Fighting against the Ninja Glade: Ibuki Matchup Thread *11/5 Update*

Street Fighter V Ibuki
101

  1. Rating sim mobility over his walk speed is bad. His mobility is based around teleports and vskill float, where he is on par with ibuki on speed.

  2. his normals are vastly superior to ibuki, so getting in for her might result problematic.

  3. he has wakeup teleports to escape pressure and vreversal so he is not completely helpless when ibuki get in, same for the yoga critical art which can be used on wakeup to beat ibuki air kunai setups. But she shouldnt get in consistently given her inferiority in neutral game. Yes you can do the read and track sim wakeup teleport with command dash M but it mostly work as a read, doing it effectively as a reaction is HARD.

  4. sim stuff is strong if he gets in and his health = ibuki so if he manages to get in ibuki will be in trouble

Im not an expert on that matchup but i would rather deal with it with vega my main than ibuki and that says a lot, vega matchup with sim is 5-5

102

Cammy and rmika normals are better used offesively, which is why i believe their defense is not as good as other top 8 and ibuki can break through it easier than other characters such as karin or nash. She also has a great vreversal that turns the table and cammy/mika are very succeptible to damage when they lose momentum. I use the same logic in the laura matchup and its been working exceptionally well for me.

I think using ibuki strategically in those matchups is better than throwing her agaisnt the wall of top8 fireball characters this game has and she will be way more successful

103

Not rating it on his walkspeed. Rating it on overall movement and overall Ibuki’s options to move around are faster than his overall options. He can’t teleport forward safely without a fireball so that limits his movement if Ibuki is in neutral reacting to forward teleports with buttons. She overall has better options to move than he does.

f+HK either beats or hops over all his ground buttons. V Skill is a good counter poke vs most of his standing buttons as well. Only s.HP can low profile it but you can f+HK over the s.HP. She can also viably throw out kunais at him and reload because he has to commit to teleport to punish it from far range. Once she gets EX kunai a lot of those standing buttons become even more risky.

Wake up teleport loses to throw and her fast walk will let her walk up to him quickly after knockdowns. His V Reversal is alright but V Reversals are always prone to losing to tick grabs which Ibuki is really good at.

They both have the same health and stun so it’s going to be equally dangerous health wise. Not that I put much stock in health as usual. Luckily Ibuki has 3 frame jab and EX DP so she has a completely better situation against his offense than he does against hers. 3 frame jab/3 frame kazekiri + EX DP + V Reversal >>>> 4 frame buttons, V Reversal or teleport.

Ibuki’s movement and counter poke options should be really strong vs Sim and she should be able to get in on him faster than almost anyone in the game. She has the movement and options to do it and stick to him when she gets in. Sim counts on his movement and buttons to keep in the game vs strong offense, but she can easily match his special move/V Skill movement and stick to him once she gets in. I say mess with your options more and you should find the matchup pretty solid for her.

104

Mmm… fHK has a 13 frames startup if i recall well… using it as an example of a normal that beats sim in neutral is not good… it is good as a preemptive normal to play footsies but it can get beaten quite easily by a faster normal if sim do something, like b.mk.

Ibuki vskill is unsafe specially to tk teleport, if you charge it there is nothing stopping sim from reacting to it and doing tk teleport. And those are core of ibuki neutral game in that matchup since kunais are not infinite. Her cr.MP is slow and makes ibuki hurtbox bigger, her s.HP is super slow, her slide is quite unsafe, etc. I mean, i think ibuki is very good in some matchups but come on, sim is good at this game he is not free to ibuki at all… ibuki can have all the walkspeed she wants but she is not getting close to sim consistently if the sim player doesnt fuck up.

Sim has safe slides, divekicks from ranges that are hard to counter by ibuki on reaction, and when he gets in he is kinda scary, specially if ibuki is out of meter.

Finally, the vreversal is +2 for neutral wakeup but if the other player use back roll as wake up ibuki will be out of range for her normals after command dash M, midscreen. So it is really not such a huge thing to throw at sim who can teleport back after the back roll and go back to neutral game where he reigns. I believe the vreversal is sooo much better agaisnt laura/mika/cammy than agaisnt characters who can recover and beat ibuki through neutral game…

105

Again, many players suck at playing actual sf and ibuki will get in even in unwinnable matchups, then she will start her mixup engine and beat people. But at high level dont hope so much for ibuki to break through the fireball guys with strong neutral game. Or Vega/Bison lol.

106

Definitely not saying the matchup is free. Just that I think it should be pretty clear that she either wins or at the minimum can go toe to toe with his options well. DEFINITELY does not lose the matchup.

You’re not going to play neutral in the traditional sense vs Sim since he plays more like an anime character now, but if both characters are waiting the other out in neutral, Ibuki I say has the advantage especially if she has a meter. Instant EX kunai is extremely dangerous for Sim and forces him to go to the air, whereas if he tries to control the ground with a meterless fireball she can command dash in. He has to find a way to build meter for EX fireball so that he can control that horizontal part of the screen that Ibuki can easily invade if he doesn’t have an EX fireball ready. Even if he does she can instant EX kunai punish it on reaction and she’s in.

Ibuki is fine with going back to neutral vs Sim I feel since the odds of her getting in are just as good or better as his options for keeping her out or getting in on her. I think she has all the tools to get the gap closed back in no matter how far she is away. Especially if she has an EX meter. Dive kicks are good, but he has to up close to be successful vs Ibuki. Any farther ranged dive kicks can be AA’d on reaction by kazekiri which are all 3 to 5 frame start up.

He has solid neutral options, but most of them are things she can deal with fairly well while also having the movement and neutral invading tools to keep him from doing the things that cover his neutral the safest (MP/HP/EX fireball). If Sim can’t do those things safely vs a character I automatically consider him to struggle. His neutral game and ability to start offense is much more risky if he can’t get his fireballs out safely.

107

Meh i like your wishful thinking on ibuki deviljin xD im done i retreat from this argument. Have you played any high level sim with ibuki? You sound quite confident on that matchup would like to see footage of you vs some high level sim, maybe im missing something in my understanding of sim vs ibuki and theory fighting is half the work…

108

I agree with deviljin on the sim match. On paper tools vs. Tools ibuki has easier ways in on Sim vs most characters. Sim does not want to just waltz right into her. He can’t easily come into close range on her. Teleports might be fast but he would be stupid to just try to come in on her. 3f jab resets the situation if he tries to do a lone Teleport. If he tries to fireball and Teleport, she gets a free mk dash in.

Ibuki isn’t going to try to go toe to toe with his normals. From start of the match you can force a life lead with kunai. And stay back and walk him down to the corner, so that you can finally use your good buttons on him. I honestly think Sims mobility hinders him in the match. His ground game isn’t the best. Nor is his air mobility vs. Her.

Idk I just don’t see Sim winning in the long run against her if she plays smart.

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Definitely. She always has a way to close the gap vs him and he just does not have the 3 frame buttons/reversal tools to deal with someone who can close the gap on his options that quickly. Dhalsim heavily relies on getting a MP/HP/EX fireball out on screen safely to actually start a safe offense and Ibuki just has too many options that can reaction stuff the fireballs. Leaving him with a much riskier approach.

Which leaves him to play the range/buttons game which he can not win on alone in SFV. His buttons have too much recovery lag to them compared to older SF games and don’t really lead to much. He can’t make people fall on his buttons as he throws horizontal fireballs like before.

110

Any ideas about the Juri matchup? I’ve been playing and finding it hard to get started, eating a lot of buttons and/or throws.

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I have fought my friend who mains Juri a decent amount, and a good number of online Juris as well. The best thing I have found is to do what you can to deny her charges. Even throw a Kunai or two if you can stop her from getting them, and close in with f+HK to catch her when she goes for it from mid range, as her hurtbox extends a bit. Her best button to out poke you with is her c.MP, but this can be dealt with with well spaced V-Skill. Try to get st.MK TC into pressure until you have meter for EX Kunai but watch out for her DP, which can be baited if you get a feel for when they want to do it. It can be a tough matchup due to her slightly better buttons and her pressure and damage with her charges, but she can be controlled fairly well. Also st.LP right after she throws fireball at close range usually stuffs her next button and if you block her V-Skill you can punish with c.MP to whatever or st.MK TC. That is what I have so far.

Any good experience for fighting Rashid? I get steam rolled by Rashid players who know what they are doing. Can’t stick out any buttons.

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Rashid seems like it might be even. His footsie game isn’t outstanding. I think a firm undestanding of his frame data is vital. Once you realize when you can actually push buttons, then the match-up is nowhere near as silly. Once you’re familiar with his wall jump shenanigans in the corner, you beat it pretty easily with jump lp. Oh and I wouldn’t use Fwd HK nearly as much in footsies. When going toe to toe with Rashid, his CC will probably beat you every time. I think it may be faster? I’d avoid V Skill almost entire against him, especially considering how much (for whatever reason) they like to jump. If someone finds a use for Ibuki’s Vskill in that match, then let us know.

I’m pretty sure that when you fight against a Rashid that likes doing Mid or Full screen V Trigger (that’s like, all of 'em), you can punish on reaction with regular or EX kunai.

Also, when a Rashid activates V-Trigger, activate your own if you want. His Tornado will start bouncing your bomb towards you. This is especially hilarious you’re in the corner.

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@Mimic what’s your take on the Sim match?

I have been seeing people use bombs more defensively as a way to reload kunais also. Good idea for when you know you will have trouble landing it clean for a combo

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@“DevilJin 01” I don’t have nearly as much experience to comment yet. I’ve only just started using Ibuki. My main is Karin. I guess right now I’d say dhalsim wins. However, I think we’ve still got a ways to go before Ibuki is fleshed out. Maybe I’ll see it as even, here soon.

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How did you consider the Karin Sim match up just for reference?

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At least even. I’d even go as far as to say that Karin has the advantage.

117

So I’ve been trying to give Ibuki the good ol’ college try for the past two weeks. I was a solid Gold player with Ryu but have tanked into Silver ranks with Ibuiki. Too be expected I guess – Ibuki is a hard character to use AND I think she’s rather under powered:

I have a friend who is a Gold ranked Alex player. I’ve played probably 30, FT3, sets with him. That’s a lot of games. Alex craps on Ibuki. We have another friend who is a Gold ranked Nash, who has also taken up Ibuki, and he does even worse than me in the Alex matchup. Being this is the modern era of fighting game balance, it’s a legit 6-4 in Alex’s favor, meaning it’s winnable for Ibuki but it’s a hill to climb and you’re playing from behind.

Alex’s cr.mp is an obvious problem. It dominates the neutral game. Any advice to counter this button can easily be applied in reverse to Alex to counter Ibuki’s buttons. The obvious answer to this is Ibuki’s V-skill, but then Alex crush-counters st.HK boot to the your face. You can counter poke Alex’s cr.mp, but the range to do so with Ibuki’s st.mp feels awkwardly far away. Ibuki’s st.mk into sweep TC would be a better choice but it loses a lot. Ibuki’s sweep would seem good, but cr.mp by Alex stuffs that too. Anytime you want to frame-trap-crush-counter with f+hk, out range with st.HP or st.HK, you’re going to lose frame race as well.

Alex’s cr.lp is a another problem. Alex just has to delay his cr.lp a few frames during Ibuki’s up close pressure and it’s going to stuff command dashes and overheads. The downside to delay mash is that Alex is prone to tic-throws. That doesn’t matter because he has a lot of health and Ibuki doesn’t get anything off of throws. You know that lil “mixup” Ibuiki likes to go for after a forward throw where she buffers cr.mp into kunai if the opponent hits a button? Well people are catching onto that just delay the wakeup button so they can counter poke the counter poke.

Alex can perfectly space his elbows making it very difficult to punish. Even though it’s -4, at certain ranges Ibuki’s st.lk will whiff and at certain ranges her DP takes an extra frame to reach the distance Alex is spaced so you can’t punish with that either.

Kunai’s would help, but they only do 40 damage. It’s hard to reload in this matchup because Alex can ex-elbow through to punish whenever you feel like reloading. Even when I want to jump in the air and use an air-kunai to get in, Alex will sometimes ex-elbow right through as well.

Walk speed does make a reasonable difference in this matchup. But when you’re Ibuki, walking down Alex is scary cuz he can just flash elbow you in the face due to the 8 frames. I’d feel more comfortable walking him down in other games, but things that seem reactable in other fighters just aren’t so in SFV. But I digress.

In general the matchup looks like this: Neither person can really get inside to get stuff started. Ibuki wants to get in and start mixup with dashes, and Alex wants to get in to mixup with lariat and powerbomb. Her counter-crush buttons, used at a range where they SHOULD work, lose to Alex’s quicker buttons in cr.lp and cr.mp. Ibuki can use ex-kunai to start some pressure, but Alex can use ex-chop/elbow to make stupid guesses with a lot of Ibuki’s single hitting moves. Under pressure, the Alex I play against generally stand blocks and walks backwards pressing a delayed normal if he suspects a command dash. The walking back avoids a lot of tic-throws. The delayed button press stops the command dash pressure and overheads. My friend’s Alex intentionally leaves himself vulnerable to low sweeps (which gets stuffed by cr.mp BTW). He takes those risks because the payoff for a punished sweep is much higher than the dink-and-dime of getting a sweep here and there with Alex’s health.

Tl;DR The range where Ibuki can make Alex pay with cr.mp, generally leads to a situation where Alex knows he doesn’t need to hit cr.mp. Everything else becomes a relative stalemate but his gambles work out better in his favor and wins the war on attrition based on his high health against Ibuki’s low health.

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My friend’s other character is Guile. Once again we aren’t experts, but we’re Gold level players so maybe there’s something that can be of value here:

I think Ibuki wins this matchup. F+hk does a really good job of hopping over Guile’s cr.mk, and even hops over sonic booms when properly spaced. Guile’s other long reaching pokes in st.HK and f+HP have a big slower startup so you won’t lose too much in the footsies battle. In kind of a weird-meta-strategy kind of way, Guile players are very defensive so the command dash mixups work pretty well here. From full range the kunai will sneak under a sonic boom and clip Guile in the toes. If he throws a slow one, Ibuiki has a enough time to reload a kunai. It’s a weird situation that probably makes a lot of Guile players feel uncomfortable.

Also, holding down MP for the multi kunai throw works well too as a few will sneak under the sonic boom. This creates a knock down and you can reload kunai with very little impunity. Sometimes Guile will throw an ex-boom to punish, but he’s giving up a reversal ex-flash kick every time he does that.

df.MK works great for walking down Guile and sliding under sonic booms. It’s great for really backing him up and making him feel uncomfortable. Even when Guile is able to side switch with you to get out of the corner, you can usually get him to block a cancelable normal and command dash through the other side to cut off the screen again.

Also from mid screen, a well place air ex-kunai works wonders. It can make a flash kick whiff. It can also punish a sonic boom. Follow up with HP raida, and you’re pushing him into the corner again.

I think this matchup is in Ibuki’s favor. 6-4 or 5.5 to 4.5

118

I’ve written three different replies, but all of them make me sound like a massive douche, so I’ll just put this very simply…

Players in the gold ranks… are not very good. In my opinion it is silly to make statements about match-ups if you aren’t playing at least Platinum level players.

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As far as the Alex matchup goes I’ll post a video of Majorboy vs another high platinum Alex. Long set.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qkavnwws3RI

A lot of people talk about how long Alex’s buttons are and this button beats this button that Ibuki has and all that good stuff, but the momentum game seems clearly in her favor regardless. Once Majorboy is on the Alex player, he has a REALLY tough time getting Ibuki off of him. Even in the first 2 matches there was a round where he literally ate up 90 percent of Alex’s life bar before Alex could even move. This is considering that majorboy is making nearly no use of V Skill to help beat his buttons and build V Gauge faster to help his situation even further.

Overall Ibuki has a easier time also getting out of Alex’s pressure than he does hers. I think that’s what really makes the matchup. If Ibuki gets in especially with meter and V Trigger she should be able to stick to him for a long time. Especially with only 4 frame lights and one of the slower V Reversals. Ibuki should feel extra confortable once she gets near Alex and Alex can’t quite dictate pressure against her as easily. f+HP can always be V Reversaled on reaction to get out of the plus 3 mix up, 3 frame jab to blow up anything that isn’t airtight and EX DP as a true invincible option out of sticky situations. So she has at least 2 things up on Alex as far as defensive options.

Granted majorboy gets away with a lot forward jumps that he probably shouldn’t have, but that’s really all it takes is one landed jump in to start a party that Alex has to sit and hang out at for a long time. Hopefully still being alive at the end of it.

Vs Guile seems to be described pretty well above. You just want to find ways to get him to blow his meter on EX booms so he has less EX flash kicks by the time you get near him.

120

Meanwhile…

Spoiler

…Stuck in Silver rank. So that means the players are not very, very good. Kappa.