Evo 2k8 Smash (not rules discussion)

Classic Fighting Games Super Smash Brothers Brawl
24

That means that M2K, PC Chris, Forward, Isai, and pretty much every PRO is a “scrub.”

I think you may be the scrub, new to the smash bros series thinking you know everything about the game play and mechanics behind SSB.

I’m not even going to get into an argument with you because you clearly don’t have the intellect.

At least after this is over we won’t have to worry about this tournament. The real smash community has their own underground tournaments which will be far more competitive and successful. One tournament isn’t going to change the community. This tournament is pretty much a leisure activity.

25

It makes me sick too that there were only like 5 tournaments that were 200+ in attendance set up by the community in the past couple months…

26

guys, play nice. There is hope that these two communities can work together to make many successful smash tournaments using different rulesets. Who’s to say that items play can’t coexist side by side with SWF play? Both communities have scrubby players, and both communities have enterprising pioneers. Let’s ignore both sets of scrubs and get along.

maybe it’s just wishful thinking.

27

That’s kind of the argument most are trying to make here. No one is insisting that items play is better than no-items play. I’ve been preaching the co-exist argument for months now to those lambasting those for items play, and it seems to be a futile attempt.

28

This right here.

Like I’ve said before, item play people tend to understand and accept non-item play. The majority of non-item play people tend to laugh off items and actively seek to put down anyone who enjoys them. I also said before I prefer non-items but I also like items a lot. If more people would just stop bitching and get a long then Evo would have the SWF people attending AND throwing a huge side non-item tournament. That way the best of both worlds could be happening all at once.

Would also be nice to have item side tournies in SWF events, but yeah I doubt it will happen.

29

^^ Pretty much what I was saying before, too.

Smash can be played so many different ways. Why does it have always boil down to one or the other as an ‘accepted’ standard when neither are mutually exclusive? Just because items tournaments are going on doesn’t mean ‘no item’ is ever going to go away or suddenly become less prevalent or interesting.

Options. If you like items, can accept the randomness and deal with it, then items tourneys. If not, then go to and play tourneys with no items. Everyone wins ^_^.

30

you can’t even quote right why make out i wrote that i was just agreeing. you don’t like it keep your tourneyfag shit to yourself.

and also items are put in the to make it more balanced and FUN. smash brothers is not a game to take seriously. all the guys you mentioned are losers and are still virgins

31

i can’t believe you could actually calling when scrub it comes to smash brothers lol it not that type of fighting game. have fun for fuck sake

32

Hello Mr.Troll, perhaps you should leave instead of spouting nonsense.

33

Big surprise, someone who is “open-minded” to items play says that SSB games are not real fighting games/not to be taken seriously/etc… (ancient oldfag SRK attitude that kept SSB from being in EVO despite it being more popular than all of the games they play there).

34

Wrong. Try again.

SRK is not EVO. EVO wanted Melee in 2k4. Nintendo said “not unless you pay us”. That ended it right then and there. Had that litigation issue not sprung up then, we’d probably have had Melee in EVO since 2k4, and funny enough, the Cannons practically insisted items in back then as well, during the time when the debate was splitting the community. Not only would we have had Melee in EVO for years, but chances are much greater that items play would co-exist along no items play since then and even through today, like it should.

35

See I had no problem with items on tourneys being around, just I wouldn’t go to them. At all. And neither would anyone else who wins items off tourneys or places even okay and has fun at items off tourneys consistently. Just when a huge tournament that is supposed to be the pinnacle of competition for our nation, and other nations, for fighting games takes a party game approach to the rules. A ruleset that is:
A)Not accepted by the general tournament playing population as competitive.

B)Not accepted by anyone that has ever earned money from an items off tournament.

C)Not accepted by anyone who was on the MLG pro circuit for Melee and is now winning tournaments in brawl.

D)And pretty much only accepted by SRK members who have wi-fi tournaments with 75M and haven’t won a real, in person, tournament, or placed well against anyone who is well known in smash.

It seems like if you wanted them to live side by side you wouldn’t politically force the ruleset on the biggest fighting game tournament to the opposition of the actual community and not this sub-community with hardly any members that only play wi-fi tourneys at a very low level competitively.

“SRK is not Evo”

That’s why the Admin here, makes the rules for a tournament of a game he doesn’t play, for EVO. SRK isn’t EVO they just share the same high ranking members and decision makers.

Anyone play RTS games competitively? I have played Red Alert 2, we petitioned Westwood to turn off crates for ladders since they were random spawning item boxes that could give you a high ranked weapon at the start, but usually gave you unit promotions and money. They could greatly offset the battle if someone got to one first, and if it just spawned near his base. They eventually turned them off. That’s called listening to your users. Now that was only the top 1000 ranked that wanted those off. There were still a good 29k-49k other players monthly that didn’t care, and never gave an opinion. Or my friend who played allied, who had the chrono commando who had a slight advantage in mid game to get crates wanted them on, but that’s because it was practically imbalanced. Point being, a company that thought they were doing the right thing, owed up and said, wow maybe we shouldn’t have crates on, making it a leveled playing field between high ranked and super low ranked people is actually counter-productive to competition!

For a more recent competitive example, how about DotA the immensely popular map mod for Warcraft 3 that is worldwide a very travelled e-sport at the moment. You make a tournament, it had better be -xl mode, which is extended league mode, a long time formed, reformed, refined mode that is designed to be more competitive. If you make it -dm (deathmatch) it would be considered a joke, and for some randomness how about -id, where the items drop whenever you die (random slot will drop). Items on tournament in smash is the equivalent of crates on in Red Alert 2, -id in DotA, the option that makes you go faster when you aren’t in 1st in any racing game, etc…

Not only that, but no proof was ever provided (by the definition of THIS community’s proof that they required for items to be off) for why they had half the items turned off, some stages turned off, and smash balls off. No response was officially given for why they never gave proof of this, and I’d like to see where the deliberation took place that decided that the fan was overpowered, or that smash balls were overpowered.

36

I’m sorry, but that’s just not the case as I see it. The people who came to this forum trying to actually argue against items were chased away by people who appeared to be trolls. The creator of the ISP thread here, on AiB, and on SWF is originally an SWF’er.

I’ve seen so much hate against people who don’t like to play w/items on this forum that I almost left this site for good.

In general I find items fun, but I think they stagnate the strategic development of the game. With items on, I’m more likely to try to use items to beat a character like Snake than I am to try to out-think him, and that kind of game will get boring after a year or so.

Keep in mind this is just my opinion, and I am not a tournament organizer in any capacity.

:edit:

@Aberu,

Actually, there was a gamespot tournament recently with items on using three player FFA as the standard game format, and it was won by a respected socal smasher, so people will play for $ regardless.

also, smash balls are on. X_X

37

knock it off kids.

You know what i’m talking about.

38

There’s a lot of tripe here, but I will respond to this -

Yes, the members of EVO staff are members at SRK. Go figure. Fact you’re missing, which I had stated above, is that the voice of SRK does not equal the voice of EVO. SRK fully supports EVO as their tourney of choice, but that doesn’t mean a damn thing. EVO staff not only likes Smash, but has wanted it around since 2k4, in SPITE of SRK having a large amount of unrelenting, unwarranted hate towards the series. Claiming that EVO is “out to get the Smash community” is a ludicrous accusation.

39

Wrong. I’ve placed well in every SWF run tournament I’ve been to and each time well known players have shown up. So I suggest you get that attitude out of here. It’s getting annoying bringing this up constantly, but I won’t accept people putting down our community out of ignorance.

P.S - Wobbles supports Evo and he is a known SWF player.

40

Strider fucking Hiryu! But seriously man, you weren’t alone. Just because you were the only consistent pro-items poster in the thread for a long time doesn’t mean you had no support.

To address the all-or-nothing fallacy, why should we not be allowed to choose reasonable items? We don’t use all stages, do we? Let’s say there were two versions of Smash. One with only Mr. Saturns. One with Mr. saturns and an item that is distributed completely randomly, and makes the user win the match. If items are reasonable in the first, why not just Mr. Saturns in the second? Surely this means we should use all stages. And, as I have argued before, if randomness is your argument, items or no is simply a matter of degree. Now, with that said, I cannot, at this point in time, argue what the correct degree of allowance should be. That is why it is imperative that we test everything we can.

Sorry for turning this into another item war. Best to lock it now.

Edit: had to quote this. Quoted for fallacy.

And yeah, best to infract me. I clearly broke the rules. But if not for rules discussion, what is this thread for?

41

yep your right smash brothers doesn’t deserve to be at evo with shit rules they give it

42

I wonder how long this thread will last.

43

@chipp,

it’s not that you shouldn’t be allowed to ban certain overpowered items, but when asked about items the non-item community was asked to provide video evidence of each item being broken, which it never did. When this ruleset came out several items were turned off without anyone providing evidence of them being broken. I think the problem people like AZ have with this is the clear hypocrisy shown here. If items are going to be on, then every item not proven broken should be allowed.

I think that’s not an unreasonable viewpoint.