Cammy General Discussion: To Bee or not to Bee

Street Fighter V Cammy
3061

Ex Divekick sigh
EX Divekick used to be always +1 at minimum, if you hit their head. You could be +9 hitting their feet.
With the additional recovery it’s now a minimum of -2.
That said if you space it correctly it can still be +.

Lets see, how should you hit to be 0?
To be 0, you should hit at least their waist.
Around their knees you should be +2-+3
Their feet should give you +5.

That said, they made the move harder to use, it can still be +(just like regular divekick) if you space and time it correctly.
Thats also the mainreason why noone complained about Cammys divekicks but Chun’s IALL.
Chun was always +1 no matter the spacing or timing, Cammy could vary from punishable to frametrap or even true blockstring.

Cammy is cheap and braindead, we SSFIV now boys!
Honestly this argument is thrown around since 2010, people will always blame their loses on this.
The doctor orders them to git gud regardless of what they say.

3062

I don’t think you know what perfect meaty means. A perfect meaty crLP would be a crLP that hits on its last active frame, meaning it would be +6 on hit, +4 on block and +8 on counter hit. In that scenario you’re hitting the crLP on its first active frame.

3063

Against Kolin the range she hits you at determines what you can do to punish. It is -4, but distance can make stuff whiff. I tend to punish cautiously anything that is -4 and ends with a CS or SA as you don’t have any time to confirm. Practicing the timing to do st or cr lp buffered into SA and not have it come out on whiff pays off here.

The EX hooligan divekick recovers 2 frames faster than regular divekick, but it is harder to place right. You need to be at least waist or below to be + to follow up with a jab instead of doing a delay tech. For regular EX you need to be at the knee or lower.

Season 1 we used to be able to do lk spiral arrow after CA and be meaty, but they added 3 frames of recovery on whiff so now double dash is more reliable. I still use hp hooligan into divekick after CA if I have v-trigger. Time the divekick as they are getting up and it beats pretty much everything.

3064

The thing about dash, dash post super is you aren’t whiffing to setup your meaty timing. You’re still just eyeballing your meaty manually. With a whiffed QCF+MK into c LP you beat all wakeups except wakeup Super or DP. You can mash QCF+MK since you just Supered. No need to worry about getting an unwanted Super.

I used to be a “use V Trigger Drill and V Trigger DP in 1 combo” guy but now I’m a save your second V Trigger special move guy. Post V Trigger Drill, dash twice into f+HK will be meaty or a small walk instead of the 2 dashes into V Skill will be meaty. Whiffing buttons seems to take too many frames to setup a meaty after V Trigger Drill. Like whiffed c LP, 2 dashes, c LP gets beat out by wakeup 3f.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6VsDZ5xT3dU https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7C7vJ80UtJM

I saw Alex Myers using s LK, c LP, b+MP,HK, a CH hit confirmable s LK VS 3f jabs safe string on WNF this past Wednesday. I’m just unsure what the best option is after it gets blocked up until the b+MP. s LP is out of range.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gih43cAbKU4

3065

You should not go for bMP on block. You counterhit confirm the stLK into bMP~HK. If stLK is blocked you go for stLK crLP stMP etc.

If you do stLK crLP bMP blindly then well… your offense stopped right there.

3066

You’re hit confirming the c LP with b+MP. s LK, c LP, b+MP is actually extremely good. Like s LK, c LP, s MP, c MK, Drill but b+MP will be a frametrap VS 3f jab characters unlike the c LP into s MP!

3067

Meh, bMP on Counter hit only lets you combo into HK DP at that range, which sucks ass since its very low dmg and no offensive afterwards whatsoever. Go for stLK crLP crMP then.
stLK on counter hit gives you bMP combo and if they press button between crLP and crMP you can crMP stHP xx SA.

I get it that stLK crLP bMP gives you more reward if they press a button after stLK, but you’re kind of going all in that they do that, if they either block the crLP or press a button after it you just can’t do much afterwards while using the other 2 strings let you maintain offense since you get a confirm into SA. But yeah, its an option that you can have in your sleeves to use it if your opponent seems to like being active after blocking stLK.

EDIT: None of this shit matters against characters which jabs push you away though. You can’t even crLP bMP them if you’re point blank, let alone stLK crLP bMP.
You then have to either stLK crLK stLP / stLK crLP stLP or go for the edgy stLK bMP if you really feel like the opponent is going to abuse wake up jab.

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st lk, cr lp, st mp is a solid option and works against all pushbacks but suffers from two problems st lk, cr lp, b+mp does not. The first string only works if cr lp is CH, if st lk CH you have to confirm this and change up your string to st lp instead of st mp in order to combo. Being that this game is repetitive doing the st mp when you meant to do st lp happens all too often (Watch K Brads matches. He messes up that confirm a lot). The second problem with that string is the 4 frame gap after cr lp to st mp. I get hit out of this more than I’d like. Now st lk, cr lp, B+mp does not suffer from this. You can counter hit on either the st lk or cr lp and it will combo and it doesn’t have a gap they can interrupt, however it does suffer from counter hit pushback against some characters, but I’m finding those to be less of a problem and in those instances st lk, cr lp/cr lk, st lp tends to be your best option anyway.

I’ve been theory crafting some things myself. Most people know by now Cammy’s starting option is st lk into something, be it shimmy or some string. Most good players aren’t willing to hit a button after an SA, but they are willing to do a delayed jab after a st lk. Why? because the delayed jab beats shimmy, but doesn’t get frame trapped by st lk, cr lp. It does lose to st lk grab, but as everyone knows taking the grab is almost always the best option against Cammy, so I’ve been starting to think st lk to st mp is actually becoming a viable alternative to use in matches. I know this depends on the opponent for the most part, but this has been paying off for me lately with the current response to st lk. It at least allows me to condition them to not delay jab so I can shimmy or to hit jab earlier so I can frame trap them. It’s still a rock paper scissors scenario, but Cammy’s always been honest like that.

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Hm, I get what you mean but stLK crLP crMP doesn’t suffer from being weak to 3f. Ok, it doesn’t combo if the opponent gets hit by crLP instead of counter hit, but that scenario isn’t really common. If anything, people will jump away or backdash on wakeup and stLK crLP won’t combo there anyway.
In the end stLK crLP bMP beats jump/backdash after stLK while stLK crLP crMP can actually punish them if they press a button after crLP. The thing is I’m pretty sure a button after stLK crLP is way more likely than a jump/backdash after stLK against most of the opponents. Don’t get me wrong, I use stLK crLP bMP against a friend of mine that plays Vega, but only because I know his habbits. Against the usual joe I’ll target the button press after my 2 lights everytime until he shows me that the bMP string can be more likely to give me a better reward.

EDIT: 2 things:
To make sure we’re talking about the same thing and to clear any confusion: The string of stLK crLP crMP will actually become stLK crLP TC if I have the counterhit confirm on stLK.
And about the delayed jab after stLK you may try to stLK walk stLK crLP. You just walk enough to be point blank again (which is almost nothing). What I like about walking after stLK is that people natural reaction to walk forward point blank is to throw tech, so you can cover delayed jab and panic tech at the same time.

3070

I know that Cammy doesn’t have any bad/losing matchups, but if you guys had to name 3 characters that go toe to toe with her who would they be?

3071

Eventhubs claims she loses to Guile and Gief.

My hardest fights are against; Urien, Gief, and…I guess Laura.

3072

Thanks!

3073

is there a way to OS a DP to come out regardless of what side the opponent is on? (i.e.: getting knocked down from a yoga flame from dhalsim and he goes for a teleport)

3074

@BixHD This video explains it best https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iRAznPP4_9Q

3075

Gief is easily her worst match. It’s 6-4 for Gief for the majority of players. She only wins that matchup if she’s 100% perfect, but no one is perfect. At mid ranks Bison and Balrog also give her problems per V leagues season 2 numbers. Personally I think Necalli and Karin are also good contenders. I don’t think she has an issue with Guile. That match up is just about having patience.

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How you guys feelings about the Cammy Gief matchup in S2.1
His counter to our stlk and stmk is horrible. >_<

I guess we have to bait the counter and CC it.

3077

I actually took notes of some of my Cammy’s useful tools after getting the “win 10 ranked matches” challenge. There was a time after I’d AGAIN lost a chunk of points to a platinum Nash like you see on tournament streams. I took a long moment and I thought about what I needed to change. I realized I wasn’t doing enough divekicks. Cammy’s walk speed in “footsies” will setup divekicks so you don’t really need to setup divekicks per se like setting up a slower move with faster pokes like in Tekken. Divekicks actually feel like EWGF in Tekken. The motion is so fast. The motion for an instant divekick is f,uf,f,df,d,db,b+K. It’s a big motion, my thumb dragging across the d-pad. I’m literally an injured SFV player unable to play SFV right now unless I switch to stick. Stick is OK, I have a HRAP4, but it isn’t what I normally use so I’d probably be playing at a fraction of my usual skill.

At the highest level of SFV, Cammy’s main mixup is c MK_grab. The grab is about getting your opponent to tech, so you can punish with c MK, Drill.

c LP, c MP, c MK is a superb string. The first 2 hits are a CH confirm into drill, and the c MP is a frametrap CH confirm into c MK, drill. You can and sometimes should substitute s HP in c MK’s place for a tighter frametrap and extra damage. But s HP has less range than c MK. It can miss due to range.

I like Cammy’s s MP more than many Cammys. Her s MP, c MP, c MK string does grey life damage. But s LK, c LK, s LP is my most used Cammy string as it should be. Sooo often I hit just the c LK, s LP part and hit confirm into cannondrill.

You’d be surprised at how often a HCF+MP_HP,LP+LK Hooligan Combination grab hits skilled opponents, often multiple times in a round. On whiff, Hooligan Combination grab usually crosses up and recovers pretty quickly so a c LP, c LP hit confirm string can hit.

I really like Cammy’s MP+MK V Skill, unlike many Cammys, but I like how it’s plus frames enough so Cammy can frametrap with c MP or if it hits from distance combo on hit with c MK on CH or s HP on normal hit. And when I saw that V skill crosses up when done in-close for the first time waay back I thought to myself, “wow this move is soo good!” Gimmicky, yes, but plus frames and on block it builds v gauge. My other use for it is to negate fireballs. Zoners besises Guile and Dhalsim can’t throw fireballs at ALL VS my Cammy, or they’ll eat a Spin Knuckle V Skill, s HP, Drill_DP! But since lots of Cammy players think her V Skill is garbage, might I suggest a buff: the ability to 2-in-1 a normal like c MP into V Skill like a special move. It wouldn’t combo obviously but like 2-in-1 cancelling a normal into Hooligan Combination it would keep up the pressure.

Guile is definitely my most hated matchup in sfv whdn I use ANY character. Here are 2 Ranked VS Guile matches from when I was getting the “win 10 ranked matches” challenge last night. Guile is SSOOO BS. Guile is hold db, and wait.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Eq_0keta4Q0 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v1eWc0bqAjM

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@forest31 First video I only think you won because you played it so random that it threw off his game. Second video you played it a little better but did way too many hooligans and took to many risks like the raw arrow after a raw v trigger. The hooligan is a one time gimmick, same with v skill. Once you land it once they pretty much know to wait and blow it up and that’s exactly what that guy did in the second video.

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Correct. It’s just another thing we have to look out for. Basically if he is willing to do it, don’t use st mk. Not sure if he can do it to beat meaty st lk. Do you know?

3080

His counter has Startup, it doesn’t beat meaty st.lk.
It also loses automaticly against st.hk.
It’s CCable during recovery and leaves him wide open on whiff and doesn’t work against a cr.mk or any of our Specials.