Guess you didn’t read further down…
I did. And I rest my case : most of Dan’s match-ups aren’t hard, they are simply impossible if your opponent knows the match-up as well as you do.
Dan can’t deal a lot of damage, he has no zoning ability, he has a hard time getting into his opponent’s face and staying there, his pressure game has horrendous flaws that are easy to spot after a bit of training and his normals have shitty priority, range and speed. So yeah, Dan has some tools (and awesome taunts), but they are clearly not enough compared to his numerous flaws.
Apart from his few 5/5 match-ups, the only wins you’ll gather with Dan are against players that are clearly weaker than you or have no idea how the match-up works.
Yeah. I did actually start writing another paragraph about how I lose to people that are clearly less “skilled” in the game but have better tools/options/moves then I do but I deleted cuz I didn’t want to put that much time into the post.
Buuuut I did also mention that he needs improvements. Basically my points in that post were:
Dan has flaws.
We know this.
If you pick him you are accepting these flaws.
If you fail to win you lacked the skill to overcome Dan’s shortcomings.
Said shortcomings were intentional.
We want these shortcomings to be less severe.
Rationalizing keeping Dan as he is due to him being a joke is not a valid argument.
And really the tone of my post was light and tongue in cheek. So lighten up.
…Let’s agree to disagree on that point. Although I’d agree that losing is generally a “lack” of skill, I also think that a character’s flaws cannot be completely compensated by skill. Just watch Sanford vs Mariodood. Does Sanford lacks skill? Hell no, yet it wasn’t enough to beat Mariodood.
I’m cool with that. Although I will say that the amount of skill required to overcome these flaws can be HUUUUUGE.
And the higher the skill level of the players involved the larger that gap needs to be. In other words you need to be better just to lose gracefully let alone actually win, that can require being a much much better player.
I could definitely see that at a certain level it could become impossible. Hmmm. I think that is what riled me up a bit. 99% of the people out there shitting on Dan and the people that use him aren’t at that level and have no real idea of how effective Dan can be.
Shit. Make that “how fun Dan can be”. Self-edited for truth…
So, I haven’t checked in on this thread for a good while now. What’re the basic improvements we Saikyo-ers agree on thus far?
Better Koryuken perhaps?
Nice normals?
Focus Attack breaking Ultra?
Slight damage increase?
It’s sorta tough to think of ways to make him viable against Sagat though. I mean, against Gief all he may need is better normals and then air Dankukyaku to run away, so that match doesn’t seem far from being decent for him. Sagat though… who knows, it’s tough to say becuase more likely than not Sagat’s going to change a bit in the amount of damage he does, maybe even some of his f.rh properties. We’ll see what Capcom does I suppose.
I personally would like to be able to cancel hadoukens with gadoukens at closer ranges withouth his arm getting hit by the opponents fireball.
All his taunts need to build meter.
Light hearted characters will always have their place but when they don’t add anything to the game [storyline,etc] then they should be kept out.
Dan can still be a good light hearted character even they do buff him up to mid or high tier [I know high tier Dan is not going to happen. I just threw that out as an example] but if they are just going to keep him weak and bottom tier then they should just leave him out.
I respect your opinion and all, but… High tier or low tier, I’ll always enjoy playing Dan. He has kept the game fun for me, as well as other players. I think that makes it worth having him regardless of his spot on the tier list. I mean, someone always has to be at the bottom, right?
+1.
Dan should be bottom, but that doesn’t mean that he should be weak… Just weaker than the others. Like averaging a 4-6 on his match ups.
Haha, I don’t think that person necessarily has to be Dan. I was just saying that someone will always be bottom-tier, and you can’t just toss them out of the game for it. I mean, I think it would be awesome to see Dan as a mid-tier character. But I would honestly prefer he stay low tier. If he were higher tier, then more people would want to play him. And being the selfish person that I am, I kinda enjoy the fact that a lot of people still don’t know the matchup.
Would be cool if his second ultra was his tiny projectile from alpha, he could combo into it which would improve his arson a bit
Hahaha, that would be pretty funny.
We don’t encourage arsony on SRK, sir.
edit: That I know of
I second this
regarding Dan being bottom tier in SSF4 or not… I’ld like the bulk [say over half] of his matches to be 4/6 with more 5/5 matches than 3/7 ones… maybe seven to twelve 5/5 and three to five 3/7 matches
if the bottom tier [at worst] only had 5 bad match ups, while the top [at best] boasted less than eight great match ups, there should be more tourny viable [of the 30+] characters over all.
even with Dan on the bottom, he doesn’t have to be a throw away character.
Dan? Really?
See that quote above? I totally, whole-heartedly agree. His kicks are just plain dangerous, and his SRK has really high priority. I was DP by a Dan player right in the middle of my Fei Long combo…Combo. With Fei Long…Combo…Dragon punched…by Dan. Seriously!
Try harder.
2/10 for effort.
Must have missed your link. Wouldn’t happen any other way.
I really hope he does get his tiny projectile ultra. With a few good combo’s into it ryu stylee he would def go up a bit on the tier list. If not he should get his self destruct move and have it hurt as much as blankas ultra.