I’m thinking I might want to use U1 in the Dhalsim match-up. I wasn’t getting very many opportunities to land U2 on him.
Dhalsim is buff in SSF4, he’s going to be a real problem.
Rufus is still a rough match-up, but a few of his things against Fuerte are a bit different/nerfed so it’s not quite as bad as it was.
THawk is Fuerte’s bitch, he doesn’t have lariet like Gief, you can realy mess with him on wake-up because tortilla is safe from tomahawk or whatever his flying move is called.
Zangief seems easier with U2, but the Gief I was playing doesn’t main him so I can’t be so sure.
Ibuki is looking to be a rough match-up - her pressure on wake-up is difficult to get out of and she has a really good back dash. She also seems to do that annoying reeling thing that Ryu/Rufus do when you RSF sometimes making it whiff, though it’s only happened a few times I am not quite sure of the situations where it happens. Any of her slide ground throw(no idea what its called) can be U2’d on block though. Also her standing spin kick special.
Guy can really pressure you, but I think it’s a fairly even match-up. U2 grabs a number of his wake-up options so once you have Ultra he can’t mess with you quite as much.
About Seth, I always thought of it as one of the hardest matchups for Fuerte, I don’t recall seeing a video of Fuerte winning against a good Seth, but there aren’t much vids out there to begin with. As for advice on the matchup, this is the best one I read so far from the Beating Fuerte thread (its from a Seth player’s prespective, but it does offer advice for both Seth and Fuerte to deal with this matchup):
by HawkinsT: "Have to say I disagree with the seth advice, I use jump back fierce on reaction all the time to zone elf’s - jump back at the last minute and if they do anything other than stop/continue running you can punish it with this.
tanden engine will suck elf out of his run for a free combo, and legs will also catch elf out of his run (ex legs will do the same but also with invincibility), as will seths super and ultra. Elf’s wall jump is punishable on reaction by srk > combo, super and ultra
Both srk and spd beat a large number of elf’s end of run options and seths teleport can quite effectively get him out of mixups.
While I haven’t really played any elf’s of note, just random g1/4000bp players online, this match up does feel quite strongly in seth’s favour to me at about 6.5-3.5 (but like I just said this is only from my own, limited experience). I think of the seth matchup a bit like the gief matchup though - just elf is a bit better at getting in. Seth should be trying to keep elf at full screen and punishing elfs attempts to get in, elf should be trying to lock seth in the corner, trying to catch any attempts by seth to wall jump out (which is in seths interest to try and do) with his guacamole slew, and keeping the pressure on. Also rsf is a very important tool for elf in this match seeing as seth has only 750 stun (same as his health).
Best ways for elf to get close to seth I think are run > stop > guacamole slew to bait seths jumping fierce - this move seems to have fast recovery for elf so afaik it’s hard to punish if whiffed. And also elf’s ex run, which remember tanden and legs will suck/hit you out of, so I guess with this a lot of run stop fakery is good trying to bait seth in to one of these moves (if he does legs and its blocked you will be at enough frame advantage for rsf I think). tanden whiffing is also the time you want to be getting in close with wall jump.
Anyway, those are my thoughts on the match up, would be interesting to hear an elf players perspective on this. "
Btw, does ultra 2 look helpful in the Seth matchup?
Regarding Dhalsim, Fuerte had a slight advantage over him in Vanilla. Now I wouldn’t mind seeing it going even since Sim got a lot of buffs, but I hope its not the opposite now with Sim having the advantage instead, Can someone who tried this matchup in Super talk a bit more on how it has changed?
The aggressive seths are hard. That’s how arturo plays me and how all the seths that give me any trouble at all run it that way. I’d say that seth is 5-5 if the seth knows the match and plays in your face, whoever gets on the back foot is going to be in real big trouble. If the seth is trying to tapdance around and run from you though it’s like 8-2 fuerte without breaking a sweat. If you’re losing to this style of seth that means you’re in a hurry and playing sloppy. He can’t hurt you from over there, relax and stop running into shit. Especially jumping fierce. This is so unsafe vs. fuerte it’s not even funny. All your guacs beat it, even the non ex ones. Your jumping roundhouse beats it clean damn near every time. You can ex run and absorb it, and get a free slide on his landing that he can’t block. You can airthrow it or ultra it if you are close to him when he attempts it.
Preliminary reports suggest that hakan is free to everyone. I am inclined to agree, he looks fucking horrible. I’m not particularly scared of that guy, I’d be willing to bet that it’s possible to even safe tortilla that ultra where he lathers up and lays down if you just aim back far enough. Of course I could be wrong, who knows if he has something up his sleeve.
Makoto looks like she plays like a totally different character now…I dunno if it’ll be hard or not. When I first heard about her I envisioned 3s makoto and I said “shit she’s going to rape fuerte for free”. A makoto ripped straight from 3s would completely ransack el fuerte but this makoto seems to be a more “sf4ey” style. I.E. weaker and slower and easier to get away from. Looks like after a hayate in this game you’re pretty much free to get out of jail but we shall see.
I’ve played our local dhalsim who in vanilla I would normally go even with. It feels harder getting in on him for sure but I couldnt say why. Also you never know my buddy just might have really been on his game that day. One positive I can say is that Yoga Shangrila will be pretty much useless against fuerte because he’s too hard to pin down in the right position for the ultras (what looks to be strict) range.
Makoto doesnt seem like a very hard matchup. You are pretty much free to do whatever offensively while being aware of her decent backdash. I think the only thing to really worry about with her is Ex Karakusa when you are doing your mixups. One wrong guess on fuertes part could potetially lead to ultra for her. Defensively might be a bit more of a challenge, but Makoto wants to get in, and has a hard time doing it in super without parry so pokes will probably be pretty useful for fuerte in this matchup.
I cringe thinking about possibly reading this in like 6 months when the game will be figured out for the most part and be very different from my initial impressions lol.
Thanks guys for all the impressions and advice, can’t wait to get the game!
Regarding Seth, Yes I have a very hard time against one particular Seth in out offline scene, he has an extremely aggressive Seth and is easily the best one I played. I played with many others online and I manage to beat them without too much trouble (unless there is lag or I am off on my game), but an aggressive Seth makes the match very hard to deal with. I still don’t have much experience with this kind of Seth playstyle, so I tend to view it in Seth’s favor, I hope I get a chance to practice the matchup more in Super. Does anyone see ultra 2 doing anything to help in this matchup? How good is it in punishing teleports?
I can vouch for safe tortilla NOT working against Hakan’s ultra. But TBH i couldve aimed it a bit further back. Its looking really favourable for us, but Hakan is going to be one of those characters who comes into his own a lot slower than the rest of the cast.
The best seth player in my area is dropping him because he feels the nerfs are too much for him. With that said, I had a hard time before super but now it seems he can do less options when he’s doing his rushdown. Don’t count me on this though.
I’m going to have to agree with halcyon. I do notice when Seth players are running it’s easy to get them. They are scared. Baiting teleports is cake and just like he said, slow down and stop running into dumb shit.
I just got my computer fixed (been posting via iPhone) so I’ll be able to update the matchup thread very soon.
I’ve read halcyonryus zangief tactic, and trying to use it as much as I can when playing lately. That’s no longer safe if Gief has Ultra II though, he grabbed me out of the air with it a couple times.
I still don’t have the game, but from what I read, Rufus U2 screws a lot of characters that have mixups and crossups, but at least Fuerte can trade with a splash (is that right?). If both Fuerte and Rufus go for U2, how does the matchup turn out? Rufus also got -100 hp nerf if what I read was right, shouldn’t that help a bit? I remember that one of my major frustrations when fighting Rufus is that I keep hitting him and his health doesn’t seem to even move. On top of that, there was no way for me to connect an ultra on him at all, so I had to take out his 1150 hp with Fuerte’s low damage moves. Now, it looks like both issues are fixed, though I am still not sure if U2 will scare Rufus as much as his U1/2 scare us.
It’s wierd though. I’m gonna double check but if I’m right. Then it’s a handy tool.
She can Kunai after penguin kick. Which was when I stumbled on this. I wanna see if it beats her slide grab. Doubt it. But might as well. I wanna see how many of her moves get beat by it. I had a feeling qbomb was gonna be useful against her.
I see qbomb and the first thing I feel like screaming is Fuckyourshit bomb!
Also. Jesus. Fuerte can NOT cook, to say his cooking is destructive is an understatement I was laughing during both intro and ending.
Dude gives a guy food, dude is on the floor dying and he striking a pose LOL. And don’t get me started on his cooking at the end.
Any fuerte that doesn’t use U2 all the time is crazy. It is better than U1 in every single way. As far as matchups go…
Dhalsim is still free for fuerte.
Juri is the most annoying out of all the new characters with her wheel kick pressure, dive kick although its punishable on block, and her counter move she’s prob gonna be the toughest.
Gief still free
And all shoto matchups are a bunch easier now because now if they just throw fireballs at u and let u build U2 they really can’t pressure u without getting punished after fuerte is movin up : ).