i would say his zoning is actually stronger than his vortex vs. honda. he has less setups from knockdown that stuff ex headbutt than any other vortex character.
So you are saying what everyone else was trying to tell you, that Akumas vortex is simply better than Goukens?
Go figure, Gouken is a mid tier character, Akuma isn’t even high tier, he is top tier.
If you guess right you can escape Akumas vortex like Goukens its just hard to guess right against him.
If you actually knew more about Akuma than what everyone can read or watch from the internet in a few minutes, you would have also stated, that there are many charcters which are nearly impossible to vortex and that there are many who he can’t sweep after his combo tatsu.
If you actually would be watching vids of top Akumas frequently like I do, you would see that against 90% of the really good opponents top Akumas don’t even try to vortex.
But since you seem to like to get your information fast you don’t need to watch frequent matches, just watch Daigo vs Infiltration FT10 and tell me, if Akumas vortex is so inescapable, why doesn’t Infiltration fucking use it against the most played and most basic characters in the cast to fucking not get 10:3ed?
I’m talking Akuma vs Us. I’m familiar with 3 frame uppercuts.
Gouken has no vortex. He has what every other character has. Safe jump set ups.
EDIT: Also, who he can use it against is irrelevant. He has it, he can use it. We have nothing like it.
Sigh… whatever you say bro… I will just keep doing what I’ve been doing and watching people having to guess out.
now this is a real Vortex… This shit is unblockable I tell you…
XD LMAO
Akumas vortex is good because it works against Gouken?
Sure the top Akumas always have to contest with tons of Goukens in top 3s in major’s that’s the ONLY reason Akuma is top tier.
In all seriousness, though everybody seems to be trolling here (I can’t even blame them:s):
Akumas vortex is not working against Ryu because he among tons of other charcters can’t be swept after a tatsu combo, it has NOTHING to do with Ryu having a dp, the vortex kills dps.
But I think this was my last serious post here as people seem to be voting who don’t even play Gouken. (They probably know little about vortexes in general or Akumas in particular either.)
So from now on I will be trolling too.
I thought we established up there that Gouken doesnt have a to-the-frame vortex like Akuma and Ibuki but he DOES have a vortex? The problem here is that half of you guys define a vortex as Akumas vortex ala anything thats ambiguous within a frame and leads to hard knock down and the other half define vortex as a series of moves on wake that require you opponent to guess 50/50 everytime.
EVERYONE is right. This is a pointless argument once again.
The answer is that Gouken doesnt have a true vortex but he has options that require you to guess 50/50 on each wake. So technically he is a vortex character. Its not a true vortex but he has options other than safe jumps that require you to guess.
Gouken is a mid tier character and we all struggle vs the rest of the cast. Why are yall fighting eachother? We are in the trenches together everyday. The fact that you guys are arguing whether he should be played zoney or rush down is ridiculous, to each his own, there is no correct way to play any character. How can anyone even argue that? Yall are giving eachother grey hairs over some shit thats debatable in either direction.
That seems to be one of the gifts the internet has brought to people. The right to get all hot in the head over some ridiculous hair splitting. It’s worked to divide an entire country, why not a few gamers?
BTW: My shit is grey already. I used to try to debate in politically charged forums and it was all downhill from there. Those sites put on crystal clear display the true nature of people. If the other guy disagrees, then it’s fair game to insult, berate and threaten him and their family and their careers and anything else. Internet warrior syndrome. It’s embarrassing. Maybe that’s why I gave a couple of people a hard time about tone here. I don’t want this forum to go down that way.
Meh… if there weren’t any idiots in the world, there wouldn’t be any geniuses…
People have been fighting since the beginning of time… so just spread the love when you can, and for the other folk tell them this…
Man its been there since they announced changes for Gouken. It seems like everyone all of a sudden forgot we are brothers in our own struggle vs the rest of the cast. “You cant do that” You cant do this" “Play Gouken this way” “No play Gouken that way”. It seems like someone can have a great post and if he says 1 debatable thing out of the 20 things said, he gets called a bitch.
I just dont get it. This thread used to be fantastic and now its seems that whenever someone doesnt agree with the next its an all out war, others then choose sides and there are constant arguments about absolutely nothing. We are supposed to be rising together with these new changes and helping people new to Gouken get up to speed. That has not happened in like 3-4 months.
I’m sure you are right Dek.
We have to do better and I am sorry for raging, too.
Sometimes we humans just argue for the arguments sake.
I’m familiar with 3 frame uppercuts too. Continues to jump in on Akuma for free… 
It’s no need to worry about the auto-correct b/c Gouken is actually in front…
Edit: These videos will self destruct within 24hrs…
And NO he can’t use U1 to escape.
His only option is to teleport out or block the set up… you can punish the teleport and you can ambig the jump in mk to hit on the other side per cross up if someone starts to just block it.
If he whiffs the DP… Blow him up for it… We can do the same thing with our dive kick too.
Just because it’s 3 frames, doesn’t mean that there isn’t a weakness to the move.
I have the actual SSF4 Hitbox Data, and I’ve figured out that the vortex isn’t unique just to only 1 or 2 characters.
It’s just some characters have more options to access it that most, and some players choose to base a certain play style around it, and it’s highly effective. You make people block your jump in or else.
Which is why the Capcom introduced delayed wake up, b/c players were/are having such a hard time to get off the ground and reset, especially characters with bad reversals atm. Characters like Gouken, Dhalsim, etc.
Anyway… I guess I will sit and wait for the next poster to want to vote me off the boards, b/c I nor Takin Flight add any value to the Gouken Forum…
To each his own I guess…
If anyone needs me, I’ll be eating a grilled cheese sandwich. XD
that Vanilla tech ahead of its time…
lemme start that selfdstrukt countdown…
3…
2…
1…,