Anyone who is good will not tech vs Cammy outside the corner. This is why we need to maximize damage in neutral and explore left right mixups. The vskill idea seems good.
Corner mixup:
After a HP dp, on quick rise:
Immediately hold up forward, you can either do lk crossup or hit low with cr lk and combo into whatever
The downside is that you corner yourself but its a decent way to end a round if you have a feeling itāll work
Iām sorry guys, I hate to be that guy, but LK Arrow (or anything else) into ambiguous V-Skill will never be legit.
VSkill has only 2 active frames, it will only cover one wake up option. You can make one to beat normals in one wake up option, but then you will either whiff or get counter hitted to the other option. Which makes it a gimmicky.
The only solution would be to use in knockdowns that donāt allow backrise, but Cammy has no knockdown of that kind that gives her that much f adv.
The āif he wakes up with jab it will go to the wrong wayā just doesnāt make the cut. V-Skill is easily reactable, they will react and counter hit combo your ass.
Sure, maybe you can win some rankeds with this āmix-upā, but thats it.
Are you saying its a gimmick because it doesnāt catch both recoveries?
Its a gimmicky because its a 36f of startup/16f of recovery with only 2 active frames, so not only it doesnāt cover both options but if you guessed wrong you are the one that is going to get hurt pretty bad.
Not only that, but you can only beat backrise with it. Quickrise will always be able to counter hit combo you out of it. If you could beat quickrise then one could argue that all we need to do is to delay the Vskill to catch the backrise and so we could at least have another option versus people with strong habits towards one kind of knockdown recovery, but that is not the case.
I think itās still good to present options when pressuring. So gimmick or not, it can be effective against people that really over think things. Iāve used it and got it to work when itās āout the blueā.
Otherwise I prefer to throw in v skill after dash meaty cr.MP or st.MP. Itās another āgimmickā option but surprises people of all levels.
gimmicks feel stronger in v than they did in 4 but vskill is so slow. i dunno if itll work. the idea is good to lay the ground work for something else
If itās legit or not, you can use it as Mixup from time to time. I sometimes go for Hooligans out of nowhere and you would be surprised how many people you can catch off guard with it.
If you donāt spam it and use it sparingly 1x per match it has a much greater effect.
The V-Skill crossup is as usefull as everything else, use it sometimes and it will be much more effective.
Well, you guys are defining āgimmickyā. If its worth the risk its another subject.
But I tested a bit andā¦ are you sure it trades against 3f on backrise? LK SA gives you 31f adv, VSkill starts up in 36. It would require to LK SA land meaty in order to force the trade. I only managed to nail it on max range stMP crMK xx LK SA, which is so far away that there is no side mix up. As far as I tested stMP stHP xx LK SA or stMP crMP xx LK SA into VSkill loses to jab everytime no matter the wake up option.
You made a mistake in your counting. Youāre assuming the opponent rises on the 31f. Itās not like start-up+active where the last frame of startup is the first frame of active. 31f means they are down for 31f and on the 32f they can act.
V-skillās startup is 36 frames if it crosses up. Itās 35 if it stays on the same side. I played several games where Iāve traded with 3f normals and followed up with c.mk. Youāre messing the set-up somehow.
Yeah, the opponent can act on frame 32, which means that on frame 34 they have their 3f active already.
Your opponents were messing their wake up button timing somehow, or they were using 4f moves.
Good point, I suspect LK Spiral arrow hits on the 2nd frame. Iāve set the computer to reversal jab with the cast, and I can reliably trade with 3f normals.
Man iām pissed, i thought i had a nicely optimized hitconfirm of a meaty cr.mp, i even practiced it so i could differentiate between crouching and standing only to find out it doesnāt wok on counterhitā¦ The cr.mp, b.mp>hk made using 1 ex bar worth it in a combo, even as a meterless combo it did great damage. I wish there was either less pushback on counterhits like in the Beta or b.mp to have slightly more range.
[list]
[] CROUCHING
[list]
[] cr.mp, b.mp>hk
[/list]
[] STANDING
[list]
[] cr.mp, st.mp, cr.mk
[/list]
[/list]
*atleast, it doesnāt work from a meaty counterhit cr.mpā¦ It does work if you set dummy to counterhit and crouching without the setup :s
That is probably char specific. Iād guess that it works on Chun, Dhalsim and most definetely Alex as their hurtbox are quite generous.
EDIT: Just tested. Iāve setted Alex to wake up with crLP and managed to meaty crMP bMP stHK etcā¦
But yeah, cool idea man. If youāre willing to spend the one bar it does 292/460 for that combo. Quite an improvement for the crMP stMP crMK xx HK DP 238/410. One bar for 54/50 is pretty legit.
If you go for the 2 meter combo you get crMP bMP HK xx EX Hooligan CS EX DP for 316/460 for an extra 24/0, which is kinda meh but yeah.
I do this slicer into CA like 4/5 times in this set with my friend, and now in training mode i cannot do it again, anyone knows what happen?
Edit: ok, I do this slicer into CA, buffering ca into slicer, the release hk, lk if he is cornered.
Midscreen you can only get CA on counterhit after the slicer. In corner you can do lk dp xx CA.
Yes! Dont know how i forgot to mention it!! that was on counterhit! Because of that i wasnt getting it in training mode, guess that my buddy love hitting buttons, thanks so much!
I feel your pain. This really should work on counter hit meaty setups. Kind of BS really, but I wonder if itās usuable as a punish. Like say Bisonās slide? Most people punish with cr. mp cr. mp but since he is crouching and point blank maybe it would work against him and maybe Vegas too? It does more damage that way so would still be worth using.
This may have already been mentioned but Iāve been facing a lot more people not quick rising anymore, probably due to the easy meaty setups after spiral arrow, so I was messing around with dive kick against no recovery and found that if you jump and instant lk dive kick at almost point blank range right before they are getting up it will counter hit them deep enough to get a st mp st hp combo off it. It does almost as much damage as a normal jump in. I was kind of shocked it worked to be honest but itās now my meaty setup to beat mashers that donāt quick rise. If they do happen to block you can block or late tech to defend. As far as I could tell it looked to be 0 on block but could easily hit -2 if you dive kick in late.
Yeah, I have done thisā¦ I donāt know why it has such juicy meaty properties, but itās the best, most consistent divekick in terms of results and follow up to st. or cr. mp. I donāt do it as a often as I should, but I have yet to get countered or hit out of it if timed right.
Cammy also seems like she hits at a deeper angle (floats deceptively backwards even) than normal when you tk her lk divekick point blank, AND itās a lot faster for some reason.
I think because people are afraid of shimmy, throws, frametraps, V-Skillā¦ it almost always counts as counter damage if you condition the opponent. I feel like, even though it is limited to normal get-up situations, this is the overhead move Cammy players needed.