yeaaah it’s probly 6-4 in Bison’s favor only when these two things happen:
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He has meter
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He has a lead
otherwise as you said even. But honestly it’s easy making 1 or 2 happen.
IPW January Tier list:
Super Street Fighter 4 Tier List - January?2011 - iPLAYWINNER - FIGHTING GAME NEWS STRATEGY & MEDIA
Changes from IPW’s August tier list:
(from 5-5)
Akuma 6-4
Ryu 6-4
Gouken 6-4
(From 6-4)
Cammy 5-5
Abel 5-5
Guy 5-5
Discuss
You missed one, apparently it has guile as 6-4 guile and not 7-3. Think we can all agree it’s still 7-3 in guile’s favor because barring a series of screwups on Guile’s part Bison isn’t getting in.
It’s 6-4 Guile in the August tier list as well so I didn’t list it. The IPW tier list is different from the Eventhubs/Japanese wiki tier list.
But yeah, I would say it’s closer to 7-3 than 6-4. It’s not in the same realm as any of Bison’s 6-4’s.
edit: Bison vs Akuma/Ryu is not 6-4. At least, it’s not in the same league as Guile/Bison.
I would say Bison/Abel is more in Abel’s favor, since Abel will push Bison’s shit in once he gets in f+mk range/knockdown. If he has ultra stocked, you’re dead. Not 5-5, but at least it’s not 6-4 Bison anymore.
Cammy, I don’t know, but it sounds a lot like the Abel matchup.
Gouken, I don’t know, but sure.
From what I can tell, Guy/Bison depends on who’s in the corner. Guy can stop a lot of Bison’s pressure with st.mp, but you can your alter your timing and whiff punish. Bison has more opportunities to do his low damage, but Guy makes up for it by doing more damage overall. 5-5, sure.
I don’t disagree with any of the rest of the matchups really, mostly from a lack of experience. I like that Cody/Bison is 5-5 though.
I agree with the Gouken match being in our favour. I think it’s a struggle for Gouken vs Bison.
I feel Bison Abel is 6-4 Abels favour. His damage output and comeback factor is insane in comparison to Bisons. I think it’s difficult for him once we get life lead and stay out step kick range though.
Cammy I see as 6-4 Cammy if I’m honest. I feel like she can lock down Bison in the corner. If he tries to escape she has lots of tools to punish his escape options.
I think Akuma Bison is 5-5, as is the Guy-Bison MU, Agree with the Cody MU as 5-5.
Guile Bison is 100 percent a 7-3 MU.
I actually think cammy bison is even, if not a little in bisons favor. Cammy really has to work to get in, and if you can lame her out pretty effectively.
I feel that Cammy vs. Bison is an even matchup. Bison can zone Cammy out fairly well, but Cammy is one of those characters who needs only the slightest opportunity in order to win the round. I don’t think Bison can lock Cammy down so tight that those opportunities cease to exist.
Agreed, which is why I would only give bison a slight advantage. However, while Cammy’s mixup game is good, it’s not like akuma or abel. If you just block, you’ll beat everything she does 90% of the time. Also, not being afraid of divekicks and knowing how to counter them is extremely important in the matchup.
FYI, if you ever block a divekick at the waist or higher, you can crouch jab and beat whatever she does afterward.
Escaping the corner is the same deal. Be patient, block, and wait for your opening. When they go for the crossup (hint: ALL cammy’s will eventually go for the crossup), you’re out.
At the start of the fight, you have the advantage, between forward, rh, cr fwd, focus and lk scissor kick, you can control the space in front of you and keep her from advancing. The next time you fight a cammy, don’t chase after damage (don’t try and pressure her too hard until she’s cornered), and just focus on keeping her out. As my cammy playing friend tells me “her offense is not safe” and you will be amazed at how much damage she will eat just trying to get in.
yes this is exactly what it is.
i remember asking him about the match up months and months ago and that’s pretty much what he said. he may have said 6-4 ryu’s favour when bison doesnt have meter though.
same essentially. if we sit on 2 bars or U2 ryu is pretty fucked.
does someone want to comment on this? i wanna know if i should take this advice. it sounds good, but i dont wanna follow crap if it’s not gonna work at high levels.
i actually have trouble against cammy players and ive always felt it was 6-4 her favour since vanilla. never knew how to deal with her dive kicks. a friend of mine told me that bison s.rh beats cammy dive kicks but when i tried it with him it got beat every time i tried.
If you turtle it just a little more, I think some of these match ups make a little more sense. haha
Warahk plays AndyOCR, he thinks Guile/Bison is less than 7-3
The cammy player I practice against/learned the matchup with is this guy:
[media=youtube]Pbyfw7qFzNA[/media]
Good enough?
EDIT: Also, a lot of what I do in the match is x-copied from watching AndyOCR play him in casuals at NCR :bgrin:
I really struggle against Cammy.
I know Bison has superior footsies but I don’t see how that matters much when his anti air options are very weak against her. The regular Cammy player I know just doesn’t even attempt to play footsies, he just keeps jumping at me till he gets in. Cammy’s ability to change trajectory mid air thanks to her Cannon Strikes and Ex.Cannon Strikes makes anti airing here anyway consistently very hard. Even J.HK is very difficult to anti air. Going air to air with here is also difficult because of difference in the jump arcs between the 2 characters. Bison goes over her mostly in my experience.
Once she gets in TCKS with OS Cannon Spike kills all of Bison’s wake up Ex reversals stone cold. OS Spiral Arrow kills backdash and Teleport. Even if you do get out with Ex.Psycho she can punish it on block, if she has Super or Ultra 1. So basically you have to block. But if the Cammy players good, he can mix cross up Cannon Strikes and cross up J.LK which can be hard to spot (you can block a Cannon Strik one way and after blocking she crosses over to the otherside, which adds to the confusion), as well as mix in tick throws. OS teching is pretty much useless against her. Meter building from here pressure means she has endless amount of meter for safe Cannon Spikes and Ex. Cannon Strikes. People are suggesting just block which I have been doing more recently, but that means I end up eating 2-4 throws a round.
On the other hand Cammy’s anti air’s are godly. Cannon Spike and S.HK are really good against direct jumps in. Up close her CL.MP kills jump outs, and CL.LP is absurd against cross ups attempts resetting Bison for her own cross up J.LK.
You can safe jump here at least and use the peusdo fake safe jump.
Corner trapping her is good but getting her to the corner is the problem.
I’m stumped by this one. Seems a solid 6-4 to Cammy. Its my toughest match up as one of the candidates for best player in my country plays Cammy and I struggle the most in this match up.
Lol ^^ Yeah I play Cobelcog online and he’s absolutely trashed me also. I feel your pain Azza. It also makes me question the match-up and think it’s Cammy’s favour. I just have to run away the full round.
I just can’t keep him out. Theoretically I can but I get thrown an awful lot. I also feel your pain on the fact we struggle to AA him as the cannon strike fcks up our AA’s. Any escape in the corner and I get ultra’d so I feel like I’m completely stuck.
I’m trying to use st.lk and cr.jab more against her instants but I am still struggling bigtime.
I’ll take their word for it.
Yeah Milligano, only recently has he started using OS and it really makes this match up hard.
Cobels up till recently did not use option selects, so on wake up I could get out with Ex.Psycho if he attempted to Cannon Strike me. He got into the bad habit of trying to punish the Ex.Psycho with Spiral Arrow and I got a fair amount of damage punishing that in return. Since he uses option selects that situation does not occur.
I can only pray that the height restrictions on Cannon Strike in AE removes Cammy’s ability to OS Cannon Spike, Bison’s Ex.PC. Athough Teleporting backwards (same spot) in corner does cause Cannon Spike to whiff. Though you will probably only be able to do this once or twice before an opponent cops on and starts not doing an OS. But maybe that gives you the opportunity to Ex.Psycho out.
I play him fairly regularly and the way we play the match up has changed several times. Like for example people have said just block more to deal with Cammy. And blocking more did for a while improve things as his counterhits dried up. But he realised I wasn’t teching anything and now he’s simply added in more throws. Cammy’s cross up options are decent as when you think Cammy’s going do a cross up J.LK he instead does a late Cannon Strike. The pressure your put under is huge
I think the best idea is to try and make Cammy whiff a forward jumping move and then try to pressure her as she lands with a Scissor Kick. If the Cammy player switches to focus attack to try to snag the end of your Scissor Kick switch to Ex.Psycho until he stops doing that. But that isn’t to do if your close to the corner.
Best Bison.
There’s a lot of Dictators winning in Japan, that’s for sure.
Lets hope that transfers to tournament.
Skill gap between both countries are probably not that close in quantity. You might see a lot there but fewer here. But Dictator is still winning, for sure.
How is Dictator vs Dudley in AE?