I didnt say is 60/40 all the time
It changes during the situation during a match, Both makoto and Chun have the advantage when they are in control of the round, while both Ken and Yun have equally ways to loose it.
Yeah…that’s true. The momentum can change a bit when Yun is without meter but generally…Yun still has the advantage over Makoto IMO. I still like Yun over Makoto in their matchup overall though.
DevilJin :
Can you explain why ibuki has the advantage against urien ? I’m interested.
Matchup ratings don’t change in the middle of a game. They represent the overall outcome. Otherwise there would be several different ratings per matchup as the rounds go on, meters change, and characters position themselves differently. Ken with meter beats a cornered empty Yun probably 8-2. But we all know that doesn’t matter in the grand scheme of things.
Tough to get certain Aegis setups to work on her because of the way her hitbox works. If the Urien player is off with the timing/placement of the Aegis she can dash out of it or df+MK slide through it. Ibuki’s pokes generally beat Urien’s especially when followed up with option select parries and s.MK. You can kinda just throw around s.MK and if it hits…punish. If you parry one of his normals…s.MK to whatever and so on. Urien also has no real options to stop her rushdown other than to guess parry or throw out EX Aegis.
There are other things like EX headbutt but that can be stuffed out by some of Ibuki’s better pokes and doesn’t really guarantee you’ll get out. Which is why you’ll see Japanese Ibuki players run long ass poke strings on him while he is blocking. There generally isn’t a whole lot he can do about it and it helps give Ibuki the momentum she needs.
At the same time though the match is only in a slight advantage for Ibuki (6-4 for Ibuki according to charts). IMO a 6-4 match in 3S is definitely winnable for either character. Especially if you are confident against your opponent’s play style. It’s not something where if Urien is your main u should be like “well crap…I gotta use Chun now!”
Once Urien gets that good knockdown he can play the throw mind games or start up the Aegis. If you set up your Aegis well it’s just as tough for Ibuki to get out as any character. Getting placed in the corner when he has meter can mean a lot of trouble. If you catch Ibuki with a sphere while she’s airborne…GG’s. Ibuki’s health is obviously very low which allows him to eaily turn things right back around. Getting hit by Urien’s c.HP is obviously big trouble as well.
IMO i believe Yang is a bad match up for Remy for several reasons…in my experience most remy’s tend to try to keep away with the LOV’s but when it comes to dive kicking over or under one its an easy entrance for a low mk, EX zorro which builds significant stun damage on remy…also plus the fact that Remy would need to charge to attack accordingly…plus Zenou Tenshins tend to catch most of them while charging…a nice rush down from yang will put him in his place…this is from my experience though…anyone else have thoughts
vs Remy- Yang
Remy vs. Yang…yeah it just comes down to the fact that Yang’s rush is stronger than Remy’s keepaway. Remy will still need to get in to win the match (LOV’s by themselves don’t beat anyone) and dive kicks make it easier for Yang to get in. Yang also has teleport but that’s kinda risky since a good Remy has ways to punish on reaction. Generally…once you get in with Yang…it’s real tough for Remy. One EX Zorro (LOL) puts him under more pressure than anything he can put you in.
I say the matchup is definitely more winnable for Remy than his matchup vs. Yun. Yun isn’t necessarily known for his ability to raise the stun but Remy still has below average health and Genei Jin takes plenty advantage of that. Especially when Remy doesn’t really do damage to begin with. Winning with Remy requires you to draw the match out for long periods of time unless you somehow get a knockdown.
TOO many K.O yang vids im afraid lol…im gonna start saying that from now on :-p
another one for me would be vs Makoto due to the fact that a few players tend to abuse the hayate’s and leave themselves open immediately…which would allow yang to follow up on reaction with a st.lk, EX ZORRO then comes Zenou Tenshin with a st.mk into w/e then yang could land and cross up from either side depending on how early the attack was…same with yun and his st.lk, lp dash punch
IMO
vs Makoto- Yang and Yun (better even though she has more strength)
dudley’s worst matchups are chun and ibuki and akuma, oro gives him trouble too, I feel a smart makoto has the advantage on Dudley also, the reason dudley is usually tiered high is because he has good matchups against most of the better characters, and his “random” damage factor is high, he loses to anyone who can consistently anti air him, which small, mobile characters tend to do easier. smart twins beat dudley most of the time too, just his damage is high enough to keep the match from really getting away from him.
Ryu has obvious trouble against Ken, seeing as Ken is almost always one step ahead in the battle, and has a wider range of options, as well as the obvious perks of Shippu over Shinkuu.
Another trouble spot for Ryu is Yang. While Ryu has huge damage potential on his side, a good Yang rush-down is hard for Ryu to stop.
Honestly,though, I think apart from the top 3 Ryu can go toe-to-toe with anybody without any glaring disadvantages. In matches where he loses on mobility he has damage, and vice versa.
That’s why I think it’s better to use denjin Ryu. At least then, you have different tools and options open to you instead of just being a weaksauce version of Ken.
Urien’s worst is Gouki:
Has to red parry hurricanes to escape spam
Gouki has to be blockstringed into Aegis setups
Urien can get hit by early and late demon kicks
Urien has no “good answer” to pressure, something Akuma’s pretty good at!
Air fireball stuffs everything
Urien still has Aegis and…Aegis.
Urien is definitely one of the few characters who’s crappiest match probably isn’t one of the top tiers. Chun Li isn’t a ton better but again…it’s Urien and all he needs is that knockdown to start Aegis stuff. Akuma is pretty close to top tier (he’s in the high mid spot) in Japan now so it would make sense any ways. He runs dat train on people without good defensive/reversal options.
Yun isn’t too great either obviously but Aegis allows him to create a literal wall against Genei Jin. Activating from mid screen is near useless once Urien has more than 1 meter full. Urien only needs one good Aegis to do serious damage to Yun as well. Dive Kicks own him pretty nice but at least Urien can take a hit and can usually answer with serious damage after successfully parrying one. Akuma’s dive kick is worse in some ways because of how fast it recovers. If you parry anything other than a really deep Yun dive kick…you can punish. Akuma…it has to be pretty poorly timed to have a chance. The fact that Urien’s c.HP comes out in like 983424 frames doesn’t help.
Yang vs Remy from my experience is in Remy’s favor. Ex slashes aren’t as strong as you think since Remy can saII reversal after just 1 slash, so it’s quite unsafe for yang to be throwing those out.
Dash partition fireballs are not easy to divekick over, and Remy’s j.mp/j.jab shuts down a lot of yun/yangs air game.
Remy has a higher damage output than you might think. One parried divekick usually leads to a cr.fierce, lk.cbk, kara rh razor which does damage comparable to a ken kara shoryu combo. He also has one of the strongest grabs in the game (while in the corner).
i think yun is more hard because you can’t turtle vs yun … vs chunli you can turtle a lot with c.forward ,s.foward…and punish out of range c.forward with a c.jabxxsa3
j.roundhouse vs chunli is really good if you know the range. and b.fierce, c.roundhouse can punish some whiff moves like b.fierce and s.fierce (rh drill kick is un-safe he can red parry/parry and punish you with a s.roundhouse xxsa2) …you have disadvantage in priority but you have advantage in range and if you have solid patience you can win
yun is very hard. a good yun whit a solid defense… is the worst match up because the genei jin …and necro low speed and bad stamina. necro lose is air vs yun (j.fierce of yun and air chain beat every move necro have) in the ground necro can poke yun with s.foward …but some times you have troubles because yun walk so fast and he weak up so fast .necro have advantage in throw range and corner game …i pick sa3 i know sa1 maybe is more solid but you can’t try win in a solid way when the match up is 2-8 sa3 help you in your presure game more and can punish far away genei jin and far away yun moves
yun-2-8 maybe worst
chunli 7-3
ken 7-3
gouki 7-3
dudley 7-3
oro 6-4
yang 6-4 (sa1 and turtle can win vs yang)
makoto-6-4
ryu 5-5
ibuki 5-5
alex 5-5
urien 4-6
elena 4-6
remy 4-6
12 4-6
sean 4-6
hugo 3-7
Hmmm…good to know. I never thought it was terrible for Remy but that makes it sound a good bit better for Remy. Sounds like some of the same problems Yang has vs. Ken. I don’t know how the Japanese charts have him matched up vs. Yang but I wouldn’t say it’s a terrible match for either character no matter who ends up having the advantage.
well the one thing you possibly forgot is the fact that remy has the same stun bar as akuma and can easily be stunned by EX Zorro’s as quickly as akuma…whether damage is good or not…all it would take is a good rushdown and smart playing to take down remy…opinions are good though…ill look at this match up…ill see if vids can help
I agree that not tech rolling is good sometimes…I don’t do it at all anymore, cause I’d rather slow the game down (good for me). Also, if you approach SF the way it should be approached…which is like chess (always staying several moves ahead of your opponent), then match ups make little difference. The only brutal match ups are the ones where you can’t stop what you know is coming. There are very few of these. And no, I don’t agree that Q vs Makoto is that bad. I know everyone says it’s 8-2, but I see it about even.
I have heard from somewhere that there’s actually a pretty decent low tier vs. chun matchup with twelve. It still ends with twelve losing most of the time, but ive heard that he’s at a slight advantage (as opposed to other low tiers vs. chun) because most of his game revolves around air dashing, and chun’s anti-air options are few and far between. Unfortunately for our gooey friend… chun is still chun, and she eats jello for breakfast.
What? So what you saying is Chun still out due Twelve?