You can’t kill anyone in a pre arranged fight and get away with it. Also, the bystanders should have stepped in after the first KO kick to the head…
Superior in what kind of way? Mma isn’t a purely one skill sport
So police are investigating this incident. I can’t see them charging the bouncer with anything.
mirror incase vid gets removed
and I was just about to post that, Haha… This is a non issue. He wont get charged for anything.
He won’t face any trouble.
Especially not after dumping them both cleanly on the pavement.
I doubt he had any control over how they fell.
I will be surprised if the bouncer faces any charges. He kept his cool, acted only when the guy charged at him and punched him only once. The fact that his opponent was prob. drunk and felt on the pavement wasn’t his fault.
Interesting to note, if you watch, at first the bouncer is in a clinch with that morron, but he doesn’t try to go to the ground for a submission, he preffers to keep standing and uses strikes.
With all the chaos only an idiot would take it to the ground.
Yo @“Sexperienced.” I really want to go back to the topic of MMA being superior to other martial arts. How does that work when MMA is a conglomeration of all many martial arts? Are we saying that a predominate combination of Muay Thai plus BJJ are the best self defense tools or just popular? How do you feel about that professional MMA fighter that said BJJ and MMA was terrible for street fighting and discussing MMA often going to the ground a terrible tactic for self defense? Do you think that because UFC is popular people associate those styles as the most effective?
As far as mma being the best example of real fighting we go back to the nineties and no holds barred fighting. Most everything was legal, low blows, fish hooking, elbows, using the gi, pulling hair. This was what a bar room brawl would look like in a cage/ring
It’s because in a nhb scenario usually the wrestler/grappler/bjj guy would score the takedown and smother the other guy with gnp or get a submission
You got Ernesto Hoost top of the line kickboxer ko’ing people. And using a clinch against guys using karate and tkd. Hell he even knocked out wrestlers. But he had a respect for grappling and would use his grappling defensively
Styles make fights. Everybody knows this. When we see Travis browne a real shitty striker ko the k-1 heavyweight champ in overeem
Or when we see mahoef get clapped.
Or when we see John Fitch get grapplefucked by Damian Maia.
You know styles make fights. It is not necessarily the disciplines in action. Most guys you see as strikers actually train their ass off in wrestling and a lot of guys are submission wizards within the gym. But the level is so high and there is so much to deal with that no matter how much you train in grappling like i am sure barboza did and he’s one of the best in the division you run into a khabib nurmagamedov
The reason you use grappling in a streetfight above striking is to nullify the situation and calm shit down.
That is my explanation. When hands fly watch as that guy who has been wrestling since he was 3 get an easy take down and just uses a hammerlock or a cradle to just subdue and wait for police.
Also in a crowded situation the clinch is used because you just want to push the guy away.
In a street fight you want to get away from it. Honestly if you kick/punch/throw a guy and he smashed his head/breaks a limb/gets hurt you are liable. He will get a lawyer and they will come for you.
The best strategy in a street fight? Run away.
Those videos on wshh of dumbasses sleeping after one shot make me cringe.
Shit like this is why nobody can take your shit you say seriously. You have never been in a fight. Or sparred really. You just do no contact mcdojo karate. Soft like spongebob. Trying to come out here trying to drop knowledge on mma and somehow persuade people that even though it is effective that it is inferior. Gtfo
A bouncer just wants to push them out of the club/bar while on the property to push out the trouble makers. They are not there to put a beating on people. They are there to prevent beatings
Why would he take him down for a submission? They wanted the individual out of the bar.
So the threw them out. They will use headlocks, guillotines, and hugs to get the individual out. Not to hurt them. They don’t want lawsuits
you need both grappling knowledge and striking knowledge. in a street fight striking knowledge is preferable because of environment, the opponent could have a weapon, being out of reach of eye pokes and groin hits or the likely scenario of multiple people. grappling is important in case you topple from a hit, or they just come crashing into you, controlling them without damage or being able to calm them down
running is good, but also romantic, what if the guy is faster than you?
some people swear by grappling because of mma back in the 90s, but none of the strikers knew anything about grappling, which is also why bjj dominance has faded away.
Sigh, I will try to reason with you one more time. I will ignore the usual personal attacks, putting words in my mouth, etc
The original ufs nhb being an example of “real fight” is a flawed argument. At first the argument seems perfect - no rules - except there WERE a couple of very important rules.
- You were fighting on a soft, clean playmat - how many street fights happens in such an enviroment ?
- You were fighting against only 1 opponent - and you didn’t have to worry about anybody else - how often does this apply in the streets ?
These 2 simple things changed greatly the dynamics of the fight and heavily favoured the grapplers, because they could take the fight to the ground without any worry, something that does not apply in the streets.
Example of unrealism in the early UFC: check out how long some of those fights took - UFC4 Gracie vs Severn took 16 min. At UFC6 Abbot vs Taktarov took 18 min. UFC7: Varelans vs Ruas 14 min. UFC11 Abbot vs Ferozzo 18 min. UFc 18 Patino vs Miletich 21 min. (btw, at UFC 18 5 out of the 7 fights ended after more than 15 min.). UFC 20 Rutten vs randelman 21 min
Oh, but what about Gracie vs Shamrock at UFC5 ? 37 min. Severn vs Taktarov at UU '95 - 30 min. Severn vs shamrock at UFC9 - 30 min
Now, how many street fights do you know that took 15 min., let alone half an hour ? how many examples can you find ? Does this seem remotely realistic to you ? Just check the above videos that were posted here, how long did they took ? If you think this is how a bar brawl looks like, then I have to question your experience in fighting.
But hey, you don’t have to listen to me - listen to this guy:
It’s a bit long, but is well worth the time. You can skip at around 4:20 - “every martial art is great for what it was created for - BJJ is great for what it was created: if you lock 2 people in a cage with a referee and let them fight until one wins, then bjj is great”.
skip to the 13 ~ “in my entire life since high school, college etc I’ve never seen a fight that was allowed to take 20 -30 min. If you are on a beach, start a fight and everybody let’s you fight until one wins, then bjj is great. But how often does this happen ?” BTw, he is a black belt in ju jitsu
Also, regarding grappling and street fights, check out this article: http://www.nononsenseselfdefense.com/grappling.html
Bottom line: "When not to use grappling: Basically don’t use it in a “self-defense” situation. Check the video above posted by furious one and ask yourself why the bouncer preffered to punch the guy instead of going to the ground for a submission.
For the record, I went to other clubs that does full contact and I did train with black belts there. When I went home, my arms were covered in bruises, my body hurt, and I had to skip the next training because my leg was hurting. But you know what ? I liked it. Actually I intend to talk with some guys in my club to buy protective gear and start doing some live sparring since I really want to test my techniques in a live enviroment.
Plus, I do not disrespect grappling (unlike you who disrepect traditional martial arts). It’s not my style, but I respect them and I aknowlege they are important. Actually I intend someday to get some training in grappling since I accept that the lack of ground defence is a big hole in karate training.
MIRACLEARROW, I was actually saying certain kicks are not the property of TKD. That’s like saying someone effectively using a roundhouse in a street fight proves the effectiveness of TKD because it’s commonly used in TKD. The exact same kicks in TKD are taught in Muay Thai and tend to be taught more efficiently in Muay Thai and delivered more devastatingly by Muay Thai fighters. Just ask Joe Rogan who’s a black belt in TKD, and I love TKD.
I also said that if you limit an MMA fighter to just stand up fighting against a TKD practitioner in a full contact stand up fight, the MMA fighter will generally dominate that fight. I think a specialist style should be superior in its field (in this case stand-up fighting) to a more broader art form like MMA which incorporates everything…
On the other hand put a Muay Thai fighter in the ring against an MMA fighter and the Muay Thai fighter will generally dominate that fight.
Which fighter said MMA is terrible in a street fight?? MMA fighting isn’t just going to the ground. MMA is not pure BJJ. Yes, BJJ is not always effective in a street fight and BJJ practitioners are aware of this, they know the limits to BJJ. Thats why MMA also incorporates boxing and Muay Thai, but to be honest BJJ on its own is far superior to 90% of martial arts around today.
UFC being popular has nothing to do with it. MMA is effective because it incorporates the most effective styles that are PROVEN to work, it’s that simple.
You haven’t even told me which other single styles are better than boxing and Muay Thai for just striking alone. You guys never give names of alternative fighting styles that are better than the ones currently used in MMA, but you still insist that MMA has flaws that other styles do not.
In my experiences, police always side with the bouncer, so that guy def isn’t getting charged with anything.
Muay Thai does not fucking teach the same kicks as TKD.
As far as stand up goes, Muay Thai’s only technical rival is Sanda, since they both allow and use mostly the same techniques. Sanda gives up a lot of clinch for straight kicks and a genuine throw game.
For the ring:
Sanda = Muay Thai = Kickboxing > Boxing > Karate = TKD (either style)
TKD is a kicking specialisation, not a standup specialisation. TKD prohibits a LOT of standup.
Yeah the guy who said “boxing is useless” now trying to critique mma?
Fucking a you got me troll
Wow, the same guy who said you can equate TKD and MMA to an extent is now saying that TKD which is a stand-up art isn’t even complete as a striking art which is what I was alluding to from the start.
You called a spinning Heel kick a TKD kick eventhough it’s used more efficiently in Muay Thai, Just like a roundhouse kick in Muay Thai generates more power but is also used in TKD to a lesser effect.
Like MMA Sanda is a MIXTURE of martial arts that WORK such as boxing, Muay Thai and Judo. It’s not a single martial art or a rival to Muay Thai because it actually incorporates Muay Thai. It emphasises stand-up fighting over the ground game but allows throwing within its rules rules so it teaches high level clinching and sprawling techniques to prevent throws. I’m subscribed to several Sanda youtube channels.
Russian Sambo is another form of MMA with different teaching methods but Both incorporate fighting styles THAT WORK.
As you even point out that TKD is incomplete as a striking art there’s no reason to pick it over Muay Thai, or even boxing.
Secondly MMA has everything anyone needs, so ditching it for another form of MMA under a different name is pretty pointless.
In so far as the Russian street fight went, the two are roughly equitable. The killer spent most of his time throwing long strikes as if he was in a point sparring or TKD match, throwing high front round kicks all over the place.
Muay Thai does not use spinning heel kicks, or spinning back kicks, as a general rule. Any occassional use is imported and popularised by TKD and Karate.
The spinning heel kick was not invented by TKD, but it was popularised and arguably perfected by it, hence why it is popular to call the kick a TKD kick.
But you don’t train it, and you didn’t read what I said. Sanda does not incorporate Muay Thai, or Judo. The kicks aren’t the same, the throws aren’t necessarily the same (though hip tossing and reaping are favourites). It isn’t a mixed martial art, despite the claims that it’s a mix of kung fu styles. It was created simply to give China it’s own national combat sport.
Sambo is basically judo mixed with European wrestling.
It is an accessory, not a primary. It’s fucking hilarious you say there’s no reason to pick it, but the top ranks of MMA are littered with people who either started in it, or cross-train it for their long-range striking and mobility.
For people who prefer to fight on the outside, TKD is an excellent base.
Define “need”, because it doesn’t have weapons training, scenario training, etc. As a combat sport, it’s great, but is just a bloodsport now. As a self-defense system, it doesn’t teach you much.
It worth noting that Muay thai, kick boxing and boxing are designed to be fought in the ring. Karate and tkd weren’t designed for ring fighting, so this ranking shouldn’t be a surprise. Even then, there are enough karate and tkd practisioners successful in ufc. Not that I consider ufc as the litmus test for what works and what not. I don’t see much wing chun in ufc, but I’m not ready to disregard that martial art solely on this.
Also, isn’t Muay thai slightly better than kick boxing ? using the elbows, clinch rules…or the difference isn’t significant enough ?
Wing chun is a shitty martial art
A wing chun guy who adheres to the shitty straight line bs would get wrecked by a guy with limited boxing training