It not about if she’s bad or good, its about the hypocrisy of the SF community. You had people crying about Cammy over a new v trigger combo(cause God forbid Cammy have anything fun in SFV) and 50 more stun. You had people crying that she was broken and OP when she was the exact same character as in S2. You had people highlighting and complaining about every little thing about Cammy and making it seem like it was just sooooooo good, it was disgusting. People were complaining about stuff Cammy had since the betas but they only started to complain and cry after S3.5 because “tOUrnaMenT rEsULts.” But Karin gets 925 HP and a better st.hard punch and the same throw loop Cammy had and wins 2 majors…and everyone brushes it off. People completely discredited NL and CJ Truth for each winning a major with Cammy last season. The reality is, people were jealous and hateful because Cammy was popular in tournaments. Her low win rate online tells me people weren’t crying about fighting her(cause clearly they were beating her), they were crying because players like Xiao Hai, NL, and Verloren were excelling with her too much.
The fallout of all the tears and whining was our basic, bare bones ass character that everyone calls boring got nerfed. Our stun was nerfed back to 900 and the stun from all her specials were nerfed. Our 3f jab is now 0 on block which is just an awful and mean nerf. Why is the lowest health/stun character in the game also the only character with a 0 on block jab? It just feels wrong. I would rather have a 4f cr.jab thats +2 on block than a 3f cr.jab that’s 0 on block. Lets make Juri’s s.lp 0 on block. How would that make you feel? Lets make Karin’s c.lp 0 on block. How would that make Karin players feel? Lets make Akumas st.jab 0 on block. How would that make Akuma players feel? And now those very same people who cried and whined all year about Cammy are telling us Cammy is incredibly solid and that we dont know what struggle is. It’s absolutely pathetic.
I never cried about her and just so you know,Cammy is my alt.
How Capcom balances characters remains a mistery.
Juri got nerfs several times, a useless trigger.
Bison has biggest win rate online and still gets buffs.
As I said previously,the fact that Cammy got slapped a bit while other top tiers got ignored is stupid and it’s understandable you as a Cammy player dislike it.
But how about when top tiers remain the same and low tiers get ignored ?
Statement remains,you don’t know what struggle is.It’s not intended to insult you,just a simple fact.
It’s always about tiers ain’t it. “I pLaY a LoW tIEr sO thAT mAkEs Me a lOw TieR hErO durr durr durr I hAVe iT so HaRd bEcAUsE loW tIEr cHaRActeR durr durr durr iM sO SpECiaL bEcAUsE I PLaY jUri aND pEOpLe sAY ShE is loW tiER durr durr durr“ First of all you’re not special and second, you’re acting as if tiers even apply to you. Are you forgetting that people go through their own struggles when learning and playing and getting better at fighting games? How do you know how much work someone had to put in to get to the level their at? You don’t get good at fighting games by accident. This fixation on tiers is so pathetic since it is all contrived from “tOuRnAMeNT rESuLtS.” Results that are determined by player skill, brackets, and some luck among other variables.
“Low tiers” ignored? They’re not. They’ve been getting buffs consecutively. But since no one uses them in tournaments it somehow means they’re “ignored.” But Cammy gets a new v trigger combo to spice up her v trigger and 50 more stun and everyone loses their minds because she’s popular in tournaments. If it was any other character you all would say “it’s just small, meaningless buffs.” Absolutely pathetic.
Your character could be the best character in the game with all the buffs and all the pros playing her(or not because Juri is really boring) and you would still be the same player losing to the same people and still find something to complain about. Or you would choose another “lOw TieR cHaRActEr” to be a “loW tiER hERo” and repeat the cycle because that seems to be how things work for some of you.
Because some of you can’t accept the other player is better than you so you need an excuse to make yourself feel better. All those tears and whining and hating about Cammy because she’s popular in tournaments and people were jealous and mad and needed to feel secure about themselves and their character.
Also I love how you understate Cammys nerfs by saying “slapped a bit.” I can’t imagine what you would say if your characters jab was suddenly 0 on block.
I hate the crlp nerf but Cammy’s still at least Top 10 man.
Think of all the Ed, Alex and Vega mains.
I was annoyed by my friend who said that crlp nerf didn’t matter. He said we can still use stlp. I was like facepalming so hard. He doesn’t even use Cammy. -_-
Is that suppose to be a consolation? Is her being “still at least top 10” suppose to make us feel good about all those nerfs she got? I hate this fixation on tiers. You can say she’s “still at least top 10”, it doesn’t change anything. It still feels like shit and it doesn’t make what they did to her ok.
I don’t care about Alex, Vega, and Ed mains. All they do is complain and whine because no one plays their boring character in tournaments despite being buffed to no end.
She is severely overrated and has been since launch. People cried that Karin was nerfed into the ground when she “lost” her anti air jab and throw loops, even though she was just normalized and still retains the AA jab. People keep using these BS letter grade tiers when truthfully, they don’t mean shit. The best tier lists are based on matchups and a top tier character doesn’t get smacked 7-3. So many Cammy players in tournaments, statistically she should have won a lot more than she did if she was so busted. She’s a shell of SF4 self and yet she has less stun and life compared to that game. Yes, everybody is a shell of their former selves but at least they retained their life and stun values and do stupid damage. She doesn’t even hit hard. Cammy’s only gimmick is the same as everybody else, the rock paper scissors of frame trap, tick throw, and shimmy, except she doesn’t even excel at it compared to others. For the love of all that is holy, why the fuck does arrow not hit low? At least give us that. Obviously hooligan isn’t going to grab crouching opponents like it did in the 2D games. At the very least can the hooligan cancel recover as fast as the SF4 version. As long as we stay quiet, we are going to continue to take it in the ass with no vaseline and without the courtesy of a reach around.
Yeah there are two types of people. Ones who will contest her cr lp and those that don’t making it feel like it wasn’t nerfed at all. It’s always worth it for the opponent to try and check it though because even if Cammy chain cancels into another light they’re still safe as it’s a true block string. If she doesn’t chain cancel then they’ll get a free counter hit combo if they have a 3 frame or sometimes 4 frame if she doesn’t go into b. mp.
They did worse to Chun Li S2 and pretty much everyone dropped her because of it. It sucks but if you don’t like it just play someone else. Complaining about it now will not matter as the majority have already spoken. It is doubtful Capcom will revert much of anything for Cammy. Chun Li was never returned to her former glory only changed even after Ono told Ricki Ortiz he’d buff her after only seeing her at the following years Capcom Cup. https://twitter.com/hellokittyricki/status/940066974754775040?lang=en
Yo fuck eventhubs. Two weeks in a row their podcast has had segments dedicated to nerfing Cammy. They want more push back on her normals and for CS to be even more negative. What in the actual fuck?
You can hear the salt for sure from John catalyst. All the changes he’s requesting are the exact tools Karin has also, so I’m not sure why he is complaining strictly about Cammy’s tic throw off st lk and her cr mp as arguably Karin gets more off both tools. Catalyst must run into a Cammy player regularly that just owns him with shimmy setups and whiff punishes or something. Velicoraptor at least sounds logical with his suggestions, but I find it odd that he thinks making the divekick even more specific would help tone her done as they already made it pretty specific after season 1. He mentions the EX divekick can be plus 4 but is not easy to do, which is ironic considering they were talking about her being too easy to play in the following podcast. He’s argument is that an EX move shouldn’t be that plus, but meanwhile Cody’s Ex Zonk is easy as fuck to do to get in and leaves him +3 in your face, has a command grab, and can be stringed back into itself on block if he wants for more pressure yet there’s no mention about it. It just seems like some people focus on certain things they hate, yet refuse to actually use it themselves for whatever reason so they want it removed. My guess would be they feel she is too easy to play and therefore not fun to play her themselves, so they play a hard character instead, but because they lose to her they feel cheated because their character is hard to use while she isn’t. I wouldn’t worry too much about what they are saying as they even said themselves they’re not really sure and just trying to start a discussion. Velicorpator even says he thinks she’s fine even if they don’t touch her. It was just for the sake of discussion.
Cheap and strong are not the same thing. The article is about if Karin is cheap, as in easy to get damage or get away with things that seem like BS. Karin is not cheap, but she is very strong in the neutral. I don’t think people call Cammy cheap either, except for maybe her EX divekick being plus on block in season 1, but they do call her strong. It sounds like the general narrative about Karin is she gets a pass because she is harder to play, while Cammy is easy so she doesn’t. I know it sucks to hear but this holds a lot of weight as to peoples discontent with a character. I’m sure if you saw Ed destroying at tournaments you’d be thinking the same thing about how easy it is to do his specials to anti air, combo or whatever if you kept getting caught by stupid easy shit to do.
IMO the reason why Karin seems so strong right now is because Punk excels with her due to his naturally gifted reaction time to whiff punish and one hit confirm coupled with her longer range normals and higher damage off one hit confirms. It’s for this reason I think Punk wasn’t able to excel with Cammy like he did with Karin as while Cammy does have good up close normals and one slightly long range low confirm they aren’t great to catch a whiff punish from long distances like Karin’s st hk for example and these longer range distances is where it’s more likely to bait or catch an attack as everyone knows to just take the throw up close as hitting a button isn’t worth it. If Cammy tries to do things like Karin does it usually just falls short or leads to a simple one hit into a spiral arrow into which you try and repeat the process where the opponent ends up either taking the throw to reset or getting pushed back into a range where whiff punishing is harder for Cammy to succeed at then Karin. So while they both have good up close pressure, corner carry, and meaty setups to follow up after a hit Karin gets more off each one of those hits and can catch most of the cast from a farther range with something than Cammy. The trade off though is Karin’s lack of anti air, but if you are great at spacing like Punk is it does not matter. Oh and a sub par V-Trigger.
I look at it like this. If you are going to play a neutral game mainly and that is what you are good at it, Karin is going to win you games 2x as much as Cammy just off the additional damage and easier confirms as you just don’t need to land as many hits or take as many chances to get those hits in a round, but once you add in aerial attacks or characters who excel at attacking from the air then it starts to shift into Cammy’s favor.
Not sure if anyone even reads this anymore, but here are the patch notes for S5 Cammy:
"We’ve expanded Cammy’s attack capabilities by allowing her to chain combos after an aerial hit, utilizing moves like her “Knee Bullet” and "Reverse Edge (V-Trigger II).”
The positive net upon a Reverse Edge hit has been slightly reduced, but there’s less chance of being countered upon guard due to decreased disadvantage frame on block. In the past, damage upon hit was higher, but there was far more risk upon getting blocked. It was very much a high risk, high reward attack. By making this adjustment, players can use it more freely against projectiles and throws."
The aerial change means Cammy can do st hk crush counter into a f+hk into spiral arrow or st hk (VTII activation)+k into spiral arrow vs just st hk into dp off of a crush counter jump in.
The change to reverse edge makes it safe to use (-2 on block) but only +3 on hit now so you can only get a jab into spiral arrow follow up. While it’s nice to be safe on block with this it already has a lot of start up. They suggest using it as way to beat throws or projectiles but her current non v-trigger tools do a better job already so I’m not sure what the point of this change even was. Maybe they were trying to make it easier to throw out there, but from my perspective VT2 was always meant to be a hit confirmed VT while VT1 was the just throw it out there VT. I mean if you’re option is jump VT divekick and be + vs super slow jump that is -2 on block that is worth the same as an instant dive kick why would you pick it?
She also got a V-Skill 2 that does a hop kick much like guile’s upside down kick that goes over lows/beats throws and crush counters. On hit you can follow up with DP or Spiral arrow depending on spacing. I think they gave her this as a way to crush counter delay buttons on shimmy setups as she couldn’t get a CC if the opponent was crouching since st hk whiffs on crouchers. Now this way if you are facing someone who likes to check low vs delay tech you can do VSII instead and get the crush counter that way.
So it looks like we finally got a real crush counter. We just have to give up spin knuckle to use. Oh and it’s her v-reversal recycled. And -6, just like her v-reversal. Rashid is even more Marvel. Laura got unnecessarily buffed, Bison has a full screen teleport that’s plus on block, and Karin players are crying because she lost her throw loop but retained everything else.
Eh…that v-skill is more of a footsies tool, not something you’d throw point blank when you’re cornered.
If she can get away with clipping people at max distance with it to stay safe, it’ll be handy to for somethings.
none of that is stuff she can’t handle already. You can probably LK DP rashid out of a chunk of those VS2 shenanigans, Bison can get st.mp after you see him disappear too. Laura match up may change with her buffed footsies, but you still have actual reversals and she has to hold everything.
Cammy is still the most efficient character in the game. She is just brutally slick and compact in her gameplan. She can either be really good, or really shitty. Not a lot they can modify without making her nuts or trash.
right now she can still fights a lot of the cast doing Season 1 things.
