After the teleport, try using his lp command roll, its even faster than the lk hurricane. If its done fast enough, you’ll recover from the roll just right before the opponent wakes up.
Roll… and you can’t running jab like a moron. You do it here and there to get a bit more guard damage. I think Iori does just fine by running in and getting some more guard damage… you sure don’t wanna RC vs him… if he rolls through.
It works, but the timing is a little weird.
To buk or gunter;
How does iyo use sim? Is he worth learning? Dhalsim used in his fullest potential is good right? I’ve been playing him in earlier sf versions and I sux with sim in cvs2. Is he worth learning?
Dhalsim
Dhalsim is worth learning if you wanna take the time to experiment with him just like anyone else. He has alot of tricks and ins and outs that you have to get a good feeling for. For instance his c.rh (slide), C.mk (slide), and sometimes c.lk slide make for a very good anti-air against sagats j.hk and alot of other characters with air attacks which dont aim downwards. Tiger knee’d teleports are pretty useful if you learn when to use them (can setup a super from back hp after the Tiger knee’d teleport if you catch your opponent off guard). He also has good ground mixups with his light kick slide and headbutt (most of the time will either tech throw, or headbutt will connect if they jump or move leading to a super on reaction). After a throw there are alot of mixups with his air drill attacks where its hard to distinguish which side he is on (punch throw, walk forward a bit jumping down light kick into standing headbutt, catches alot of people off guard, but beware of safefalls). Sim has alot of options I use him every here and there. Oh yeah RC light punch yoga fire is great on recovery.
it works as in it combos? because thats what i wasnt sure about cause i wasnt able to do it…
im outi
Roberth
O and wen is tge best weekday other than fri to go to svgl?
Tuesday nights by far. Token special!
…any other questions I didn’t get to?
1/22/04:
RC Devil’s Reverse (d,u+P) is probably the most underused Bison move in America:
-It’s a good meter builder… a lot faster than doing low forwards from full screen.
-It’s a great wake up move; Can’t be thrown or hit out of on the way up, can be used to cross up or to get away. Counterable, but difficult since it can be mixed up in many ways. Also cleanly beats most normal move anti-airs.
-Can juggle a CC after it hits (corner only iirc)!
It’s basically just a hard move to stop even if you know it’s coming. Very useful overall move. Of course, certain characters can counter it easily in some situations.
yes
I don’t know if this is really a question worth answering, but…
Repost from 2 pages back:
Just curious: what are A-Sak’s and C/K-Sagat’s counter characters, if any, and how bad are the matches? I do remember having some success with Hibiki and Guile against Sagat, and my own (admittedly poor) Sagat was having major problems with turtle Blanka. Of course, I haven’t played in an arcade in like 6 months… anyway, I was just curious.
hey buk, i guess you missed my question from the last page…
to gunter or buktooth
i’m wondering what new things you saw with N-groove in japan. i figure the repeated running jab patterns are not done anymore like they were in the beginning of cvs2 because of roll cancelling. did players try to pop stock and land a level 3 or use the balls by counter rolling and landing level 1’s? was it just smarter play and lots of small jump crossup tricks or something else?
i’m just interested why players in japan started to pick up N-groove again.
thanks:)
if you ask me a-sak is counter to k sagat, if she has meter, even if she doesnt she still does good against him…i dont know about a-saks counters…
does anyone know where to get some vids from japan cvs2 qualifiers for sbo???
im outi
Roberth
a lot of people alway say that if you get thrown by k groove after a JDed jump in you dont know how to play against k groove, ive heard viscant say this because you can jump out of it before you get thrown…
the thing is its not so simple just to jump out of it, if i JD your jump in and i want to throw you i will mash on fp, if you try to jump out of it you will get hit by my fp, so jumping out of a throw isnt as safe as people claim…
i never understood why people thought it was so simple…
and why in some instances am able to do a special RIGHT after a jd, its like i almost buffered a special off a JD, i thought it cut down my block stun but not that much buk any info???
im outi
Roberth
i think eagle puts up a decent fight against A-sakura. not necessarily a counter, but he’s got options for everything sakura can do. not many other characters can say that…
I agree. How come not that many people play him? He’s pretty good.
Hrm… A-Sak is hard to say since there aren’t any really good A-Saks in America. There’s a lingering popular opinion that Vega beats Sakura, but I don’t know if I buy that. Her hardest matches are probably C-Sagat… and in my opinion N-Iori. Surprisingly, Bas actually agrees with me on the Iori thing. She doesn’t necessarily lose to C-Sagat, but the match can go either way. She generally has control of the match, but Sagat can totally kill her if she slips up. She also has some problems getting into the range where her CC becomes a threat.
C-Sagat’s hardest match is probably C-Guile, then Blanka and A-Sak… and maybe Chun Li and Hibiki. He’s dead even with a LOT of characters though.
K-Sagat has trouble with basically the same characters, but imo he has a better chance against Guile and loses a lot more to A-Sak.
I don’t think it’s so much that they found anything new, but that they realized that most of the myths about N-Groove were false… such as N-Groove being weak to roll cancels, building meter slow, etc. Running jabs still have their uses, but the focus in CvS2 has switched from breaking guard to working 50/50 counter hit/throw mix ups when close.
1/23/04:
I’m gonna expand on what Ratio1BeatDown said earlier on Dhalsim.
The short slide into option select b+fierce is one of the cooler Dhalsim tricks that I see Iyo doing. Basically, slide just a bit out of point blank range and hit b+fierce. If you get a throw, great. If you tech a throw, good enough. If you get a counter hit b+fierce, you can buffer it on reaction into a super since the headbutt is a 2 hit move. Very nice.
Most aspiring Dhalsim players try to use his long limbs too much and end up getting killed for it. Of course, you should use his range to your advantage… but mainly to counter something on reaction or in anticipation. Poking blindly from afar with limbs isn’t recommended.
Anyway, the point I was getting to was that Dhalsim’s short ranged moves are often overlooked. Almost every single one of them is really fast, has a ton of priority and offers a large frame advantage. Case in point being Dhalsim’s db+fierce: Lots of priority, very fast (5 frames), and lightning fast recovery… the whole entire move finishes in 21 frames, which is less than most medium strength moves. Less than Cammy’s infamous far fierce, even. The move also imparts a sizable +8 frame advantage! When hit up close (set ups on this another day), Dhalsim can link a low short slide into super really easily afterwards. DB+fierce, short slide into Yoga Inferno super does a very respectable 7800 damage in N-Groove… though buffering the super off the short slide is a little tricky. Buffering the Yoga Stream super off the slide is much easier, but does about 1000 less damage. A-Groove Sim can link a CC after the DB+fierce also, and all Sims can take advantage of the huge frame advantage for some nice pressure games afterwards.
From slightly farther out, continually spamming on the db+fierce makes a good wall strategy similar to Sirlin’s A2 Rose mashing on low strong. It beats most anything, is nearly impossible to punish and builds meter quickly. If your opponent tries to challenge it with a move and gets counter hit you can easily link a lv3 yoga stream super afterwards, if closer you can link a yoga inferno super.
Gotta go, more Sim tricks another day.
Buk…
Just a repost of before if you missed it…
You know how you mentioned the whole jump straight up crossup after the Shinryuken (when comboed off a knockdown)… when I have noticed that sometimes when you for the lvl2 XX jab roll XX into the FP DP… if you get 2 hits (cuz you do it early)… you get a similar knockdown situation, where they land right next to you… I’m trying to test out if you can do the same type of a crossup in this situation… but I don’t have the game here… so I can’t test it except the once in a blue moon I go to the arcade (fuck school)… I was hoping you could check it out and confirm for me… unless I get a chance to do so first.
he has a rough matchup against sagat in general. he has a problem with short jumps, unless your opponent mis-ranges it (then you can hit it with a crouching fierce) or you have extremely fast reflexes (in that case, RC lariat). he also lacks a good mid-range AA. standing mp has to be done early so the second hit with all the priority comes out on time. he also gets beat up pretty bad if your opponent rolls through a standing fierce or crouching roundhouse.
eagle’s one of those characters who has the tools, but he requires a great deal of patience and reflexes.
and great dhalsim advice buktooth.
Some Rock Goodness
anti-air crouching strong stops most crossups and provides you with a mixup
it gives you enough time to run or dash under them for a hard to block cross up, run through them and 360 throw, tick 360 throw/ counter hit low short mixup, yadda yadda. basically, it puts you at the range rock wants to be which is point blank.
of course, good players aren’t going to give you many opportunities to use it.
To everyone contributing to this thread, namely Gunter and Buk thanks so much. This is such an abundance of information and has been very helpful. If I actually lived in Norcal I’d probably play alot more so this information is exceedingly helpful.
Actually I had some questions about certain characters. I mainly play A-Groove Kyo (dont hit me!) Sakura, Bison, Rolento, Akuma ( don’t hit me )
I know now that C-Groove Rolento is alot more beneficial then A-Rolento in terms of options and the ability to do more damage ( readily accesible AC (+10 frame 
or is it lower than that?) and air block) but I had a question concerning “trip guard”. I know that it works at least seemingly works in tourney play but I was wondering if its really as good players once thought it to be. I know that its easily beatable if predicted by empty jumps in or low jump into super if predicted. But my main question is Rolento not worth using in A groove at all?
I had a bad habit of making him an anchor (learned the hard way) and switched him between battery and User but I was just wondering whether or not theres a point to using him in A?
Basically the same applies to Akuma overall is he better in N? if so I would appreciate the reasoning behind it.
Concerning I know that A isnt the best Groove for him but I recently noticed results from SBO qualifiers showing that theres at least 2 A-Kyo players that qualified (Kamiide, JOE). Is there anything that Kyo has thats seemingly counterable to the top characters? At least IMHO I know his Standing Roundhouse is decent between footsie mixups (though Sagat’s Standing Short probably beats it I havent tested it yet). I mainly do his AA CC when I have that opportunity. I know he can combo his CC’s but they seem to do less damage when comboed into does this have anyting to do with his Juggle Potential being reduced afterwards?
Also, his Dizzy CC it only works on stun 60 charas as far as I know
(Maki, Hibiki, Nakoruru ( i believe) Benimaru ( but yet it doesnt work on Vice(70 O_O).) Is there a variation that works on 70 characters?
I also have a question about Kyo’s rekka . I notice ppl tend to go with usind qcf + Fierce ( RC). is the Frame Advantage longer or shorter on Body Ga than the Jab or Strong Version when RCed?
Random questions about Akuma I’ve been fighting against some players using A-Akuma (don’t hit me I know hes bad in A now!) and I managed to dash up to them and RC his flamed fb (Shankunetsu) then I would Hurricane Kick into CC. The problem I’m having is that I don’t really know if thats necessarily safe, even when they’re trying to attack the RC especially concerning Buk’s post concerning Level 3’s beating RC of course depending on the box? I was wondering whether or not that actually practical at all?
Of course everyone knows of the infamous Hurricane Kick twice into dash back and “tiger knee” air fb as a crossup. I had a variation of that which I tested that seemed to work but sometimes question its validity.
The setup is as follow ( of course there is no way in hell I’d d this on a Lvl 3’s blanka )…after I manage to combo Hurricane Kick I would dash back the super jump and at apex do dive kick, the spacing is so that I when I do it i looks as if its meaty but I land and do Short (demon flip)… of course an AA Level 3 slaps this tactic on the ass and call it Charlie, but I just as wondering what your inputs would be on that…
Also another question, does Ver or Shinji still play Kyo? I remember Shinji played A Groove Kyo and it was pretty good…