"Death by Degrees" - The Nina Williams Thread

Classic Fighting Games Tekken Tag Tournament 2
21

Ok now lets talk launchers. While she has nothing insane like EWGF, her launchers are great.

df+2: Nina’s fastest launcher at i15. It is mid, safe, and can go under jabs. The drawback is that that it does not launch crouching opponents unless on CH just like the rest of generic df+2s that a few characters have in tekken. It is still a great move since mid launchers that are safe aren’t very common in tekken, especially at this speed. It doesn’t have the greatest range, but it’s good enough.

b+1+4: her 2nd fastest standing launcher at i16. It’s m,m, has great range and launches both standing and couching opponents. However, it is launch punishable on block. The main use of this launcher is as a whiff punisher and against moves that are -16 on block. You can’t just throw it out there.

db+3+4: geyser cannon, qcb+k in SFxT. It is mid and has huuuuge range. It is a bit slow at i19 and is also launch punishable on block. Its main use is for launching bigs whiff for crazy juggle damage.

uf+1: Nina’s main low crushing juggle starter. It is completely safe on block and also launches crouching opponents unlike df+2. However, it is quite slow. Still a great juggle starter.

ss+2: mid launcher from ss. It comes at i14 from side step and is great to punish the opponent when you side step a move successfully. This move made me love Nina. You side step a move then BAM launch! Sadly it got nerfed a bit in TTT2 compared to T6 as it used to be -12 on block, but now -14. Learn how to use this move properly. It’s amazing.

Now for her block standing punishers:
-10: 1,2 for 22 damage and +frames on hit or 1,4 for 29 damage and -6 on hit.
-11: 4 for 20 damage and +8 frames on hit or any of the above options.
-12: b+2,2 for 34 damage and +2 frames
-13: same as the above or df+1,2 for 30 damage and +2 frames, but it has followups if you want to go for mix ups. I’d say stick with b+2,2
-14: she has tons of options here, but the best two are: df+3,4 for 45 damage and +7 frames or f+3 for 39 damage and KND/wall splat
-15: df+2 launcher or if it doesn’t reach, ff+2,ff+3 for 54 damage
-16: b+1+4 launcher
-19: db+3+4

For couching/while rising punishers against low moves:
-10: d+1 very low damage, but it’s not the majority of the cast has anothing else
-11: ws+4 for 20 damage and +7 frames
-12: the same as above
-13: ws+1,1+2 for 43 damage and KND/wall splat
-14: the same as above
-15: ws+2 mid launcher

For whiff punishment, your usual options are df+2, b+1+4 or db+3+4. From side step, ss+2 is great. In order to get results with Nina you have to be great in whiff punishment and movement since she does very high damage from her launchers.

I only learned about frames and such last year and it really helped me understand how things work in tekken.

Hope this is useful (^_^)-b

22

Who wants to know what??
I mod the Nina forums on TZ. So if you have any questions feel free to PM me or post up in here. I’ll subscribe to this thread that way I know when things are asked.

Also feel free to add me on PSN or XBL and I’ll be glad to help you out with your game :slight_smile:

23

Nailing down timed ws+1 combos properly is my current biggest plateau outside of fundamentals.

24

I know that Nina is an offense oriented character, but I wondering I her offense is based more of frame-traps and pressure or on mid/low mix-ups? Also would you say she has good movement at all?

Thanks in advance!

25

What are you having trouble with fundamentally?

Some tips for WS1
Okay so this seems to be a problem with many Nina players. The problem is usually in the concept instead of the actual execution. The concept behind an individual iWS1 is canceling her QCF into a WS move by pressing u/f and a button. It can be done with any of her WS moves. Some examples being:
-WS1 = QCF~u/f+1
-WS4 = QCF~u/f+4

Anyway, the QCF is not bufferable at all. SO if you start your next QCF before the prior move is finished you will get u/f+<button> (ie u/f+1 in most cases) because there is no crouch dash happening to cancel. With that being said the execution of each iWS1 has to be done VERY quickly but COMPLETELY SEPERATE from the prior WS1
[media=youtube]wGfGVU97L4I[/media]
So in the video you can see that the actual execution of each WS1 can be pretty sloppy and doesn’t have to be a perfect QCF~u/f+1 (2369LP and it could even be something along the lines of 236989 or 2368 or 269 or 23696)

Additional notes:
-Make sure you SSR or are off axis right (in the video I did the SSR before I launched and it’s perfectly acceptable just so long as you are off axis right when trying to connect multiple WS1)
-Ensure you input the WS1 VERY quickly
-Ensure you wait until Nina is FULLY RECOVERED to start the next one (if you are having trouble you can use hit analysis. When she changes back to neutral color is when you can start the next WS1)
-If you have a programmable stick you can do d,f,u/f+1 to get it come come out 1 frame faster and even by hand you can do d~f~u/f+1 to get it to come out. Like I said the execution doesn’t have to be perfect but the PERFECT WS1 is d~f~u/f+1

I hope that helps.

26

What other rules are there for landing it and not whiffing? Right axis?

27

I’m gonna kinda tie both of those into the same answer.
Nina is a very poke based character. Her lows are somewhat on the slower side being i20 and she really doesn’t have too many frame traps outside of using SS1 relentlessly. A few things that Nina has that aren’t the ideal frame trap (forcing the opponent into a disadvantage and baiting attacks with it. For example putting them at -2 and constantly following up with a 15 frame attack to bait something i13 just so you can land a CH 4) Her traps come more from putting yourself at -2 to -4 and using her SS (which is VERY good) to avoid pokes. Once they catch on the will have to use slower tracking moves to prevent you from SSing.

Nina’s best poking tools are:
1 its i10 and leaves you at +1 on block
1,2 its i10 and leaves you at -1 on block
4 its i11 and yeilds a juggle on CH this is your you got baited move. When yomi it up and read them M4 to the face.
d/f+1,2 its i13 and -3 on block
f+2 its i13 -4 on block and +8 on hit
d/f+4 its i12 -4 on block and +7 on hit

Lows
d+2 its i20 and it high crushes
d/b+3 its i20 and +4 on hit

The concept behind poking with her is get them use to blocking your barrage of pokes by doing poke poke or poke SS. Once you have them pissed enough to just stand there and block like a douch you start blasting their ankles with d/b+3.

Advanced SSing is done by doing an empty SS and waiting to see the opponent’s reaction:

  • If they stand there like a douch when you SS you can go back to your pokes, hit em with d/b+3 OR you can apply pressure with SS1~b or SS1~f which is roughly +7 . Meaning if you do either of those and cancel into WS1 or WS4 (both interruptable on block or hit and both combo from SS1 on a side hit) from SS1~b or even QCF moves from SS1~f (SS1~F+2 is a safe wall splat and SS1~F+4 HC 2 are both interruptable on block or hit from SS1)

  • If they attack and whiff just press 2 for a SS2 and pretty big damage.

Playing Nina is a lot like playing a game of speed chess when you’re on the offense and sacraficing the army so you can bait a check mate.

ADDITIONALLY SS1 to the side or back gives a free SS1~F+1 if it hits to the back you get your typical staple and if it hits to the side you get a gimp combo but it’s still going to hurt.

28

Yep just off axis right, quick individual input, making sure each one is looked at as its own individual move AND for the purpose of a match you can only land 7 hits prior to the bound (d/f+2 SSR iWS1x7 1+4 B! OR CH d/b+2 d/f+1 d/f+3,2 iWS1x4)

29

Back Dashing with Nina:

In a prior post I had seen someone mention back dashing with Nina is more difficult do to the fact that she has a sway. A good way to prevent an inadvertant sway is to back dash in a manner that doesn’t require you to go back to neutral between the back and the d/b by rolling from the back to the d/b.
Input method used should be: b,B~d/b~n >>> B~d/b~n >>> B~d/b~n >>> B~d/b~n
Non verbal hands tutorial by Rain- [media=youtube]YBWDZ7oTxRM[/media]

Hayashida step:
Hayashida step is linking Nina sway in a manner that will quickly SS and avoid a ton of high and linear attack. It’s done by canceling the QCB with ~u and rolling straight into another QCB.
Notation is: QCB~u QCB~u QCB~u QCB~u.

You can also do it without the SS and just move backwards with it, but it’s not as viable and much more difficult to use.
Notation is: QCB~u/b~n QCB~u/b~n QCB~u/b~n.

30

Thanks man

31

What tag fillers are you guys using mostly?

32

it depends on point character, hits pre TA and what you plan on using after the TA.

BUT ss1~F+2 is pretty universal. Who are you using and What combos are you using before the ~5

33

Im using d/f 3,2,3

But like Galen said it depends on wat u do b4 and also wat u wanna do afterwards but I kno for a fact it works with well Asuka, Lars and JC.

34

Okay, I have a bit more time to post now. The way I’ll lay this out is I’ll post how many hits prior the ~5 and I’ll post what’s ideal, but not limited to, for Nina to use. THEN below it I’ll list an example.
Nina’s TA for:

Instant~5 and first hit to ~5: d/f+3,2~SS1~b~u~d/f+3,2,3

[Lars] fb2,1~5 [Nina] **d/f+3,2~SS1~b~u~d/f+3,2,3 **[Lars] fff+2+4
[JC] d/f+2,1 u/f+2~5 [Nina] **d/f+3,2~SS1~b~u~d/f+3,2,3 **[JC] fff+2+4

2 and 3 hits prior to ~5: SS1~b~u~d/f+3,2,3 OR d/f+3,2~SS1~F+2

[Asuka] CH u/f+3 d/b+4,3 d+2~5 [Nina] SS1~b~u~d/f+3,2,3 [Asuka] WR3
[Anna] CH 4 [dash] d+4,1 f+3,2~5 [Nina] **d/f+3,2~SS1~F+2 **[Anna] ff+1+2

4 hits prior to ~5: **d/f+3,2,3 OR f+4,3,3 **

[JC] u/f+4,3 4 d,d/f+1,4,1 d,d/f+1,4,1+2~5 [Nina]** d/f+3,2,3 **[JC] fff+2+4
[Anna] d/f+2 d/f+3,2~D/F+1 f+3,2~5 [Nina] **f+4,3,3 **[Anna] ff+1+2

5 hits prior to ~5 : SS1~F+2

[JC] CH 4 d,d/f+1,4 ff+1 d,d/f+1,3,1 d,d/f+1,4,1+2~5 [Nina] **SS1~F+2 **[JC] fff+2+4

These are just rough examples and I’m sure most characters get similar things after her TA but it works really well with running moves.

As for the wall Nina gets very similar things and it’s dependent on wall hits prior to the ~5 BUT in most cases Nina will use
SS1~d/f+3,2,3 or 4,3,d+4,3 as her TA at the wall. There are times when she can get SSR1~b~u~f+4,3,3 and other random things but I wouldn’t really mess too much with anything outside of 4,3,d+4,3 or SS1~b~u~d/f+3,2,3.

35

hello there .
I’ve been using nina like tow years ago , she’s great in poking and carrying
here some video of my gameplay

[SIZE=22px]Tekken Tag 2 | Nina & Anna’s JF[/SIZE]

[media=youtube]od7lOJcGTmA[/media]

[SIZE=22px]Tekken Tag 2 | Nina & Lars Match[/SIZE]

[media=youtube]8E-53hwwlQc[/media]

[SIZE=22px]Tekken Tag 2 | Nina & Lars Combo[/SIZE]

[media=youtube]NuNCSUQ_Qd4[/media]

36

Good stuff dude. The only thing I noticed was you didn’t usually get 4,3,d+4,3 you got It A couple times in the combo vid. Are you completely comfortable with the notation of it?

37

not that comfort … i can do it at 70% chance .
and i love changing some of they ends .
thanks .

“sorry for bad English”

38

I made a very short hands video to show people how to get it consistently. BUT you can do it one of two ways.

4,3,d+4,3 OR 4,3~d,n,4,3 (this is the way I do it in the video)
[media=youtube]dWgQJ9oDxws[/media]
[media=youtube]LQEONPGEIsA[/media] <— that has command history so you can see when the buttons are being pressed and what not.

39

I do it with the first one … thanks!

40

Of course! I hope it helps. Every little bit of damage helps. I think that last hit adds like 10 or so