1856

hey guys i discovered this awesome glitch that makes your moves unblockable but only i know how to do it and i cant record it cus i have no equipment and all 9 of the people that saw me do it died mysteriously so its too bad i cant show you this awesome glitch so i guess youll have to discover it for yourself shruuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuug

shruuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuug
SHRUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUG

1857

FORRESTU INSTALL

1858

clayton the only reason nobody knows any of that shit is because you don’t tell anyone, and if you have told anyone, you haven’t reposted it here or on dustloop in a long time

1859

I’m pretty sure Final Showdown could argue that there are two reasons:

  1. He hasn’t told anyone.
  2. No one else has figured it out on their own.

I’m not saying I’ve figured it out, or that he shouldn’t tell people, or indeed that all of those tricks even exist (make any move invincible wha?), but I don’t think the burden’s entirely on him to share his tricks, either.

OKAY NO DRAMA QUESTION: What’re people’s favorite Venom billiard ball formations? I’m a big fan of K ball -> P ball -> hit the P ball before it reaches its final position. It covers character height while making it hard to jump over.

1860

This game looks like pretty cool but what’s the best version to get?