Maybe, he seems to have lost the majority of his bad rep somehow since the end of the Cold War in the mainstream eye, as far as the US is concerned. It doesn’t seem he was as loved internally as Kim Il-Sung or Jong-Il were after their deaths, and they’re way worse than what people would attribute to Castro…So interesting to see how he will ultimately be seen a few years from now at home and abroad.
I lived in Florida in the 80s the Cuban exiles I knew were older people who had left cuba shortly after the revolution. This is the group of people I think of when I think of Cuban refugees. To hear their vivid stories of the firing squads (no due process), harrowing escapes/travel is to understand that these are NOT fabrications. It is estimated that Cuba lost >10% of its population across the revolution and I dont expect that you know of any people of this cohort, or am I wrong? With your generation who have grown up indoctrinated into Castro’s Cuba, I would think that your view of the refugee issue is likely a bit skewed. And may concede that the US Cuban refugee policy maybe be a bit out of date at this point.
Nobody died in the incident I mentioned. (Except by the State by way of death penalty, of course)
I am sorry it sounds that way to me, but it just does. American culture generally exhibits a strong distaste for politicians in general and look at them as a necessary evil (Trump, a bit of a laughingstock internationally I would guess, was the beneficiary of a massively split republican primary and horrible, hand-picked Dem candidate). So when a cult of personality forms around a national leader, and one who has held an authoritarian rule for almost 60 yrs, and instituted such efficient machinery for repression (your constitution has passages that read read like they are straight out of Animal Farm; it is scary) and indoctrination (I have heard stories about the strong Marxist bent and parental restrictions on primary school education) as Castro did, it understandably raises some eyebrows. And Castro has done his fair share of assassinations/executions as well. Of course once he got the country under control those things became less necessary.
But tell us more about life in Cuba, school education and how you came to learn about Castro, etc. I understand that the state recently lifted restrictions on freely determining and moving living quarters. Is this accurate or do people generally live in a single home their entire life? I heard cell phones were banned until recently, what effect has this had on you/society? Are these devices affordable or luxuries? Are autos affordable or are they considered luxuries? …
In what alternate reality did this happen?
Oh, you were talking about those Cuban refugees. That clarifies everything. Most of them were the ones that owned (along with the US) everything in Cuba while the majority had nothing. Nothing good is going to come from their mouths regarding Fidel or the revolution. Just a big pack of lies. Most of them are the same people that don’t really want Cuba to “change” because they make a living out of lies and false hopes for Cuba. It has turned into a business, sadly. And the same people that celebrate whenever a terrorist act occurs in Cuban soil perpetrated by Cuban Americans “in the name of freedom”. That estimate…I don’t know where you got that from. That’s a lie too. I’m not calling you a liar, just your sources. Now I’d really like you to visit Cuba and see things for yourself. Too bad is not that easy.
Here’s an example of another lie. Have you heard about Peter Pan operation? Well, it consisted of a big coordinated maneuver between the US government and the catholic church to exile more than 14 000 kids in the US by spreading a lie: That parents in Cuba were to lose the right to raise their kids and the state would take them away. Total bullshit that resulted in thousands of children splitting ways with their parents between 1960 and 1962 to never see them again. Some have finally “met” their parents after 40 years appart, some will never see them because they just don’t remember them and it’s hard to track them.
Perhaps I didn’t make myself clear. It’s true that nobody died in the Regla’s boat incident (which has got to be what you’re talking about), but several Cuban citizens and two female French tourists were taken hostages and their lives were threatened just because those guys wanted to go to the US. That wasn’t the first time a boat had been highjacked in Regla (a small coast town in Havana) and it was becoming a “trend” that reached its highest point with that incident in 1995, if I recall correctly. No one was sentenced to death in the previous incidents, but the hostage situation was too much and that’s the reason those 3 perpetrators were given the death penalty. A stop had to be put.
Let me tell you a few things about me. I am a guy who doesn’t belong to any of our communist organizations (UJC, PCC). I just don’t feel like I need to and I don’t want to. I have a brother who moved to Canada since 2012, just because he wanted to improve his life standards, live better (which is what most people who leave Cuba want), but that refers to economic issues, not political. I’m a guy whose plans are to move to Canada too, in the near future, in order to improve (again, economics not politics. And maybe we’ll play a few online sets? haha). I’m a lawyer and I’m currently teaching (law, of course) at a university too. The subjects I teach are heavily political. They have a lot in common with what is known in the US as Political Science which is taught to law students. I’m not indoctrinated in anything. It is my job right now to be unbiased in order to be better at teaching. That said, in my lectures, I go over the constitutional branch a lot. I’m the first one to criticize whatever is wrong with our system and whatever flaws our constitution has (and it has a few, indeed). The flaws in our constitution are mainly technical, or that it doesn’t expand on subjects it should, or that we actually do things that are prohibited by our constitution and vice versa. The flaws in our system have nothing to do with mass murdering or constitutional passages straight out of an animal farm. Would you care to elaborate there?
I can even tell you that the general opinion (I mean in Cuba, what we Cubans think) is that we lack a bit in social discipline. E.g: There are a bunch of guys who spent their entire days in the streets doing illegal businesses (no drugs) and causing problems because, if anything, our police force is way too lenient with them. That’s the general consensus.
Well, school education, as I said, is completely free. This is a country where we are actually encouraged by our state to study. All the way up to college, all free. School is even mandatory until 9th grade.
Look for footage of Fidel among a multitude of people who just want to hug him and his security is minimal or nonexistent. That’s how much people loved him. There’s a famous picture in which a woman (somewhat old) is hugging him with one hand and holding a BIG ASS knife in the other because she was using it at work lol.
The housing restrictions were indeed lifted a few years ago. But those were concerning selling and buying, not moving. Swapping houses has never been prohibited.
That ban was one of the things people couldn’t understand. Well, it’s finally over. Cars couldn’t be sold or purchased either unless its fabrication date was prior to 1959. That ban was lifted at the same time as the housing ban and it had a lot to do with a corrupted vice-president (there are seven vice-presidents in Cuba) who was removed from office. Yeah, we have those here too, haha.
There’s been 10 plus years since the ban on cellphones was lifted. People had ways to go around it by having a foreign friend purchase (outsiders could and we couldn’t, WTF?) one and then give it to them. It’s not like you were seen with a cellphone in the streets and taken into custody lol. You just couldn’t be the owner on paper. I do want to say that the communications infrastructure to support thousands of cellphones was nonexistent and I’m thinking it had to do a lot with that. Not making excuses, just saying. As soon as ETECSA (the telecommunications company in our country) developed a little infrastructure, the ban was lifted and people started having cellphones.
At first, cellphones were a luxury because of how stupidly expensive the service (and the devices) was but that has been changing, although it is still too expensive. I would define them as a luxury that tons of people can afford, if that makes any sense. I got my cellphone back in 2012.
Cars are definitely a luxury. I’m lucky enough to own one. They are super expensive, our salaries are too low and fuel…don’t even get me started on fuel! Perhaps fuel now is not that expensive, but like I said, salaries are way too low. Our main problem is what we earn rather than the prices.
I was wondering the same thing.
So all of these people are just liars? That is a bit hard to swallow. Especially with the widespread documentation and everything.
Ex post facto law is a hallmark of authoritarian oppression
Searching for freedom of speech I found it buried in article 53 and it didnt just afford the freedom of speech it states the following:
Citizens have freedom of speech and of the press in keeping with the objectives of socialist society.
If you have read Orwell’s Animal Farm (I am actually curious if you have heard of this book) it bears a striking resemblance to the scene where qualifiers are tagged onto the written rights by those in power. The Cuban constitution is full of stuff like that and much worse, just that particular passage struck me as disturbing. It follows a general detailed scheme of restriction and it is rather horrifying in a way.
Sounds a bit like China where I have friends that live. Where the citizens believe they are the freest in the world. But when you go there it is all superficial because the govt stranglehold on assembly, demonstration, speech, etc… Just because you can start a fire and cook some chicken and play with giant fireworks in the middle of a city street and accidentally set a high rise on fire and not get arrested (this happened apparently) doesnt mean you dont live in a police state.
Do you think that the official anti-capitalism stance (not to mention all the suppression in general) has something to do with the economic stagnation? There are no real market forces/pressures for anybody to leverage.
Gasp. Read some real, unadulterated history. PBS acknowledges this:
http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/amex/castro/peopleevents/e_precastro.html
Democratic Cuba may have had its issues but the economy was surging and wages rising across the board. It was a star of Latin America. Batista’s 2nd reign, where he led a coup to take power is where things started turning.
I only care about those old classic cars in cuba
@hubcapsignstop:
Not hard to swallow at all. There’s widespread documentation (not Cuban made, by the way) that proves them wrong, too. It’s a business, and a very profitable one. There’s a post in this thread of someone who has been here a few times and not as a tourist. Don’t take my word for it. Just take his. Why would he lie to defend Cuba? Remember my example of the WMDs in Iraq. That was supposed to be the ultimate truth. Haven’t you wonder why those Cuban refugees are the only refugees that won’t let things go? Generally speaking, refugees escape their country and move on because they want to leave everythnig behind and continue with their lives. I’m not just saying that, I’ve met refugees from Siria that live here. Besides, it’s human nature. Cuban Americans are the exception. Why? Because they make money out of demonizing Cuba and its political system.
Ex post facto law? That wasn’t the case. Our criminal code has the death penalty as its maximum penalty. That is our highest hierarchy criminal legislation. The moratorium was a provisional measure dictated by a lower hierarchy legislation. No new law was created and applied after the incident. The death penalty already existed here. I’m sorry but you’re stepping into a subject you may not know too much about. It was a moratorium and not a permanent ban because the state knew it still had to be there as a deterrent. Terrorist attacks hailing from Miami were happening quite often, too. I wonder how would you feel if you or someone in your family had been the ones kidnapped.
No, I haven’t read the book. I took your words straight, sorry. Passages like that are a hallmark of constitutions in socialist countries, in case you don’t know. I’m not saying is OK, I’m just saying is not new. You’re right (although scary and horrifying may be too much), but once again, how does that make Fidel a mass murderer?
The anti-capitalism stance is a big part of the problem in my opinion. Our political quarrel against capitalism is getting in the way of economical progress and not letting us consider more viable options. Yes, no market pressures. A radical change is needed in that regard.
I read the article you linked. There’s literally only one paragraph stating “good” things about Cuba, prior to 1959. Oh and, is this supposed to be good? “The literacy rate, 76%”. What the hell? The literacy campaign carried out by the revolution is what makes a headline, not that. We were declared the first Latin American country free of illiteracy. If my grandpa heard you, he would smack you right in the face haha.
Our economy was structurally deformed. We had a mono-productive and mono-export economy. Just the US was there to buy everything from us and invade our market with quality products. That kind of prosperity was heavily US dependent. It’s like a house of cards, it can crumble at any time. In a way, it was similar to the prosperity we had with the USSR being our big brother. Once it disappeared everything went straight to shit. That’s real, unadulterated history.
I wonder why you call it Democratic Cuba? You do realize that Batista came to power by means of a coup d’etat, right? How is that democratic? Cuba didn’t have “its issues” back then. It was ALL issues. Your article proves it. Just one paragraph praising economy a little and that’s it. Everythign else is acknowledged as problematic or wrong.
Insightful
It’s funny how most people feel like the story of Robin Hood is a just cause and that the guy is a hero.
When we talk about communism though, people lose their fucking shit, because their parents and media told them so.
It’s fucking retarded.
“Thus were two generations of Americans treated by their overlords until, in the end, at the word ‘communism’ there is an orgasmic Pavlovian reflex just as the brain goes dead.” — Gore Vidal
I remember Robin Hood killing his own people because of their religious beliefs and sexual orientation… Or something.
Orale, this is good shit Larsson.
Your written english is better than my written spanish could ever be!
There are always two sides to the story. Latin American countries tend to have really shitty pasts. Cuba is no exception. The USA certainly likes to do a lot of finger-pointing when it comes to Cuba though, despite having used the country as an adult Disneyland many years prior.
Batista wasn’t any better than Castro. The only difference between him and Castro was that the U.S. gave him the stamp of approval.
He was turning Cuba into a mobsters paradise. It was gonna be a Las Vegas of the Caribbean. His regime was also terribly racist.
Oh, ok. You went there a few times, saw people doing things that people in a lot of countries do, had a good time, and that’s it? That’s all it takes to make a blanket statement about the negative aspects of a government, and its effects on its people, as nothing but propaganda? I had no idea. I guess Dennis Rodman knows more about North Korea than the defectors, reporters, websites, and everyone else who has looked into and provided information on how that regime works behind the curtain, since he played HORSE with Kim Jong Un on multiple an occasion. You had a Cuban relative who praised it? Yeah, I have relatives who are religious and who praise God. I guess that means that the church was right and wholesome the whole time and their leaders never did anything shady that negatively effected people. Lord forgive me, those priests were only molesting children with the scripture.
Honestly, I hope I’m misreading this and you’re talking about some direct specifics about Cuba that you can actually speak to from your time there, and not trying to dismiss stories about Castro, the inner workings of his regime, and the experiences of Cubans that lived under and fled that regime for reasons related, giving their own stories as testimony for doing so, as nothing but propaganda by the US using just your experience as a basis. Because otherwise you sound like the kind of idiot who would spend one session with some Jehova’s Witnesses and come back telling Manx he’s the one that’s been wrong the whole time. And I tell you, it’s hard for us to be the ones drinking kool aid when you chug the entire jug in one go first.
He’s been here (in Cuba). You haven’t. Yet, somehow, you know more than him. You’ve got to be kidding me.
@Pablo_the_Mex: Thanks, man. The amount of misinformation in this thread is disgusting. I’m just trying to make people understand.
Actually, I don’t think I necessarily have to go to Cuba to “know” more than anyone else who’s been there, depending on what that knowledge is about. Just like I don’t have to go to North Korea, China, Syria, the UK, France, Germany, Russia, Brazil, or Papa New Guinea to get an idea of how those countries are run, what their laws are, how the people live, their economics, their social structures, or their internal politics and affairs, because a lot of this information is provided (or in some cases, leaked), and is available to look up easily in a variety of places. Information which is generally provided by those who are already there, were there, etc. None of us need to go anywhere to learn about another country; a lot of us discuss the shit going on in places in these threads without having to. I don’t think you need to come to the US to learn about how some of our people are and how our government is, not when you can just read our government thread about it at the least. But if you think I need to go to your country to fulfill some nonexistent requirement to qualify me to discuss it, then you’re the one who’s kidding who. And I would appreciate if you kindly stop that. But to answer your question, yes, it’s possible to know more in spite of just going there.
But in any case, this is nowhere near my point. Way to miss it entirely. But I’ll explain it again – Simply saying you went somewhere and saw a few good things means jack shit if you try to make a blanket claim of the criticisms of Castro and his regime as “propaganda”, because you’re not explaining what the propaganda is and how you learned it’s false. I could go to Cuba right now, have a good time, bring back some ropa vieja and a souvenir spoon, and tell everyone how great it was. I’m pretty sure very little of what I experience has anything to do with what a lot of your people claimed to have experienced, or would involve the aspects or areas of your country their claims are relevant to. So what I see and do there would have no effect on the validity of what they say. I’m guessing you know a good bit about how fucked up my country is in terms of it’s government’s antics and how it has effected people. Imagine if someone you knew came to the US for a bit, and came back to you claiming that everything bad you heard about the US was all lies, and tried using this line of reason as their basis. What are the odds you’re gonna give him that “The fuck you talking about?” look in a similar way I gave it? Just like I, along with a lot of people, are fully aware of how the Cult of Scientology really works, which is why if I took a trip to their church and listened to Tom Cruise go on for an hour about what they do and how great it is, that hopefully I don’t come out thinking L. Ron Hubbard was a great visionary. If that’s all it would take for one to think that everyone who left that Cult after a significant amount of time with consistent negative stories about it were all lies, then it’s still a stupid way to have one’s mind changed (or an easy way to brainwash it, pick one).
Now I get you’re probably happy in Cuba and that it’s great for you under a dictatorship (and that’s what it is, just so we’re clear), and you credit the Castro regime for it, so I don’t expect you to do much other than defend it. But that’s not how it was for thousands of people who fled that country. And your idea that they did so to, what was it, “take advantage of the US preferential treatment to Cuba when it comes to migration”, sounds bullshitty, and I wonder who it was who told you that. Because it opens up some serious questions, such as why leave at all, if not for the goal of living somewhere that was not ruled by Fidel? If things were not as bad as Cuban immigrants have said it is when they come here, then why do they say it is? Why consistently tell stories of themselves and people they’ve known being arrested, held without trial, tortured in horrible prison conditions, never seen again, etc, if it’s not true? And more importantly, why celebrate Fidel’s death heavily in the streets, if they did not despise the man for these reasons?
But you wanna talk about misinformation? Then I tell you what. I’ll throw a few things out here, and you tell me how much of the following is just that. And this isn’t shit that comes from our media. This is stuff I found just from the results of various Google searches.
http://www.therealcuba.com/ - Check the links to the different sections near the top.
Video:
Spoiler
Have a nice day.
You kinda missed my point, too. I did not say you were not qualified to discuss because you hadn’t been here. Don’t put words in my mouth. I simply meant he’s got all the info you have PLUS he’s been here. He’s been able to compare what he’s been told with what he’s actually experienced. And he wasn’t here spending vacations or having a “good time”. He was living here. It is not the same. So yeah, I’d dare say he’s more qualified than you.
I didn’t say I’m happy. I even said I want to move to Canada because our freaking economy sucks and it’s hard to live here economy wise (seriously, read what I wrote please). Obviously, you don’t know shit about our immigration arrangements with the US. Nobody told me anything. There’s a stupid act, a freaking law (born in the US, of course) that gives preferential treatment to Cuban immigrants. It is called “Ley de Ajuste Cubano” which translated would be more or less “Cuban Adjustment Act”. It even says it in the title. Its core is very simple: if a Cuban immigrant sets foot on US soil, he will be admitted there. If he’s caught in the sea, he’ll be returned to Cuba. Surely I don’t need to explain why this is preferential. (There’s also a plethora of other ways that make super easy for a Cuban to go over to the US. I explained in an earlier post the human right and politic refugee status fabrications). But, of course you don’t know such act exists. If you do, then you just don’t know the meaning of the word preferential. That sounds bullshitty to you because you know nothing of this matter, but hey, “let’s just shut this Cuban shit up with claims and guesses…and what I’ve heard”. Good for you. Way to properly discuss.
Those stories of people arrested, held without trial, tortured in horrible prison conditions, never seen again? Dude, you’re depicting Batista’s regime, not Fidel’s. Do you know that all the torturers and killers of Batista’s regime were actually tried on national and international TV? Of course you don’t know that. See? There’s actually A LOT you don’t know. I’d say you are kinda disqualifying yourself.
I also know what a dictatorship is. If you (once again) read what I’ve wrote, then you’ll see I’ve never denied anything in that regard. I even pointed out that a tyrant (which is what people here are calling Fidel) and a dictator are two very different things. Just people don’t know shit about that either.
Who the hell celebrated in the streets? A band of Miami folks? Of course they would. If you didn’t see that coming, then you know nothing about US-Cuba relationships. If you’re talking about some footage you may have watched of a bunch of people celebrating here in Cuba (I’m making assumptions here cause I haven’t seen anything like that here, but who knows?) then I have a question for you: Have you ever met anyone that absolutely everybody likes? No. Not even freaking Ghandi!
Did you hear that a minute of silence was dedicated in the UN to honor Fidel in his passing? And he hasn’t even been the head of state for years. Did you listen to all those representatives of many countries praising him at that very UN session? After all you’ve claimed, I doubt it.
Get your facts straight, man. Sorry if I sounded a little harsh. I’d be more than happy to discuss further.
At no point did he specify what claims about Cuba were propaganda, why they’re propaganda, or how his experience proved that it was propaganda. Look back at the entirety of that post. All that gets said is, “I lived there a few times, people helped each other, and I saw first hand how they helped other countries in the area.” That last part I really roll my eyes at, because there’s no details given of this “first hand” account.
Here’s the post in question in its non-descriptive entirety:
Spoiler
Where are the actual details? Where are the comparisons? What about this “1st hand” account? How can anyone “know” more than anyone if they’re gonna be this vague when trying to dispute something? Give some actual details and explain the position, this was the crux of my argument. Once again, I’ll say it. If this is all you’re gonna say about your “experience” in another country, then you’re not adding that much to the discussion.
Then my apologies for assuming you were happy there. And you’re right I did not know about this law, I admit. But the reason I said it sounds bullshitty to me is because, by itself, it’s a bullshit reason to move to another country, which is why I’m still going to call it that. Because even if it is that easy for you to immigrate here, it still does not mean that their motive is to “take advantage” of it, or that it’s the sole or driving reason why so many people left Cuba for the US. Because it would make no sense to just up and leave one country for another simply because it’s easy to. I don’t buy that the majority of those that immigrated did it simply for that. You’d need a better reason to take up such an offer, such as something (or a collection of somethings) within your own current residence causing you to decide you would rather live somewhere else. You’ve just said your reason for wanting to leave, they had theirs, and some of theirs weren’t pleasant.
And those “claims and guesses”? I put those links there so you could at least gloss over their contents, and be willing to point out what’s false about them. If you have that information and knowledge that confirms / contradicts it, then put it on the table. Show us what you got, where you got it from, etc.
First of all, I’m aware of the executions of Bautista’s men after the revolution. Second, I’m not the one depicting Bautista’s regime instead of Fidel’s. This is what people from your country, who went to your country, who investigated and wrote about your country and Castro, said about Castro’s regime, not Bautista’s. Those links I gave you are just some of the results of that information. You wanna get on us for being “misinformed”, when a significant amount of this information comes from people who were born, lived, and left Cuba. One of the same reasons information about the shadiness of other leaders / governments / religions / organizations come to light. People who were there and have the inside experience tend to be the ones who give that shit out. But again, if it’s false, why didn’t more Cubans come here with abject praise of the guy? Why is the vast majority of it negative? When’s the last time Cuba allowed someone from outside to independently investigate these claims to prove them false? Wouldn’t they want to show off that it’s false? Or is that proof somewhere else?
I remember you saying that Castro wasn’t the dictator, Bautista was, so that’s probably why I said that. Or I was being dickish. But whatever. This isn’t about the differences between authoritarians so I’ll let this go.
Of course I’m talking about the people in Miami (or anywhere else they were doing it). But in Cuba? I doubt it. Not unless his death came via another revolution, and the victors were the ones cheering. But also because your country’s reputation says you would be in a shitload of trouble if you did. And no shit not anyone is universally liked. That’s not the point. The point is that those people celebrated because they hated him. Reviled him. Would probably have tried to destroy the Hearse carrying his body if it drove through Little Havana. You have to wonder what went on in their lives in Cuba for them to gather en masse to celebrate someone’s passing, don’t you? What happened to them, their parents, grandparents, etc. that would cause that level of hate for someone? The video I linked is titled “This is why Cubans hate Castro.” I think the people in that video are more than happy to tell you why.
No, I didn’t see that. And even if I did, what would that have to do with what we’re arguing over? The UN and all these leaders who praised him in death did the opposite numerous times when he was alive (including Obama). I’m not trusting their official stance on a country’s leader having changed all that much now that he’s dead.
No one cares about sounding harsh on SRK. As for my facts being straight, the only thing I’m doing is telling you why it is people think so negatively of Castro, and where it comes from, and gave you some links. What you do with all of this is your call.
Well, if you don’t see how someone, regardless of given arguments, has a better perspective on the matter just because he lived here, there’s nothing else I can do to make you understand. I’ll just leave it there.
The reason why people in Cuba goes to live in the US taking advantage of the preferential treatment is the same reason almost all Latin America has: the desire of a better life. That’s not just Cuba, I hope you know that. Of course you don’t just leave your country because it’s easy to do it. I’ve been stressing in almost every post I’ve made that the reason is economical, not political. The majority of Cuban immigrants don’t care about politics, but they get to Miami and start claiming false political reasons and human rights bullshit because they get money by doing so. I’ve said it many times and I’ll say it again: it’s a business. People close to me have done that…and they come every year to Cuba. They don’t want to leave because of human rights, or they are running away from political persecution, they just want to live better. Those are facts that I have and cannot provide a link for. Because that’s what I see every day. I get it from experience, not articles and interviews.
People know better than going to Miami praising Fidel. They just don’t appreciate the idea of dying or getting a beatdown. I know a lot of immigrants in Miami that were sad for Fidel’s passing but could not open their mouths because of fear. It works like that.
I confess I did not check your links because I’ve read so much stuff like that and it’s always the same bullshit. They state 2 or 3 facts and then it’s all lies. I’ve even had a laugh or two when reading all the silly things they tend to repeat about Cuba. If I read all of what you linked and found the same lies, then I would tell you so, and you would tell me to provide proof, and then I would say I live here and I know it’s all lies. I’m just gonna save us that.
I can’t watch the video because of bandwidth. I’m on freaking dial up here at home hahaha. I’d have to go and download it (or watch it) and that takes money, which I use to download and watch fighting game vids. I could download it at work too, but again, if I’m gonna download something it’s gonna be tekken, street fighter or mortal kombat stuff hehe
I know I’m not gonna convince folks around here just with my words, but that’s what I have and it should be enough, but it isn’t. Too bad it’s like that.
It’s true no one cares about sounding harsh, not just on SRK, but on the Internet as a whole. The thing is…I’ve had my share of forum arguments and I’d rather avoid them. It’s just pointless in the end. A peaceful debate is always nicer.
Then I don’t think this conversation goes any further. Because at this point it’s going to be nothing more than us repeating the same shit over and over, and I think it’s time for this thread to die already.
But I will leave it with this reply:
If you think your words should be enough then you don’t need to be debating anyone, because you won’t get far with most people. If one’s word were all anyone needed, we’d take everything anyone says on faith and no one would bother backing up their claims. That’s not how it works, nor should it. It’s basically your word against theirs and that’s it.
And move to Canada so you can get real internet. Dial-up. Jesus.