Dhalsim improvement thread

Classic Fighting Games Ultra Street Fighter IV
61

omg he’s sabin, the great dhalsim player…who has to create a thread asking for unreasonable buffs just because he lives and dies by tier lists in a balanced game…yeah yeah whatever.

I guess if you’re a well known insert character here player, you’re allowed to make senseless wishes for buffs and the sheep here will automatically agree with you.

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Omgud if Sabin had 100 more health he could have totally won those matches. Oh wait, he won those matches?! but but but Dhalsim is low tier, he couldn’t possibly win against a top tier character without being buffed up with more health!

Like I said, I agree with some of your buffs, but quit looking too much into tier lists. You’ll just come out asking for biased buffs like 100+ stamina. I don’t see why I’m being accused of being a troll either. I’m just trying to keep balance in mind. Everyone else here wants to selfishly find ways to make their mains S tier. Either that, or they’re tired of using characters that require effort, and they want to find ways to make all of them as easy to use as Ryu/Sagat.

62

Note that his Xbox tag has the word troll in it, he managed to get people quite riled though!

Random thoughts that could be fun for sim, since I only play as him occasionally most of these will likely be way too much.

  • EX teleport, costs 2 gauges akin to Seth’s EX tandem engine, moves him to the opposite corner of the screen.

  • Some air normals cancellable into drills.

  • At the cost of 1 ex gauge air normals cancellable into teleport.

  • Back roundhouse damage increased to 120.

+/- Back mp damage down to 50, when it hits an aerial opponent counts as a launcher.

  • Make drills have better hit stun even if not block stun, hitting someone at around knee level should never get you hit.

  • jab flame should come out fast enough that back MK into flame should be a block string even at max range.

  • 10% faster meter gain since he has all these new meter needs.

  • 50 health increase.

  • 50 stun increase.

+/- Ultra: Keep it pretty much as is, have it go slightly farther, but decrease the hitbox behind it to fit more with the actual ball of the ultra. Ultra damage adjusted from 40x5 to 30x6 adding on a 6th hit, this reduces overall damage by 20. Slightly increase the time between each hit of the ultra. the ultra lasts longer giving more time to space for super. Let fires and flames be used while the ultra is active.

+/- to compensate for faster meter gain 15% lower damage on super, still functions to get people the frick off with invincibility, make its juggle properties a little bit more stable.

  • Fix EX up flame as many people have said.

These changes are pretty extreme, now Sim experts, explain how broken it is to me :D!

63

how do you EX a teleport when it already uses 3p or 3k?

64

PPPKKK, PP+KK, jab+forward+fierce, etc. There are tons of ways to make it happen. Also since Dhalsim has no overlapping motions with his teleport it could be simplified to one button and have PP/KK be EX but that’s a different approach.

65

I just thought of 3p+3k and was going to come edit my post :stuck_out_tongue:

66

i’m with the whole stun thing, but adding more health is a bit much…but didn’t dhalsim always get dizzy easier then most other characters in previous games…or was it just me?

67

lol troll post coming…

i honestly think sims archetype along with giefs should just be dropped… why?

cause both of the characters are designed with an all or nothing strategy… neither can be played well outside of there particularly strong areas in most games… and when they can you get BAM!.. a broken character.

sim is no fun to play against (or as imho) cause if he does his job right the other character never really gets to fight him on even ground… if he doesnt do his job right and yet hes designed well then he gets raped when another character gets in on him… thats whats stupid to me… hes just way to “all or nothing” when designed well.

same with gief… if hes designed to get in rather easily he becomes broken, if its too easy to keep him out he blows ass.

the only way to address those problems is to tone down both sim and giefs strengths when they are in there strongest positions… this has been done to sim before and it pretty much always results in sim sucking asshole…same with gief.

thats why my answer is to just get rid of him and gief… you probably wont find many people that actually tell you that they LIKE to fight sim or gief on 4, use them… yeah, fight them… naw, not much. i’d honestly rather fight and lose to sagat 10 times in a row than run a set versus gief or sim that i win 10 - 0.

but yeah… neither will get dropped, ever… too bad imho.

that having been said i like all of sabins buffs for sim in his first post, besides the hp increase.
hell i’d even be willing to give him even more buffs as long as his short range defensive and offensive game doesnt get buffed.

lol feel free to ignore this post.

-dime

68

yoga flame needs to be removed from the game or re worked so that its an effective anti air- HOWEVER, back+HK is an AMAZING anti air- the best in the game (bar l.srk) imo. Sim isnt a bottom tier against pros- look at iyo, he has an amazing sim! He illustrates that with practise and alot of skill, sim has the potential to beat ANY character at present.

I would perhaps give sim 50 more hp and stun, and increase his ultra to deal the same dmg as his super, and MAYBE improve the use of his drills. Those plus yoga blast are really all i want to see in the improvement of sim- and concidering sim is my main, thats coming from a non bias place!

Please dont turn Sim into the next ryu/sagat…i like being “unique”

69

i dunno about the HP increase really im not a pro sim player by any means (probly about average to above i think) but ive never once thought, ‘damn, sim could really use some more health’ since he has the best keepaway moves in the game so obviously he is gonna have lower health in the game , and not that i feel simply lowering a characters health is a good way of nerfing a character either, thats more of an ‘artificial nerf’ if you ask me. that being said, i think sim is one nerf or buff away from being almost broken, you cant make his keepaway game any better than it is, and you cant make his ‘up close’ game any worse than it is either.

ha ha saying all this though and now im gonna put my 2 cents in and say that maybe jab upflame could come out a little bit faster than it does now. seriously its so frikkin slow why the heck would anybody even use the medium or strong variety i dont know.

again im not a super sim player or anything i just know that upflame is very limited considering its meant to be an anti air.
feel free to flame if this post is completely retarded.

70

wow it really shows how many people actually use dhalsim seriously. no new posts for a couple days now :frowning:

71

make ultra same dmg as super? You do realize that both moves link into each other right?

72

OMG, Dal. does not need more health. He would be WAAAAY to good. he has so many options, IMO hes balanced already.

73

I’m all for the buffs that have been mentioned minus ex teleport, and even though i’d love it plus 100 stamina. Give me a few normal links, and fix up a few wake up options so i’m not so free when i get knocked down. If Dhalsim had an ex teleport with properties specifically for escaping corner into long range he would be automatic upper B tier material. Some of us may never lose again with a move like that. :smile: Ex upflame trades in way too many situations. 50 more hp, and stun wouldn’t over do it, but whatever happens Capcom please don’t nerf back roundhouse.

74

Um… I don’t play Dhalsim, but my best online competition does, so take what I have to say with a grain of salt.

I don’t know about giving Dhalsim more health. Yeah, he does get “randomed out” at times… But if he keeps you away, that’s not really a problem. I do think he should get a little more stun resistance though. I mean, I play Ken. When I DO get in, it’s a Tatsu combo. If he guesses wrong after, there’s a follow up combo. After that, he’s pretty much stunned. Then, I hit him with the biggest thing I can. THEN I RUN AWAY. Sim can’t really do anything when you have a health lead and a projectile. I make him come to me, which totally fucks up his game. He becomes more random (trying to regain material), so random SRK becomes more potent. Even if I guess wrong, it’s not like his limbs do that much damage.

I don’t know about his Yoga Flame and Blast, since my buddy only uses Flame in combos and usually just AAs with normals, so I can’t comment on those.

I am not gonna say I don’t lose to Sim often. I would probably say he’s in my top 5 of worst win ratios (Seth, Balrog, Vega (cuz no one plays him), Blanka (from my scrub days), then I think Sim (or maybe Bison…). When I lose, it’s because I just couldn’t get in. But any time I do get in, it’s pretty much the match because I stun him for close to free.

I don’t WANT him to have more health, but if he does, I guess that’s ok. But he could at least do with more stun.

Or they could take him and Gief out like Dime said. I’m completely with him that both of them are boring to fight. I don’t DC, but if I play someone who uses Gief in a player match. Win or lose, I immediately leave the lobby afterward.

Just kidding! About taking Sim out anyway…

75

lolz im a sim player and this thread is hilarious

76

Except that in ST, Sim had a tremendous amount of really effective (arguably stupid) up-close tricks. Good slides combined with good drills and a fireball allowed him to advance, massive throw reach plus ST throw damage plus good meaties into throw mixups helped him up close (not to mention what great throw setups he had following noogie), and being able to stun people with meaty cross-up drill into headbutt made knockdowns scary. You’re right in that he still did have a fundamental weakness (once certain characters get in, it’s lights out for Sim), but he had such a complete and interesting offensive game in ST that he was absolutely fun to play as.

With his Ultra and being able to do overheads out of teleport, you can see that Capcom was trying to give him something in case he needed to turn a match around, but he’s still not the offensive terror that he was in ST.

The Gief model of grappler is an interesting one, and one that is hard to balance… just like, well, a lot of other kinds of characters. He should be built to have a hard time getting in, but at the same time, have the toughness to be willing to take some hits to do that. Sometimes, his tools are too good… other times, they just aren’t. Still, I think it’s good to keep something like him in; where Gief is the plodding bruiser who wants to trade hits and is willing to get hit to get in, Fuerte is a sort of grappler that is built around being able to get in without being hit at all. Sometimes, you wind up with something like Potemkin in GGAC, who is so threatening from a full screen away that it’s kind of silly/funny. Then again, being able to kill the other guy in just a combo or two is common in GGAC, so the whole “it’s stupid that he wins once he gets in” argument doesn’t really fly in GGAC since it’s not a unique issue there.

77

most good sim players dont choose to link the 2- instead they will use the super with the b&b air teleport b.hp + b.mk + l.yf -> super. then use ultra with similar cross up teleport combos to give you 2 massive combo setups. very rarely will you see a dhalsim burn his super and ultra in 1 go, unless hes 100% confident that the damage done will be enough to win him the round.

Im only asking for an extra 50 dmg anyway for peep sake :wow:

im more concerned with the yoga blast really and the drills, as at the mo drills are only good for dodging projectiles and the blast is completely uselss.

if they werent to buff the super by 50 dmg i wouldnt really be that bothered, but they would have to concider improving the drills/blast

but heyyyyy…ill still main him regardless of what they do so im not completely bothered- more concerned about what happens/doesnt happen to the shoto scrubbary and sagat…

78

Don’t give them any ideas! I don’t want anyone looking at Potemkin when thinking of Gief improvements!

Random Lag Gief Warrior: “When I SPD someone, I should be able to FADC it into a huge air combo! When I sweep someone, I should be able to hit them off the ground and suck them into an air combo with my whatever normal gief players use that has vacuum effect!”

I would cry if Gief was as scary as AC Potemkin. Actually, now that you mention him, Gief doesn’t seem all that bad anymore…

But, to be on topic, um… Dhalsim’s “I’m not an alien!” win quote should be selectable against anyone… Maybe even a quote during one of his taunts…"

79

improve drill.
faster start-up on up EX/non-EX flames. don’t change the direction. it’s not used much but it is in some situation.
a little more health.

80

better [Frame Adv. Hit / Frame Adv. Block] for slide.
Because jap > dhalsim.

Yoga Tower can stay infinitely if you keep hold PPP.

Please give us a better drill !!! :pray:

edit: B+HK juggle, why not? just like sagat f+hk !!!