im not sure if its so easy to bait…
i’ll buffer 720 and the second i see u leave the ground towards me i’ll press 3K…
you can AA up to 50% of his health is gone. but a 50% geif is still lots of gief to fight…
i highly doubt viper’s u2 can beat geif’s u2…
@ryuga the b+hk is a good idea
@killey i dont think a lot of giefs use U1 anyways, its more luck on connection, the majority is footsies and his mad wakeup game.
U1 is such a good fear factor tool for Gief in SF4 espeically during his Vortex cause everyone is so afraid of him landing that Ultra. I know his core gameplay is his incredible footsie and poke game with OS banishing flat tactics for the knockdown into his oki game. It’s not like U1 make or break his oki game but it’s that additional feat factor that makes U1 particularly good for Gief and causes people to get a bit more jumpy. U2 will keep people grounded more forcing him to work his footsie game again but people with stronger footsies and zoning gives Gief bigger issues. However, it should give him good tools against Seth and Dhalshim, imo.
Viper gets eaten alive by Gief regardless and just because he can catch Viper off of a Burn Kick doesn’t really mean much. You really shouldn’t be doing too many Burn Kicks on Gief and most of them are done in a manner where Gief can’t just do Ultra on reaction. He’ll have to as you said buffer them beforehand and wait for the lift off. I’m not saying this is going to make the match up easier since this match is retarded regardless. It’ll probably make it harder as well since it catches back dashes and Viper’s back dash lifts her from the ground.
wait…it catches back dashes? wtf?
Yea u2 keeps ppl grounded…and viper has shit for footsies…i think U2 made the match even more retarded…
Hmmm…maybe I read something wrong or got confused with a different Ultra. I thought I read in this thread that it catches back dashes that lift the character off the ground unless that person edited their post.
EDIT: Oh, the person who uploaded the video put a comment saying it catches back dashes that makes you air borne. Viper’s back dash does just that because it’s one of her few escapes to Seth’s Unblockable Ultra Setup in SF4.
We can punish so many things with U2… i see, reset throw mixups into jump>U2. :bgrin:
Anyone had enough time with the game & Viper to tell us her new reduced damage outputs?
…if this hasn’t already been answered…
Lol dude, it’s Ryu we are talking here.
Ultra 1 now does 480 dmg instead of 540 dmg with full ultrabar.
That’s still pretty good damage compared to how bad some other ultras were nerfed. I think I’ll stick with U1. Functionality over accessibility.
holy cow!!! viper can actually take hits from sagat now, im excited already!!!
Any idea what FFF does now?
Some guy roughly translated the dev blog that explains only 2 real changes to C.Viper along with the ones we’ve seen/heard already. The first one being that her burn kicks (I"m guessing ground and air) have less frame advantage on block. Now Viper is a character with ass block strings and footsies so burn kicks are basically block strings for her. I mean yeah air LK burn kick gives her like + 8 on block but come on…it’s C.Viper. It takes 8 frames for her only normal that can lead to knockdowns and any big damage period to hit any ways. MK and HK air burn kicks give 6 and 4 frames frame advantage especially but as long as they don’t do nothing stupid like make them negative frames on block it should be straight.
They also said they buffed her c.MP which was arguably her best poke (I can joke and say it was almost her only one). The guy who translated it believes the buff is mostly in the hit box which is great because it was her only sub 7 frame normal (5 frames) that didn’t involve a damned jab or short kick. It’s just the hit box was short and easy to walk away from during footsies. It was also her only non light attack normal that could link into the same normal without a counter hit. If Viper wants to link any other medium or hard normal into another she has to TK cancel or get a counter hit. That along with c.MK hit box being fixed should help her ground game a good bit. Maybe we’ll finally be able to really footsie with this character in SFIV and not have her be such a damned shenanigan with a bunch of gaps in her offense.
No not the BK’s, It was the only move which was fairly safe on block. Now we got to think twice before using BK’s :S
Hi, this is the guy who translated. I usually don’t post in the character I rarely play, but just wanted to clear some things up.
Dev blog usually uses ambiguous words to express any changes, but they said that “c.MK was too good and c.MP was not much used, so they gave c.MP more ‘meaning’ to exist by slightly buffing its hit priority”. They explicitly said it’ll be useful in poking, and it’ll likely win more in poking war now. This paragraph also implicitly states that c.MK is obviously not buffed, otherwise they wouldn’t say “too good”.
Also, they gave burning kick as an example, it’s definitely not the only one that’s adjusted. I think they give less and less information as the blog goes on.
WTF!!! c.MK was too GOOD?! Against who? Ono? WTF!!!
OMGG!!!
Well I’m going to assume that they kept the frames on c.MK the same and just improved the hit box so her shoe hits you now. If they actually toned down c.MK I’m going to throw sticks. Then somehow calm down and pray c.MP is that much better. c.MK is ass IMO if you’re talking about Vanilla. Sure it is a “long range” cancellable c.MK but that’s the problem. You have to account for the fact that it’s not as long ranged as it looks and Sagat can focus attack that shit all day. The only things she can do after a c.MK that doesn’t involve a feint (knuckles, bk’s, seismos) have 14+frame start up. GTFO Capcom.
That move is hard enough to get them to block man, can be countered man ways, unwarranted nerf.
I can’t wait to hear the reasoning that they usually provide in these rebalancing blogs. I know they can’t say “we felt she was too strong” or “she was too powerful”.
Maybe they’ll just pull a Gen, and just say that she didn’t play the way they wanted her to in vanilla.
BK’s are gonna take a major hit in Super with worse frame advantage and faster FA crumples…
EDIT:
I wonder what they call Ryu’s cr.mk.
Okay, I’m starting to get scared…
Well I don’t want to be one of those people who bitch about what was vaguely said/translated in a dev blog so I’ll wait till the final release to see how bad these changes are.
In any case I know I’ll be switching to Ibuki in SSF4 because she has a lot more tools on Viper and relies less on gimmicks and more on solid fundamentals with good less gimmicky mix ups like Akuma.
Yeah I bitched on purpose just to be obvious but I’d like to hear more.
When Lone Dragon is scared of a nerf that means everyone should be scared. :lol:
Well, there’s still hope…maybe she got a secret counter ultra, in which case she’ll be set…