what else.
twd.roundhouse and RC funky kick. But Daigo relies mainly on roundhouse.
-standing short: his most underrated normal. I get a lot of counter hits off of this
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towards+rounhouse
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c.mp and c.mk
-he can poke with hcf+lk also
But i thought these were pretty obvious. were u being sarcastic?
no =
ive never seen a good ken get in on a good sagat/cammy player.
and usally gunter doesnt really give all the advice.
aren’t ken’s rh and towards + rh relatively laggy moves? you miss one of those and you’re open big time. on the other hand, whiff a standing strong with chunners and you’re not so bad off. the recovery time on both of those is nearly double chunner’s standing strong.
i dunno, i just have a difficult time believing that ken is better than chun li. the can only think that ken has a better AA game than chun li just because of his shoryuken.
and if chun li has no meter, she’s not screwed like A-bison is. she can still do pretty well with normals and good old zoning.
People better not start playin Ken mainstream or I’ll fucking de-testiculate them! Fuck that shit stick to your god damned Chuns you little carbon copy pussies! :mad: 
But she’s not doing nearly as much damage, or creating anywhere near as much pressure, as Ken. She needs the super. Ken does not.
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Footsies are not played at the c.jab range the majority of the time. They ARE played at the range of Ken’s s.roundhouse (which is why Daigo uses it with such frequency - he baits pokes like Sagat and Blanka’s fierces, and roundhouses it back).
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And I will still throw it when you’re done, the majority of the time. Choi often complains about this. More often than not, I will get that throw… The only thing Choi can do is super, so sometimes I mash on throw and then stop when the SBK finishes, so I block the super. He can alternatively jump straight up, but the same thing can be done about that. And you don’t want to be jumping straight up right next to a fully charged A-Groove character.
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SBK is only applicable on bigs, as I noted earlier. And Chun’s crossup is never ambiguous, so there’s no threat to it. All she’s done is chip down guard but put her in the same position as before… and this time it won’t be as easy to get the knockdown. Ken’s main footsie (s.roundhouse) doesn’t knockdown, so it’s constant poking back and forth, with Ken keeping his positioning. The only similar footsie Chun has is s.strong, and it’s not as good without meter.
Roundhouse is used as a counter to whiffed pokes. RC funky kick is used at the distance where it’s uncertain if the roundhouse will hit or not.
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Ken has a much better ground game. I fear Ken more than Sagat these days. Especially when he has meter, but even without.
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Which is why Buk rates her higher as a battery.
Gunter they don’t need/deserve essays on how to play the biggest pimp in the game.
too late. you should of told that to people in sf2. tons of people play ken.
good stuff Gunter
My purpose to the reply was ways to build meter and still have an effective ground game to keep u safe when done right.
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[quote]
Footsies are not played at the c.jab range the majority of the time. They ARE played at the range of Ken’s s.roundhouse (which is why Daigo uses it with such frequency - he baits pokes like Sagat and Blanka’s fierces, and roundhouses it back). **
[/Quote]
Mixups are part of footsies too, u can’t just bait someone all day with one poke.
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[quote]
And I will still throw it when you’re done, the majority of the time. Choi often complains about this. More often than not, I will get that throw… The only thing Choi can do is super, so sometimes I mash on throw and then stop when the SBK finishes, so I block the super. He can alternatively jump straight up, but the same thing can be done about that. And you don’t want to be jumping straight up right next to a fully charged A-Groove character.**
[/Quote]
When did we start talking about A groove characters all of a sudden?
Either way, I could just throw you, or tech yours, or jump back.
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The point is to build meter and still be safe, as I noted.
i havent seen choi’s ken recently but i played his shotos pretty often, but its still hard to say that ken is a better character than chun li. I know any character in choi’s hands will be used to its potential but if i compare it to say ricky’s chun li, i would say ricky has a major advantage cause of her footsies, even though she has limited mixups.
It was fine in SF2 but this is CvS2 dude. All anyone has ever done the last 2 years is bitch about how shitty Ken is so frankly I don’t feel a lot of people deserve to ever even try to pick him up.
Why don’t you guys just use C-Ryu, you’ve practically sucked Ryu’s dick for the last 3 years, so why change just because you’ve finally figured out Ken is more usable than you imagined?
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And when you compare Ken’s game without meter to Chun’s game without meter, Ken’s is better.
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You have obviously never played Daigo. He does not bait with a poke. He baits by being a pixel outside of your poke. He doesn’t jiggle. He just stands there. You poke, he retaliates. Otherwise, he’s RCing funky kicks since you can’t poke it anyway.
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I am talking about my matches vs. Choi. I use A-Groove. If you didn’t know that about me, I’m sorry.
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Ask anybody at Sunny. You will NOT throw me. You will never EVER throw me. You may TECH the throw, which puts us both at even. But you will NEVER EVER EVER throw me. Jumping back is fine. You just made all that effort to getting in for your precious mixups off of c.jab worthless. I’ll take that any day.
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No one is saying that she CAN’T. She IS pretty much shit in that she’s just as bad as almost anyone in the game without meter. But since her main far footsie is only a strong or a forward, she’s no threat without meter. Ken’s pokes are far more damaging, and one is invincible. Plus when he DOES get meter near the corner, Ken WILL take off almost ALL of your life off of a c.short because he has the most fucked up crossup in the game. People who don’t believe Ken’s strength have never seen that crossup. It is totally random. Not even the Ken player knows which side it hits on, but it gives him enough time to react. Even Choi, who uses the crossup all the time, doesn’t know which way to block if someone were to land it on him. It’s cheap.
what im saying is people who’ve been using shotos since sf2 still use shotos like me. Everyone has played as Ryu and Ken in one point of their lives and everyone knows how to use them.
edit: i don’t know who’s better betwee ken or chun. i perfer ken cause lk funky kick gains meter, good priority, fast, and you can run the hell away from people with ken.
No, not everyone knows how to use them. Most just scrub them.
I realize there are a select few that use non-Ryu shotos still but they are more few and far between than you suggest. Unless there’s been a new CvS2 diversity club established that I didn’t know about because I still see RC Blanka every-fucking-where.
How can ken in C, A, N grooves deal with RC ball??
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Again, the purpose of my post was to only show an effective and safe ground game to build meter. I wasn’t comparing whose was better.
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So?..I never played Daigo, does that make u a master all of a sudden?
All that stuff about standing out side of the poke range and baiting, and countering is basic footsies.
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I knew you used A groove, but I didn’t know u wanted to go that specific.
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[quote]
Ask anybody at Sunny. You will NOT throw me. You will never EVER throw me. You may TECH the throw, which puts us both at even. But you will NEVER EVER EVER throw me. Jumping back is fine. You just made all that effort to getting in for your precious mixups off of c.jab worthless. I’ll take that any day.**
[/Quote]
I don’t know anybody from Sunny(at least none that I know of).
Precious? When did I say they were precious? Again, my point was to only have an effective and safe ground game.
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Yes, i’ve played Choi before. His Ken is awesome, no doubt on this end.
But again, my ONLY purpose was to put a effective ground game. I never said Ken’s was worse or better. But YOU just automatically assumed I was saying that Chun’s was better.
AGAIN, I was never comparing the two for better or worse.
All i did was put a good ground game which u probably ignored
anyway.
Sorry about the thread Buk. 
RC
EDIT: I’ll admit that Ken’s most troubling opponent is RC Blanka but I will add that you only need to be half innovative and half creative to find cures for that shit they call Blanka. Shit it isn’t even Blanka anymore it’s CvS2 glitch that’s his fucking name.
1/19/04:
Team Formation 101 Part 3, SNK Characters
Again, stats are just my opinion. Also, don’t be put off by characters with relatively low numbers… this just usually means that their best groove is probably K-Groove.
P/N-Kyo: 9/3/6
A-Kyo: 7/5/5
N-Iori: 10/3/7
A-Iori: 6/7/6
A-Terry: 7/8/6
Other Terry: 7/3/4
Ryo: 5/3/4
Mai: 9/2/5
C-Kim: 8/8/4
Other Kim: 7/4/4
P/N Geese: 8/5/8
A-Geese: 5/5/7
Yamazaki: 9/3/6
Raiden: 6/8/3
C-Rugal: 2/10/8
A-Rugal: 2/8/8
Vice: 6/8/6
A-Benimaru: 7/7/4
Other Benimaru: 7/6/5
Yuri: 9/5/4
King: 7/0/2
Nakoruru: 8/1/4
A-Joe: 9/7/7
Other Joe: 9/5/6
A-Todo: 5/8/6
Other Todo: 6/6/5
A-Athena: 8/8/6
Other Athena: 8/2/4
Rock: 5/9/7
Haohmaru: 5/2/5
A-Hibiki: 7/8/9
Other Hibiki: 8/6/9
Chang: 8/3/6