Often when we browse the forum we can find many tactical datas about frames, when a move starts, when is safe to jump, the frame when you can cancel a move …and so on. Even if sometimes of course it helps when you are in games you dont have a frame counter on your screen and you have just to “feel” the frame or base your timing on something that you can see or feel. Is just about this that i would like to talk here, some tips very pratical that can help your timing.
I will take and example:
for a good timed cross up attack against an opponent that is down and is waking up you can say me the frame when i have to begin the jump attack but if you say that really help me so much? When i am playing, on that frame a flashing number and a message “jump” will enter the screen? Of course not and we are talking of 1/60 of second so is difficut to feel it. So what i mean is not a critic against frames data and so on ( i am on the first line about this study) but i just want to say that a number with a grafic or feel reference will help more than the number only.
So we can use this topic to connect important frames data with grafic/feel refereces at least for the main tactic such as cross up, safe jumps, combo and so on…where the timing is very important.
One thing that helps me time some of my attacks is knowing the wake up frames of the specific character. Granted, just because you know the number of wake-up frames it still will not let you know when to hit the button but it will give you a time range of how long or short of a time you will have to wait for the opponet to return to neutral. After a while you being to start to match the number with the animation time you are seeing and it becomes dead on accurate when you can hit the enemy on wake-up.
The only character i cannot a cross-up every time would be Balrog. for some reason he grabs me while i’m in the air. He seems to get up so fast from a knockdown or would it be slow. i can “feel it” like you say against all the characters, but not against boxer. I’ never really looked at his frame data but what the frame data does not Show you are all the frames of animation just numbers i’m a visually based person. i need to see it before i can do it. So unless i can see where boxer is in his wakeup animations i will struggle to see how to properly jump in at the right times. Yoga hyper book is great but it fails in the visual animations. I use Honda and it would be great to see EXACTLY where his splash hits at all frames or where his non attacking frames are while a character is jumping.
T.Akibas page breaks down all of this, it is very old info. The .5 is the time start up of the beinging of the next whole frame where they would be able to jump or input a command. If a meaty normal or cross-up is placed in that window then the command by the knocked down enemy on the 93 frame will not be possible. You can stuff DPs’ like this as well with shoto’s crouching strong.
93rd frame input is possible and jump is possible. Not hittable untill 93rd frame but on 92.5 can not input throw or command DP. Can not input untill 93 frame. Not even throws.
ummm huh? That had nothing to do with my post…i’m well aware of Hondas splash but when i do do it against Boxer the timing is all wrong in many instances. I want to know why it misses the way it misses. should i jump later or earlier.
I think that good Super Street Fighter X players in America do not want this to be common knowledge thus it would bring an end to this game beacuse the tacitc is game engine specific and every character has one normal that’s sole perpose is to do just that.
If you are not talking about how to time meaty hits in this thread with out the frabic of the game which is frame data givin to us by the japanese programers"well some of us" then you are just throwing estimations and personal speculation with no base of reference.
I am all for testing don’t get me wrong, but if you have no base to test against it, it is the difference between the humans that had rocks and blunt tools and the higher humans that had sharpen tools and writting system for over 20,000 years before the others caught up.
Live in the cave or become enlightend in the Pyramid. Your choice.
You can not meaty DPs’ right!? Then why does Daigo not try to DP Suji when he jumps in on him with M.Bison(boxer)? Remember or if you ever knew, Ken flaming Dp is 0 frame and invincible at start as well. I am going to test whether or not safe jump in work against his DP or not, Be back in a few.
Actually I think you can. I don’t know about using a poke to do it, but I have gone for a crossup on New Ryu with Old Ryu and his wake up DP got beat by my crossup. I have also traded hits with new Ken and Ryu’s DP’s with a Tiger uppercut.
I don’t think such an occurrence is common, but it is possible.
EDIT:Obviously this is only possible against New DP’s as old school DP’s are completely invincible.
I’m not sure about the reasoning behind Daigo not DPng there. Sometimes you just don’t “feel” the timing and choose to block.
Yes, but you do that hitting ryu when he isn’t invincible anymore, that dude is saying you can stuff dps before they come out, a la 3rd strike, which is not true, unless you’re playing WW.
When I did it I was on top of Ryu’s hit box and my crossup beat out his DP while it was animating. Basically it came out and then got beat. In something like 3S a DP will still animate, but it will just get beat out very early in the animation. If it didn’t animate you wouldn’t be getting hit because you would be blocking. I really don’t see a difference between the two other than when the DP gets beat into the animation.
Now if what you are saying is he thinks you can stuff DP’s without them animating a significant amount, I would say he is wrong. I am certain that Ryu or Ken will at least get to the “shoryu” part of what they say during the dragon animation.
I’m pretty sure DP’s are invincible in WW except to magic throw.
Just got finished with the test and the results are…
normal meaty stop DP inputs!
Reseached safe jump in attack, it is hitting on the same meaty frame opportunity. Safe jump in attack is the samething as crouch strong on waking up shoto.
Safe jump in is good to go for baiting Reversal Dps’, but why would you want to bait the DP when on jump in you can stuff it out right?
There will be no sound effect because the input was not completed. The only thing you will see is the point at which you were inputting the dragon getting hit either in crouch or standing. Had two of my friends come over and help me test it and they have seee my copy of The Yoga Fire Book and the page that explains this “no hit back rule” is on page 173 bottom of the page. The programers show Gouki hitting Zangief out of his SPD with a low roundhouse on wake up.That should let you know I own the book! If this is not enough information then I am so sorry for you when you play somebody who dose undersatnd this information. I read japanese by the way. Black Kid reading skills, KO!
Daigo did not DP beacuse he was not sure, he knew he could not.
That was so cute. Too bad as soon as you posted it I let my two friends watch while we are playing Super Turbo"right now" and they are laughing at you beacuse they just reproduced the same reversal capture that is in your video, accept the only way it is happing is if we time the close fierce a second later than the proper meaty timing. You think I am a fool Megatron!!!
Chun Li’s close standing fierce has 20 active hit frames on it, reading it right now"sorry man everybody is in the room laughing so hard lett…me finish the post. hahahahahahahahahahahahaahahahaha.:clown:
Of course the jab dragon will pass threw the fierce when timed inccorrectly silly rabbit, tricks are for kids!lolololololololo!