Chun Li General Thread: Blue Jade

EveryFlowerFlow · January 3, 2016, 9:36pm

About the 9,236 vs 23682 legs. I’m not the greatest with execution but while the former is much easier, I couldn’t get it to link into cr.lp after I land while the latter starts in the air much lower and is comboable very easily despite being harder to do consistently execution wise. Does 9,236 still link into cr. lp or do I have retard hands?

xaaz · January 4, 2016, 12:40am

They both link. The 9,236 timing is just tighter. And for the TK method you don’t had to end your up on 8 or down on 2. You can do 23693, much easier for those of us that aren’t wizards.

Paolochun · January 4, 2016, 8:49am

Proper cop uniform is long overdue

http://safebooru.donmai.us/posts/1611176

DevilJin_01 · January 4, 2016, 8:56am

Yeah I’ve been doing 23693 as of late and works pretty well for the most part.

xaaz · January 4, 2016, 9:31am

So I was looking through Chun’s hitbox data to see how her primary AA’s compare (Short, B+RH) and man alive what a difference.

http://i.imgur.com/aCp259i.png

No wonder B+RH traded so much. That also explains why it whiffs a lot when someone neutral jumps right in front of her; no horizontal extension whatsoever. Other than the small chance of getting a VT juggle I really don’t see any reason to use B+RH over Short, at least with the beta3 hitboxes anyway. Takes twice as long to come out and is super vulnerable being nearly surrounded by hurtboxes except at the tip. Maybe they’ll tweak it a bit for launch.

DevilJin_01 · January 4, 2016, 9:46am

I still like b+HK. More damage/stun than s.LK and get more juggle potential possibilities when in V Trigger. It’s better vs cross up attempts than s.LK also. I only use s.LK for far ranged jumps.

Belegorm · January 4, 2016, 9:47am

Do you have a pic of the hitbox data for her b. hp? I find it can lead to some devastating damage and trades a lot less often than b. rh, but is far less reliable than st. lk which for me stuffed like 95% of all jump-ins.

DevilJin_01 · January 4, 2016, 9:49am

You have a link for the rest of the hit boxes?

xaaz · January 4, 2016, 9:54am

http://watissf.dantarion.com/sf5/boxdox/#null

otori · January 4, 2016, 10:02am

Beta 3 chun is C91

DevilJin_01 · January 4, 2016, 10:40am

Her b+HP is definitely pretty disjointed. Probably is her most disjointed normal. If you space it far enough away should work well as AA and looks like it will stuff the majority of standing normals even though that was already pretty obvious. It’s definitely meant as a counter poke for sure.

I like that they give specific values for how disjointed the normal is. Will have to go through all of them.

Genistar · January 4, 2016, 10:50am

i use st.lp instead of st.lk. Seems easier to use as an anti air and if we do get a read with those its best to go for an air throw. the range is like full screen.

Rayartz · January 4, 2016, 7:21pm

St. Lp and B/F+Mp worked fairly well for anti air’s too

for B+Hk it is almost like they need to shift that top box the right a bit.
I wonder how the box was in beta 1?

Darklightjg1 · January 4, 2016, 7:32pm

I remember it not really trading in Beta 1 and honestly hoping they wouldn’t mess with it (i.e. my post stating that’s how an anti-air SHOULD be). I’ve given up hope for things like that a while ago.

Capcom just wants to watch the world burn jump in constantly.

Deathology · January 4, 2016, 10:12pm

I went through and compared her VT hitboxes to the normal ones.
-s.hp, s.hk, df+hk, and cr.hk all have more range
-s.lk has better anti-air priority
-s.mk is nerfed with an extended hurtbox on her standing leg
-cr.hp has its second hitbox shifted up
-f+hk hitbox is lengthened farther down
-j.lk is the only air normal that’s changed; the hitbox on the leg is removed
-specials have no changes
-A lot of grounded normals have more active frames, replacing recovery frames. Exact amounts:

[details=Spoiler]–lp: +3
–f/b+mp: +1
–hp: +2
–lk: +1
–mk: +1
–cr.lp: +2
–cr.lk: +1
–cr.hk: +1
–b+hp: +2[/details]

DevilJin_01 · January 4, 2016, 11:51pm

I think she has a lot of good options for AA and A2A. One j.mp counter hit juggle should do enough damage to scare someone from jumping for a bit.

Sounds like meaties are really strong once she hits V Trigger.

xaaz · January 5, 2016, 1:31am

To be honest I didn’t really find air throw all that great. I mean it’s a fine option and all, but it’s no Gief air jab spd. According to Dans mined hitboxes it’s range is even less than a grounded throw (.8 grounded, .72 air). Maybe it seems like it has longer range than it does because your opponents hitbox is extending into it during their jump, sort of like a reverse kara. I don’t know, maybe there’s more to it. Either way, I personally only used effectively like a half dozen times, and those were to stop Vega’s from flying around like they owned the stage.

http://i.imgur.com/aZ27i27.gif

LordVader · January 5, 2016, 4:59am

Darklightjg1:

LordVader:

Darklightjg1:

One benefit of cl HK outside of frame trapping was it quickly shut down Dhalsim’s teleport mixup in almost every situation except the meaty knockdown -> EX fireball setup. Since it was a proximity normal, he couldn’t really “cross you up” (this applied to other crossup tactics from other characters as well like Honda’s reversal buttsplash). Even trading was in her favor, so the fireball itself wasn’t a threat as long as she was standing.

Now it seems that air grab is the most consistent way to deal with it in SF5 without thinking too much about being crossed up, but you still have to wait a bit longer and if doesn’t teleport near you, then you would be stuck in the air if you attempted this without making sure he’s near you first (i.e. reacting purely to the teleport startup animation). B+HK isn’t as effective in this situation since you still have to pick a direction.

methodone89:

LordVader:

otori:

Simple list with the best combos I could find:

Light confirm: cr.lp, s.mp, cr.mk xx hk legs [198/322]
Punish: cr.hp xx lk legs, cr.lp xx lk sbk [232/370]
Max damage: j.hp, b.hp xx hk legs xx super [461/317]
SRK Punish/s.hk CC: s.hk CC, dash, s.mp, cr.mk xx hk legs [298/434]
b.HP CC: b.hp CC, cr.hk [189/315] (doesn’t work with v-trigger on)
V-trigger overhead: VT df.mk, cr.lp, cr.mk xx hk legs [256/327]
V-trigger f.hk: VT f.hk, cr.lp, cr.mk xx hk legs [266/377]

The_Lone_Dragon:

otori:

Trades a lot or gets beaten clean. Also possible for them to empty jump and punish you.

Do you mean compared to beta 1? Or do you just mean in general?

In general. Unfortunately I didn’t play the first beta, but it’s a lot less reliable than comparable normals (in terms of purpose), like rashid’s cr.mp (only had it beaten by ken’s j.hk once and rashid’s j.hp another time).

methodone89:

I’ve never been a Chun player, but I’m thinking of maining her in SFV. In the past I’ve always played shotos and I’m looking for a new way to play the game. Any tips for beginning Chun players?

hi @methodone89, welcome to here, u mean the basic combos?here is it. :D,hope u understand hehe

Thanks for her basic combo’s! I was actually looking for her basic tools and basic way of playing her not combo specific, which moves are safe on block and which moves are a good AA, what move to use as a poke etc(eventhough all this can change once the game launches). I never played a charge character before and was hoping to get some info on how to play Chun, how long do you need to charge a move, what’s the best moment to release ( I see people playing her like it’s nothing, throwing Kikouken like they’re hadoukens, but once I pick her she’s hard to master) I know you can better hold down+back when charging so you can go for an SBK or Kikouken and have more options , other than that I’m completely blanc… in USFIV she has her hazanshu which I like, this move isn’t a special move in SFV but in footage I could see people do a similar move. I like the fact that her lighting legs are now a qcf move instead of pressing kick often, other than that all her specials are charge based.

I might sound like I don’t know what I’m talking about and for the most part that’s true, but I had quite some fun and experience playing Sagat(shoto) in previous SF games, he’s not in SFV and now I have to change my main. I’m chosing between Cammy and Chun, Cammy has all circle motion moves and will probably be easier, but I like Chun a lot.

I came from maining Ryu in SF3 and most games before that (Chun was more of a secondary then) to maining her full-time in SF4 and I will be maining her again in SF5.

General:
The main thing with Chun is your primary form of space control will be from the range and dominance of her normals combined with her fast movement speed. You’ll be mainly annoying and whiff punishing the opponent with pokes from the mid-range (F+MP, st. MK, cr. MK, sweep, etc. St. HP reaches far, but it isn’t nearly as fast on startup as it used to be so it’s not really abusable). White chip damage for normals also helps in piling on the pressure since Chun Li’s are pretty good.
Then the opponent who can’t out-poke you usually gets agitated by this and tries to either jump in or back up and throw fireballs.
-If you’re looking for the jump in, then anti-air with something like st. LK, B+HK, B+HP, neutral jump HK or air grab… use st. HP or st. HK if they are farther away. Knock them out of the air and get ready to harass them on the way down.
-If they want to back up and throw fireballs, I’d mainly throw my own FB to neutralize the fireball and build meter or neutral jump over it and slowly inch forward to either make them back up more or get into a more threatening space where I can go for a cr. MP (to go under the fireball), jump in attack, or super right through it if I have the meter. In V-trigger mode, her B+ HP also neutralizes single-hit fireballs.

…The key vs. both of those tactics is to try to gain ground instead of letting them push you back with that stuff. She does a lot better with open space behind her.

If it’s an opponent who can kind of match you with pokes or out-poke you like Bison or Vega, you’ll usually do better moving into a closer range. Get them to whiff something or throw a fireball and move in.

Up close, again use her good walk speed and the dominance of her normals. Harass the opponent with her fast light attacks, st. MP and B+HP for tick grab and counterhit/frame trap pressure and convert those into combos when you get a hit. Hover in and out of the mid-range and their grab range and try to bait them in to pressing something bad so you can get a whiff punish. F+HK goes over low attacks and avoid throws while moving forward. DF+MK is just to wake up the opponent who blocks low too much. It’s slower than most overheads, so without covering it with a fireball first, you won’t be getting this too often without being stuffed first.

^ All this stuff becomes better when she pops v-trigger and converts into good damage on hit, so I expect Chun players will want to have that available WAY more often then having to resort to using v-reversal to get out of block pressure.

Special moves:

You asked about charge times. It takes a little under a second to have your charge ready… this is a lot faster than people initially think they have to do when they get into a charge character. In SF4 it was 55 frames (55/60th of a second), but it might be even less in this. When you master it, people often underestimate it and think that you don’t have charge and that they can do something stupid when really you’re ready to punish whatever it is they try. For SF5 this will mainly be punishing bad jump ins or loose pressure strings with EX SBK.

Her fireball, instant like the typical shoto fireball, it moves slow BUT she recovers from it fairly quick so she can walk behind it and use it as a mini-shield and then follow up with one of her ranged pokes or an overhead/low/throw mixup. Moving behind it to gain ground is it’s best use imo. Also, as long as you’re not too close, you’ll usually recover fast enough for an anti-air normal if they jump over it. It’s also still very good for zoning against grapplers and characters who don’t deal with fireballs very well in general.
You won’t be winning too many fireball wars with it, but still use it to keep the opponent from getting too much momentum from fireballs (and you gain meter just for throwing them)… you can always neutral jump over their fireball and reset the pace if they are starting to “win” the fireball war.

Holding a charge with down+back not only gives you access to both of her charge moves, but also keeps you firmly planted in the same position without moving backward. Remember that you’re still vulnerable to overheads though and sometimes you should move back a bit before throwing a fireball to get optimal spacing.

Lightning legs are a motion move now instead of mutli-kick input, so it’s quicker to pull off, but they aren’t + on block any more (actually, besides EX legs and TK air Legs, they are punishable on block now). They’ll be mainly used for confirms off of her normals for combo damage instead of pressure. Use TK Air Legs if you want to pressure (people are saying they are safe and maybe even + on block). You can link into cr. LP after LK Legs and TK Air Legs on hit if you’re close enough to the opponent.

Regular SBK is usually just for ending combos. It has the most damage output of any of her special moves and knocks down afterward.

V-Skill is basically a different angled jump that travels a bit faster, but you can’t do any moves until about the mid-way point of the jump. I’ve seen this mainly used for crossup setups or to come down with Air Legs for pressure. It also hits on the way up and you can juggle afterward, but that hitbox isn’t that great imo (don’t use it as an anti-air lol).

Super:
It’s a motion move in this game (it fluctuates from charge to motion input). Being motion means you still have access to it while moving forward, so confirming into it and going through fireballs with it will be easier. It’s 5f startup and travels about 2/3 of the screen in distance, so it can punish a lot of moves on block as well. It also can be juggle off of a lot of anti-airs like crush counter B+HP, crush counter st. HK, jump MP or many of her normals in V-trigger mode.

-I’m not going to go over frame data. I’ll just say that knowing it for Chun (as well as what was unsafe for other characters) was extremely beneficial in SF4 and will be very beneficial in SF5. If you haven’t been looking at gilley’s frame data doc, here it is:

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1976rt8B91PqVCeYJAmcnW1uwVJ0H03QJtV-dJC5ohL8/edit#gid=1533941575

It’s categorized by each beta and may change again in the final release, but getting the hang of it/memorizing it should improve the way you make decisions with her imo.

-Other than that, yeah just move fast and be annoying with her normals and you can get good mileage out of Chun if you choose to stick with her.

-Btw, The move that looks like Hazanshu from SF4 is her Senenshu overhead move (DF+MK). Other than also being an overhead, it functions nothing like Hazanshu. It doesn’t go over or through fireballs, it is not airborne at any point, so it can’t beat throws or low attacks (use F+HK for that). It’s just an overhead use to wake up people who block low too much. In V-trigger mode and on counterhit, I think you can combo into cr. LP on hit and convert that into a combo, but that’s the only thing special about it.

lol,ur explanation is much longer and better than mine, anyway, thanks for the explanation too :D,i’m not really gud in explain these things in detail haha , oh ya, @Darklightjg1, what cl hk u means for dealing with sim teleport?the b.hk?becoz i think i don’t really react faster enough to punish his tele cross up.

I was referring to her cl HK in SF4 as a beneifit of the proximity normals not having struggle with certain cross up tactics. It doesn’t exist in SF5 but I was basically responding to xaaz’s take on it. I type slow, so my response didn’t end up under his post. I should’ve quoted it first.
In SF5 it looks like air grab and probably st. LK will be better suited for dealing with the teleport.

lol ok, thanks for the tips :D, just i having hard time dealing with gud sim players with the nasty teleport cross up which i can’t react yet, for air grab surely u need to jump back abit to throw right? Becoz sim cross u up

LordVader · January 5, 2016, 5:02am

is a gud option when dealing with opponent who like to jump alot or vega that use monkey jump

DevilJin_01 · January 5, 2016, 5:16am

I go for it because its basically a 5 frame start up anti air that has no height restriction. That damage and stun is good also. Its not something you’ll use vs very late jumps, but with the changes to air throws in V its pretty viable.