DBZ: Sparking! / Budokai Tenkaichi

Current Fighting Games Fighting Game Discussion
61

Really? It must be EXTRMELY easy to hurt you then, because the only thing to do to defend yourself is TC, which you’re just going to waste your ki with. And when you TC on me, I can easily TC on you, and continue my combo, and you’ll end up in a far worse position from what you’ve started.
Also, your Vegeta = PWNed by Yakon. Anybody with Senzu Bean and Yakon owns your Mecha Freezer. And repeating the same chain over and over guarentees your loss.
And spamming TCs is the best way to get your ki low. That way, your opponent who is smart enough to TC at the best opportunities will always end up having more ki than you. Should you choose to TC, your only viable option would be to run, and you’ll be forced to play defence again. And not many characters in B3 can actually defend against a good offence.

I would just LOVE to see your efforts in trying to prove that Goku and Gohan play alike. No character in B3 plays like another character. There are some similarities, but the closest one is Goku and Gohan, who are still pretty far apart.

Oh really? You must think Goku is still top tier in Budokai 3 like he is in 1 and 2, because you seem incapable of dodging and counterattacking his ->PKK. Dodging changed Budokai 3 more than TCing did, and ended up screwing over many characters who were able to play a decent offence in the previous. I don’t think you’re aware of this at all. Also, dodging is what makes up the bulk of some character’s playstyles, such Piccolo, Yamcha, #18, Kid Gohan and Tien.

Too bad the depth remains well hidden from so many people, plus the fact that it will never get popular enough for it to make it that far.

Then obviously, you and your friend are afraid to take risks…
Also, constant poking is easy to get by. Ever heard of dodging + sidestepping? The only character who can poke constantly and benefit from it is Piccolo, but thats because his poking creates zoning. Dabura has a weaker form of it, but its still effective.

Ever heard of something called a chargable stun? No, I didn’t think so ::rolleyes::

No, you seriously don’t. Thats a given.
Also, don’t bash a game unless you can do it properly. I have yet to see someone who can do it to B3. But it is easily doable to B1 and B2, all because of one character…

62

This constant excuse of depth remaining hidden is not viable. There have been plenty of games that weren’t mainstream that people picked up (for example, Guilty Gear X, SSBM) due to the overall quality of the game and the depth of the system. Look at Smash Bros and Super Smash Bros Melee. The game picked up and has a very respectable tournament community, even though the depth is “hidden” behind a “kiddy” fascade. A large number of people play it competetively in many different countries. There are entire forums dedicated to it. They have huge tournament that people fly to from all over the world. Why is this not happening for B3? You can’t even attempt to tell me that B3’s depth is so “hidden” that the majority of the worldwide fighting game community has just missed it. That’s just absurd.

When a game has “hidden” depth, people find it, and the community blossoms from there. The fact of the matter is, hardly anyone plays B3 competetively. Not Japan, not America, not anywhere. This “hidden depth” thing is just an illusion that B3 players use to explain why no one plays the game.

Where are the match videos of high-level play? Where are the tournaments that aren’t the result of being an offshoot of a big-name game tournament? Where is the community outside of gamefaqs (which, to be honest, isn’t known for having a collection of hardcore fighting game players)?

When your community has its leaders saying the game has more depth than TK5 and SC2, something is wrong. Call it for what it is: a game designed for non-hardcore fighting game fans with a cancel system added to appease the slightly more adept. It is in no way a hardcore fighting game.

In case anyone missed it, here is my reply to Nnamz (one of the aforementioned community leaders) of his claim that the game had more depth than TK5/SC2.

Deeper than Tekken 5 and SC2? WTF?

Sure you have cancels and the options out of them, but strings -> cancels -> options is just on overall element of depth. Having the same options out of a multitude of different strings doesn’t compound the overall depth. B3 is missing so many elements of the big-name fighting games it’s not even funny.

TK5/SC2 have things like, a real high/mid/low system, a true wakeup game (getting off the ground w/ an attack, rolling in a direction and getting up with an attack, not attacking), the ability to make an opponent stand up backwards on wakeup, tech-catches, a variety of throws, each with their own escapes and setup possibilities, a wall-game etc, hits that connect from the side don’t automatically pop the opponent to a front or back state, the ability to sidestep/dash cancel, sidewalk, crouching, jumping, a true crush system (which works with the high/low system)… and a ton of other stuff.

I mean seriously. DBZ:B3 has it’s share of techniques and strategies, but it’s really just a dumbed down fighting game that is made for kids except they’ve added canceling to appeal to the more hardcore players. Trying to put it above Tekken 5 and SC2 is just ridiculous. With that statement you are basically saying it’s above VF4 as well, seeing as they all share a majority of elements that B3 doesn’t even have.

Don’t get me wrong, I like the game, but it’s outlandish statements like this that give the B3 community (and the game) a bad reputation.

So yeah, B3 has some interesting elements, but the game is in no way even remotely close to the level of the big names. To be clear, this isn’t a bash of the game, I’m simply pointing out the obvious. I still play the game and garner enjoyment out of it, but it isn’t hard to see what is there and what isn’t… “hidden” or not.

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Trag, depth is the amount of viable options. Now, in SC2, which has barely any depth whatsoever, you can easily abuse the sidestep. The error is that the majority of moves, including horizontals, are easy to sidestep. In fact, grabs can be sidestepped easily as well. So where are the options? All that is ever used in SC2 are the moves that are quick with tracking, and apparently, there aren’t many. Why do you think SC2’s popularity and credibilty dropped so severely?
Also, I don’t ever think Nnamz has claimed B3 to be deeper than Tekken 5.

In Budokai 3, you get a variety of options for different situations. If someone is charging up a cancel that has nullifying properties, that someone has a variety of options. Should he cancel and go for another attack? Should he cancel or go into a throw? He can make use of hitstun if the cancel is fast enough to keep attacking. He can also keep charging, and make the attack unblockable. Again, back to hitstun, you can sidestep after certain cancels to confuse your opponent. Now what can the defender do? They can try to grab, get two quick hits before the charger knows it(rarely used, but it can work), backdash to get out of the cancel, use their own power attack to nullify their opponent’s, fire a ki blast, or try to predict and use a sidestep. All of the options above are viable in a common situation in Budokai 3 which I have barely touched. And that is far deeper than what SC2 will ever reach.

And no, Budokai 3 is not as deep as Tekken 5. But it’s not completely overshadowed either.

64

Sorry, I don’t see much depth in B3 either. It all boils down to trying to keep up your ki. Your ki is your lifeline.

65

However, keeping your ki at a decent level isn’t tough. You have three big ways of gaining ki. Powering up, attacking and blocking. Ki is a big factor, but it isn’t the deciding factor. Its how you manage it.

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“Does B3 have what it takes to be on the same level as Tekken, SC and VF4?”

Y"es. This game is deeper then both Tekken 5 and SC2. The canceling system leaves this game with thousands of viable options and variations after an initial hit."

Straight from gamefaqs.

What I’ve said about B3 is that the cancel system, while indeed adding more to the game than the previous versions, is still the same “set” of strategies replayed over and over at the end of different moves or strings. For example: hit-hit-hit-charge, or hit-charge, or just charge, all lead to the same options. Once your opponent has recognized the charging sequences of your character (which, to be honest, any high-level player will do), the same “hit-back, try to throw, counter power-attack etc etc” options are nearly identical. Each situation, while different in startup, leads to the same options.

In regards to SC2, the game stop being played because of numerous glitches and the ability to runaway extremely potent. However, I don’t want to turn this into a SC2 defense post, because anyone knows that I stopped playing it pretty quickly.

OK, so anyway… I still want to see examples of high-level play. I can definitely admit this crazy depth if I see it. What people have posted and what I have experienced myself in a multitude of matches (against other respected fighting game players) has simply not shown it to me.

67

well duh that other capsules will counter each other out so get the unlimited ki capsule and TC that rush down.

dont alot of characters have that PPP->K combo right there. oh yea goku has the spirit bomb ultimate move which makes him play differently and vegeta has the final flash that blinds your enemy to make him play different too and trunks can go super sayien 5 which makes him play different too. so whats the different between the kick and punch button?:confused: ok true DBZB3 fan, why dont you tell me the different strategy im suppose to use with cell and what am im suppose to do with broly and vegeta and goku besides the PPP->K combo. oh wait, mr. satan dont have a TC, too bad cause he does need a TC to TC your opponent down.

err Cell, A17, and A18 are top tier in Budakai 2 with that force field glitch. goku dont even come near them so get your facts straight true DBZB3 fan.

it will never get popular enough?? are you kidding me true DBZB3 fan? DBZ series is one of the top anime in the USA, so how many copies of DBZB3 will be sold on the first day? enough copies to make the sony greatest hit list and to keep milking the series as much as they can. and what is this depth your talking about? is it TC like crazy?

taking risk my ass. we take all the risk thats avaible, thing is we know each others strategy already and whats the point of trying something new when your strategy ends up the same way it was before and also that your friend uses the same strategy as you do too, so TC their ass down.

yes, i heard about that stun and no i dont plan to use it cause its useless, just TC that crap down.:rolleyes:

i would like you to show me some high high high high high high HIGH HIGH HIGH HIGH HIGH level competition matches of DBZB3. i gaunretee you that both players will be poking each other out like mad and TCing each other like crazy while using the same strategy after the last match and the match before that. im looking forward to your DBZB3 high level video matchs, so bring on the TC’s.:wow:

68

Are there beam battles in Tenkaichi? Also, If someone shoots a kamehameha or any big beam at you are the only options to you are to block it or dodge?

thx

69

There are beam struggles (and combo struggles as well).

If someone shoots a big beam, you can block (take a lot of guard dmg), dodge, or shoot your own beam back and enter a beam struggle.

70

(I’m haitianhomey from gamefaqs) Yo Spralwers, you think Budokai Tenkaichi is worth buying?

71

That was just a poor post overall. Couldn’t even be taken as a troll post. Christ.

72

This game sounds interesting.

trag, if you had to name the biggest shortcoming in this game’s gameplay from your experience with it so far, what would it be?

73

…there IS no super saiya-jin 5. It stops at four, and Trunk can only go to SSJ2. Everyone knows that. Even the guy you sarcastically referred to as a TRUE dbz fan.

74

lmao.

I don’t think trunks can go to ssj2. He went ultra/steroids ssj1 during his fight with Cell however.

75

dbz discussions :lol: :rolleyes:

i might check out tenkaichi though

76

You’re an idiot. You say SC2 has “no depth” but everything you listed as an option to stop a charge in Budokai, you can do in SC2 AND MORE. Seriously, stfu you;re not helping your cause.

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is that all you got? wow thats it huh. Christ. well no biggie, i can understand since you were born that way so feel free to channel your anger in any way you want and keep up the good work my friend.:tup:

LOL, you actually took my super saiyien 5 trunks seriously LOL. anyways, Trunks can only go SSJ1 not SSJ2 cause if he went SS2, then Cell would’ve been dead earlier so why isnt Cell kill by SSJ2 trunks then?:wow:

okay, enough with the arguments cause its getting nowhere. Sprawlers, i would like you to show me some high level DBZB3 matches. Seening some high level matches will give a better idea of how deep the game is and this depth your talking about. until then, ill be waiting for some high level porfile matches that makes even Soul Calibur 2 look really bad that DBZB3 should’ve been at Evolution instead.

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I’d like to see those matches too.

79

What? What, I’m psychic? I’m supposed to know what passes for a joke in your childish mind? To me, it looked like you’d posted some bullshit, so I called you on it. About Trunks: the Cell games was the only saga I hadn’t seen in japanese, and I can’t tolerate the dub, so I just missed on on that scenario completely. I see art of Mirai Trunks’ useless ass all over the internet. Some with him with thick, pale yellow, bulky spikes, and some later pics with him having smaller, more numerous, sharper-looking spiked hair, and I assumed that somewhere in the 30 or so eps that I missed, according to this art, that Mirai Trunks hit ssj2. Now that I think about it, maybe Toriyama redesigned Mirai Trunks’ hair shape and color in later art to more resemble ssj2 than regular ssj. My bad. Grow up.

80

LMFAO! You are seriously one hell of a comedian… NOT!

I’m supposed to tell you how each character plays? No, I don’t think I do. Quit trying to bash a game you have no clue how to play.

The force field glitch comes nothing close to Goku’s transformation guard break into a perfect warp kamehameha. Goku also has meditation, and can repeat the strategy easily.

In your eyes, DBZB3 is all about wasting your ki with useless TCs so you can get punished by max damage combos. I don’t really need to say anything more here.

TC their ass down so that your ki gets lower than theirs, and they can press the offence on you with ease. You know, you just might suffer 2,000 damage per combo since you’re such an idiot to TC all the time?

Nice sarcasm…

Even if I showed you a match vid, you couldn’t be convinced. Why? Because I already told you constant pokes (unless you’re Piccolo) won’t work. Why don’t they work? Read my posts better, and maybe you can understand. You think high level play is constant spamming of pokes and TCs, and I think you’ll stay binded to that stupid opinion, despite being proven wrong so easily, and I think I don’t need to keep going :rolleyes:

Oh, don’t worry. Because I’ll spam those TCs like crazy and suffer 2,000+ damage combos because I wasted my ki like the idiots such as you.

And RandomNigga, please explain to me how SC2 is deep? I don’t see any depth in a game where a vast majority of offence options are instantly negated by the broken sidestepping system :rolleyes:

And sure, SC2 might not be played that way any more, but its still the cold hard truth.