At least with RC everyone gets some decent bs instead of just 2 characters. Where do people get off saying that ratio is the way CvS2 was ‘meant’ to be played, this is SF not some religious text. Does that mean that MvC2 was meant to be played with the original 16 characters if the machine doesn’t have the credits up? A3 was meant to be played without rog? cmon i don’t think we need to be that hardassed about it.
That being said blanka is 10x as much bullshit as he was before, and he still owns all for free, sagat too. You were implying that RC makes cvs2 more balanced right?
I think you may have lost the point…
At least for me, this experiment isn’t to improve the game. I have no idea what it’ll do to the game. In any case, it’s mostly for a quest for knowledge: how do match-ups play when they actually matter? And if we learn the match-ups better, does that improve Ratio Play in the end? Does that make Sagat and Blanka LESS pwoerful once everyone figures out the weird random counters to things… stuff we’ve never tried before.
CvS2 is a fun game, but it’s not a great game by any means. Even though I like to play the game, I’ll easily admit that. But as I said, I’m not trying to improve the game. I just want to see if we can delve deeper into the game, for right now, thanks to the Ratio system, the game is VERY “surface level”. Who knows? If we dig deeper, we may find out Blanka and Sagat are MORE powerful. Like I said, it’s not a quest for improving the game, but just to learn more about it.
- James
There definitely are passwords that you can input into the configuration screen to change the format to either 3v3 or single match mode. I don’t know them off the top of my head but I’ll do some hunting on the net.
Whats up james, If I had to pick a mode it would have to be single match mode, because it will be like SF2 (1on1). I agree about what you mentioned before, about how players will be able to figure out stuff when it comes to character match ups.
Like for an example, how in ST sagats s.strong is good against dhalsim. 
Sorry if someone has said this before but I have not read the entire post. I am ok with ratios I Ijust wish I could have a different groove for each chacter.
Seriously, if you knew anything about how to use Zangief, you would not blurt out such a fecal opinion.
Fierce vs Fierce. Don’t make me laugh.
Zangief is a character that you must learn every single move’s use in order to play correctly. I can beat any character in the game with him alone simply because of this. Also in each game that he has been in, some small factors change the way you have to use him. I have been struggling for a long time on refining my techniques w/ him in order to match out against newer and varied strategies that apply to other characters.
You and chen seem to have very bad opinions about him because no one is trying. No one wants to use him correctly. I have seen people that think the only thing that Zang is good for is roll into spd and that is about it. I am not new to this bullshit. But, somehow, you have awakened a new Dragon in me.
It’s not you, but the posts about him that you 2 and others have roped that just pissed me off!
:mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: WTF
Uh huh. I don’t know how to use Zangief. I’m sure anyone in the SF Bay Area will agree with you.
anyone know the password? i am sure one of the arcadias must have it.
I genuinely hope this post was a joke, otherwise its flat out ignorant.
Even if you didn’t know that both gunter and james are two of the most knowledgable gief players, as well as very strong gief advocates in the US SF community, you could at least go back through this thread and read each of the posts they made regarding him.
just my take.
-a
i’m with aCme on this. i’ve had the (mis)fortune of playing gunter’s gief and it was bad times for my dhalsim. this guy is scary good with zangief. if i needed to write an essay on zangief you better believe gunter would be listed in the bibliography. if zangief was ever on trial (for bear mishandling or whatever) i’d call on gunter as an expert witness. if there were an iron gief cook-off…well you get the idea.
the point is, when it comes to zangief, gunter is an authority.
I do perfectly well with my Zangief, but the point still stands: he isn’t top tier. I do perfeclty well with Zangief, but it’s known that he’s just not top tier. Claiming that he is is more ludicrous than acting like he sucks. Everyone who is a Gief player will always joke about Gief as if he sucks in CvS2 because, well, that’s the general perception. I don’t think he’s awful. In fact, I do well with him consistently. But is he practical to use in tourneys? Not really.
I’ve used Zangief in every game as well, as my main character, too. Believe me, I KNOW my Zangief. CvS2 is probably the first game he isn’t on my tournament character list. But that’s because he just isn’t top tier. Make sure you bring your 'Gief up against the likes of Combofiend, Valle, and Choi before you start stating how your 'Gief can beat anyone. I can beat 90% of the people I play with 'Gief. But when your tournaments are filled with 80% of the 10% of people who I can’t beat with 'Gief, there are problems.
- James
I agree
if where u play is full of blanka/sagat/cammy/other teams, is it really gonna be more interesting if single match mode is used and then all u see are blanka/sagat/cammy anyway? you’ll probably have non-top-tier chars in there, but i’d say it’s probably gonna be the same ppl who didn’t pick blanka/sagat/cammy teams.
in my experience (which may not reflect yours), good ppl who play blanka/sagat teams in tourneys usually pick 2 other non-top-tier chars (i.e gief) with blanka or sagat in ratio 2 as backup, for some variety and fun within casual play. in single match mode, i think ppl would be more inclined to play top-tiers to guarantee they got value for their hard-earned $1 (about 50 US cents).
of course, this is just my opinion. i do agree that single match mode means you delve deeper into your chosen char, but i think the cvs2 training mode (with the wonderful record option), and a bit of dedication should yield similar results.
it’s not some religious text, but ratio mode IS the default arcade MODE. change it to other OPTIONS if u want, but the default mode is what capcom FIGURED the game should be played in the arcade (same with speed/damage/etc). common knowledge.
time release chars (in reference to mvc2, dunno about a3) is a totally different story. i think it’s stupid to use that as an example.
this is from september 10 2001 madman’s cafe
From 2ch.net- Password “YAMAOOUT” will unlock 3 modes in the system config’s “Game Mode” option; Ratio Match Mode, Single Mode, and 3-On-3 Mode. Ratio match is the same as usual, Single is 1-on-1 style street fighter with rounds. 3-On-3 is KOF style with no Ratio strength differences. Again, I haven’t confirmed it myself, nor do I know if it works for non-JP versions. But it wouldn’t hurt to try, in any case.
Terror
Good post. I definitely think the tiers would be changed if 1 on 1 matches were the norm. I can take Sagat or Bison any day of the week…it`s just his bitch-ass helpers that I have to deal with in the end. I would really like to have some single battles with some of these Sagat and Vega players though…just to see how things would go without three top tiers on a team. Blanka’s bad, but not as terrible as Sagat because Sagat’s Tiger Genocide cancel into a Tiger Uppercut is so powerful. Anyway…would a lot of the same players be just as good in single as they are in ratio? A question to be concerned about, indeed. As far as Maki goes, here in Japan, Maki is used very effectively though…and I’ve seen a few really good players with her here. I can’t remember it completely, but they use a lot of ground traps to pressure and guard break, with some well-placed counters that make me doubt even more where Maki is on the US tier list. However, most of the matches I see are Ratio, so it is a bit hard to tell how 1 on 1 would really turn out. Hopefully, though, to make Capcom VS SNK 2’s life a bit longer, we can all start playing 1 on 1 or maybe even 3 on 3 mode to see how things pan out? Anyway, good points. Is CVSS2 really known as much as many think it is? No. Play Single matches to find out more of the game…if you can stand to lose a little in the process…
First off, I am not claiming that he is top tier. I am saying that simply there is a lot of untapped potential for Zangief, allright. A lot of people don’t take him seriously enough and/or are not willing to do what it takes to make him playable for tourneys in general. The joke part is understandable, but sometimes it does piss me off. That goes w/o saying. But people get their humor off that and I can respect it, however it still does piss me off sometimes because I have a sort of “bond” with Zang if you know what I mean.
Second, I do not play by way of “tiers”. If I feel I can flow with a character and play him well in a tourney, “top tier” or not, I am gonna damn well do it. Even if I am not sure about it, I will take a tourney or some good casual play to rumble with the best in my area, okay. I, personally, do not care much for tiers. There is a way to beat any character with any other character in the game, the key is finding out how to defend against that character.
Third, when I say character, I mean “character”, not “player”, If I say player, I mean player. I am not sure that you read my post carefully about that and maybe didn’t understand that, so this is just to let me know. And talking about characters that are “playable for tourneys” is an understatement. Every character is playable for a tourney, it just takes time to prepare for that whether it be skill, accuracy or dealing with pressure tactics, etc. I KNOW my Zangief as well, my friend, and I am not afraid to use him in tourneys to see if I have progressed enough to move up the ladder with him.
Lastly, for you to throw names like Valle, Choi, Nelson, Cole, Watson in my face like that is, in a way, disrespectful and can be considered mere trash talk. I mean, do I go up in your face talking about “I know you can’t take Alex Valle. YOu ain’t shit!” or something along the lines, and I don’t even know you or them. I don’t bad-mouth anyone’s skill at all and I don’t say things or bark comments about a person’s skill unless I have played them a good while myself, even if only for a few games. If anything, I help them. If I know a tactic they can use to modify their gameplay better and I have seen or done it myself, I say so. I enjoy competition in fighting games and love to see better players go at it or modify a person’s skill with my knowledge to give them some sort of an extra edge even if they have one. It’s those kinds of challenges I enjoy, because it forces me to work harder to compete. And if I can’t beat someone with a character that I can use fairly well, I review what happened in the match and work on it as best as I can. You may be working as best as you can on it, or you prefer other characters, or something else. I don’t know. I don’t know you like that, okay? Of, course, there are problems when dealing against other characters, other players, or other tactics, but there is a solution for every problem.
Just to make things a bit clear on my post. Sorry if you didn’t understand me clearly enough. A lot of people don’t sometimes. I get that. I just have to make things more clearly with some people.
No, it’s all good, perfectly understood. I have that same “bond” with 'Gief myself, and I’m actually a bit more angry that Capcom decided to make him less than worthy in this version of the game (CvS2). I more than anyone (except maybe you and Gunter) would love to make Zangief extremely powerful in this game. But he’s not.
And some people do not like to talk about tiers. In fact, tiers are largely 75% judgemental, especially after the top tier characters. So tiers aren’t the greatest thing in the world to refer to, but there’s still such a thing as top tier, whether we’d like to believe it or not. And simply put, a character isn’t viable unless they can fight this top tier (or at least one of them, as the case may be for CvS2). Zangief has problems against Blanka and Cammy and Sagat, esp. if you are a good 'Gief player and not an expert 'Gief player. And that’s gonna hinder his usability. I never played with tiers either (in older games, I consistently used less than top tier characters) and I’ve never done well in tournaments because of that.
Lastly, sorry to throw names like that you. It’s a knee-jerk reaction. There are too many people who post things like “I beat 95% of the people at my local arcade with <insert character here>!!” and, frankly, it gets old. Because good players are good players… a good player can win in their local arcade with almost ANY character just because they are better. So either they are full of themselves and just don’t know, or they are giving a very honest evluation of their performce. And, frankly, the majority of the people who say those things, especially on the internet, usually fall into the first category. You, however, do not seem to. But I wasn’t able to make that distinction until your second post. My fault for the knee-jerk response, but sometimes it’s hard for me to control these days. 
But I throw the names out, mianly because, these are the people who have discouraged me from 'Gief. And it’s painful for me to admit that. Because, as I said, I would love to use 'Gief more in tourneys.
In any case, didn’t mean to lash out at you. Zangief can be a decent character in CvS2, but he suffers the unfortunate fate of having most of his troublesome matches be top tier characters. If his weaknesses were something like Kyosuke, Yuri, and Dhalsim, life wouldn’t be so bad. But Blanka, Sagat, and Cammy is not a good thing.
- James
1v1 matches provide a different element than team matches…a definitely more “classic” feel in 1v1…i’d like to see this happen in tourneys…of couse, that p-groove player wont have a super in the first round lololololol…sup maj/chen:D
IMO… the major problems in CvS2 stem from Blanka. Take out his gay ass like ST Akuma. And the game is already more balanced. As much advantages Sagat and Cammy have… they can be outplayed and BEATEN. Blanka on the other hand… you can outplay someone using his gay ass… and still only take away 3/4 of lifebar… only to have that last 1/4 of his lifebar come back to haunt rest of ur team. I am sorry… but at least Sagat has to think vs some characters… like say Chun Li, or Guile, or Blanka, or even a Cammy. Blanka has just too much bullshit to make him in any means a fair character. Almost EVERY aspect of the game assists him. It is really dumb. I think ban Blanka… and the game is alot more fair and diverse. The main reason 99% of players don’t want to pick a Kyo or Mai or Akuma on their team isn’t cuz they are afraid of them vs Cammy or Sagat. It is cuz they don’t wanna have the chance of them lining up vs Blanka… which in turn is an almost free win. So personally I would rather see Blanka be put up to ST Akuma status and banned.