I like doing cr lp cr mp mk upkick hk upkick =)
mk upkick to hk upkick actually ends up doing more damage than hp MGU… does that mean that non ex MGU is basically useless? I’d been pretty much incorporating it as my bnb when I didn’t have meter, but it seems that that’s kind of pointless.
The only thing non-ex MGU has over mk upkick > hk upkick is that you can chain it off a cr. jab, but you can chain mk upkick off a cr. short, too. Apart from the fact that mk upkicks > hk upkicks is fairly difficult to get to 100% execution, i can’t see any reason why it doesn’t become the meterless bnb of choice.
Am I missing something? Or am I missing that everyone has already knows this and does it all the time?
The only time I end a combo with upkicks is a punish combo. I guess I don’t feel safe bcuz it might whiff, and I don’t want to get punished. Comboing into upkicks doesn’t work on everyone I believe, I’m pretty sure it will whiff on some crouchers, but I"m not sure.
I usually end bnbs with sobat on hit, and max out on block. Upkicks is for my punish combos, and sobats if upkicks will whiff.
Ah of course, stupid me, I hadn’t considered them crouching, although I guess if you’re punishing whiffed ultras or dps, the opponent isn’t usually crouching. Why do you use sobats instead of MGU on crouching opponents you’ve hit-confirmed? Seems to me like MGU is a better option
I combo into EX MGU whenever I have meter, other than that I just use sobat over MGU. It does roughly the same damage, but MGU might whiff at far distances, whereas you can do cr. LP > cr. LP > cr. LP > cr. MP xx HK sobat, and it will combo so long as you don’t drop the link. I’m talking about bnbs.
Why would you add the third cr. LP when damage scaling makes the whole combo do less damage than if you’d just used two jabs? In terms of damage, it only does a hair more than cr. LP > HP MGU (or cr. LP > cr. LP > HP MGU), and imo leaves you in a worse position - enemy standing, close, both recovering at the same time, more or less. At least MGU gets the knockdown.
I take your point about the range difference.
Side Note: Playing some giefs today and mk upkicks is awesome to interrept the EX greenhand to SPD setupthey love so much. Gief is quickly becoming one of my favourite matchups. 
idk just sometimes I add an extra jab. Akimo/takehiko does it too so its ok I guess.
Knockdown after MGU is techable, but if you like the position it leaves you in that’s cool. Personally I just don’t do it that much, I’ll test it out more. I think sobats also pushes them to the corner more than MGU, and its hit confirmable from farther away. It won’t whiff randomly.
Different blokes, different strokes I suppose.
Cool, much respect to your style too, man. Would like to see some vids sometime!
Another Side Note: Is anyone else having really quite an easy time dealing with El Fuertes? I find that using the slide and sobats to pressure and move constantly throws Elf’s aim off for all his stupid jumping throw attacks. Took down a 8000BP Elf with shockingly little trouble, considering how hard I used to find it when I played Rose.
Any advice on the Juri matchup? I’m feeling a little lost against her. lk Sobat misses her sweep, her jump arc is really unusual so my anti air tends to whiff. I somehow don’t manage to get damage in. Fireballs aren’t too safe to do either.
What are the best opportunities to punish her and how should you do it?
i usually go with a zoning game. if they like to get in close then lk sobat. maybe you are using it too early.
try a focus back dash if the jump in is good.
honestly i’ve never played any amazing juri’s but i usually win for free. he defense if bad. knock her down and jump all over her. she has no wake up besides counter which can be baited.
I was just doing the juri matchup earlier today. I only have one tip. She ends a lot of combos with EX wheel kick, and that can be hard to punish if you block it, because it leaves her quite far away. The best way I’ve found is to cr. short into mk upkicks then hk upkicks if you can pull it off. Otherwise I feel Juri’s a pretty easy matchup for DJ. Stay away and bait her dive kicks, they’re fairly easy to upkick, too.
Ok so after what MuayGio was telling me I was testing BnB combos and these are my new ones now
Normal hit confirm bnb
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cr. LP > [cr. LP] > cr. MP/cr. LK xx HP MGU (EX MGU with meter > HK upkick/EX sobat)(cr. LK for an easier link, but less damage)
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cr. LP > st. MK > [cr. LP] > cr. MP xx HK sobat (more damage w/o meter, harder links)(the extra cr. LP might whiff after a cross up on some characters.)
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any combo > cr. MK
moves in [these] means you can do them for more hit confirmability.
**Punish combos **(in order of damage)
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raw U2
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cr. HP/cr. MP > [HK sobat] xx super
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cr. MP xx EX MGU > HK upkick/EX sobat
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cr. MP/HP xx MK upkick > MK upkick
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cr. MP xx HP MGU (if cr. MP xx upkick whiffs I’ll use this one)
The punish list is good. You can’t really debate much cuz it’s in order of most damage, and there’s no issue of difficulty. The BnB list is just what I prefer based on damage output, and hit confirmability. Some of yall might prefer to use easier links or different specials. If they block my bnb string, I end it with a max out, or I tick throw, or just pressure them.
@MuayGIo, I like where the HP MGU leaves you after you hit them. You have a chance to safe jump them if they quick rise, and if they don’t then you can be next to them anyways for wake up games, which will be even better when DJ gets his overhead.
I like that last list. Good stuff.
The frame data seems to say that cl.st.MK has the same frame adv on hit as cr.LP so you should be able to link cr.MP off it. Is the frame data wrong? Is the second cr.lp in there so you always have the cr.LP, cr.MP link timing instead of needing to learn another 1 frame link timing? Just curious.
For #5, cr.HP xx HP.mgu lands on some characters from point blank for that tiny bit of extra damage.
Fon bnb’s I tend to link cr.short cause my cr.mp link isn’t up to snuff yet (working on it… only at like 50% right now).
^yeah, the st. MK > cr. MP timing is a bit wierd for me, It’s slightly more delayed than cr. LP > cr. MP link. So I just do this so I don’t miss it lol. Maybe I’ll start working on that link more, idk.
cr. HP xx HP MGU is kind of wierd, I know it combos, but the first few hits will whiff sometimes leaving the combo not doing as much damage as cr. MP xx MK upkick > MK upkick, or cr. MP xx HP MGU. You might want to check though to make sure I’m not wrong, but I’m pretty certain cuz I tested it yesterday.
Also if I drop my links, I’ll still throw in a LK sobat, or Max out or a poke like st. MK or cr. HP to keep up pressure, unless I think they’re going to be mashing or something.
i think they should change the stun animations in the game in general. It seems dumb that certain "sway animations mess up combos. Either make mgu have faster startup or fix it.
cr. HP x HP mgu is my favorite punish but i don’t use it because i can’t risk knowing when it will or won’t hit.
That BNB 2 is tough! I’m gonna have to practice that one.
Off hand, that BNB 2 looks like it would be whiff city against certain characters.
cr.HP xx HP.mgu is character and spacing specific. It typically ONLY works point blank if it works at all. Somewhere on the boards I did a first week test of it and compiled who it did and didn’t work on. Though I’m starting to think it may be so off that it’s just random. Even stranger, sometimes it whiffs the mashes but not the first few hits… it’s just… odd. I think it’s just plain idiotic for it not to work better than it does. The hitbox should be fixed. It not working on some of the cast is like Guy’s target combo whiffing certain crouching characters on block.
Yes. Wakeup EX Machine Gun Uppercut beats Fuerte’s Throw, Splash and Slide if you time it right. Don’t try to throw it out every time you go down or anything silly like that but Fuerte’s used to focusing only on his mixups as most people don’t have good reversal options against him. The fact that he has to respect you can get potentially get a big punish on him if you guess him right is scary for a character with fuerte’s health. And Fuerte’s a character with not much more then a wakeup game. And the Sobat’s are very good at him because they stop him from just throwing out random Habanero Dashes all the time as they’ll even Break his EX Armour version.
If you ply online you’re pretty much never gonna see good Juri’s she’s played by so so many awful players. I can honestly say i’ve played a ton of Juri’s and never met one who doesn’t basically have a gameplan consisting of Jump back and Dive Kick every single second of the match you possibly can and always wakeup with Pinwheels.
I played a decent Juri last night on ranked. He actually did some pretty cool stuff. It was super laggy though, I hate it whenever you lose to a throw because of lag.
This is the stuff I have on Juri. Mostly punishes.
Juri
[LIST]
[]Sobats are not safe against her, if she knows how to punish them.
[]All of Juri?s pinwheel kicks are punishable with U2. You can punish LK/MK/HK pinwheel with well timed cr. MK, or cr. MP > combo. You can punish EX version with LK/HK sobat
[]Stuff all of Juri?s divekicks with LK upkick, or MP, or U2. You can punish LK/MK/HK version with cr. LP > cr. MK, or cr. MP > combo if she goes for more hit (if she does more air kicks). You can punish EX version with U2 or a cr.MP > big combo.
[]Against teleports, if Juri teleports behind you, you can hit her with cr. MK if she?s in range. If she teleports above you, you can anti air her with U2, LK sobat, or MP.
[/LIST]
Focus is not good in this fight. I think she beats you in fireball wars also. You can beat all of her wakeup options with meaty safe jump cross up MK. If she does teleports above you, look out for it, and next time get her with st. MP.
Not too familiar with the matchup lol.