I’m heartened to know this topic exists because I have been feeling the same way. Recently picked up Abel unlike the first installment but noticing I can’t get his U1 to hit compared to his U2. And I consistently get his second ultra to connect but I think, for you to feel it’s cheap means you don’t know its limitations like a lot of others have said. Anyone with a decent backdash can avoid the tackle and the rule of grapples is that Ultra grapples that come second to a first ultra ALWAYS lose so that includes Final Atomic Buster and Ultra Spark. There’s always a way out.
Hakan can beat out U2 with slide if you try and thow it out while hes grounded.
So does a properly timed TT beat breathless?
anyone who thinks it’s unavoidable is a retard. to my recon, there is no real range where the ultra cannot be jumped out, but even though it might, almost everybody has a way to deal with it.
dudley can deal with it, (ultra), or if he’s too far away, jump back.
same with chun, guile. dee jay can do his ultra at close range, jump away when he’s afar. or just guess, bait it and jump, sit there for 1.5 seconds and then jump, backdash then jump. and if you don’t understand why these people CAN use their ultra EVEN IF they didn’t have charge to begin with, you don’t understand the mechanics of this game.
makoto can jump back and axe kick to delay her jump, or ultra 2 to kill it.
balrog can do raw ultra. gief is kinda hard but the guess is in his favor, since if you whiff, he can put you in a world of hurt, zangief shouldn’t even be in the magic range anyway, and he can still guess ex green hand to beat your delay, or just backdash, jump, whatever.
breathless is pretty redundant to use when both are standing on there feet, not completely, but almost. just don’t whiff shit, jump like a retard, don’t use meaties too often.
I swear to God does no one hit confirm ultra anymore?
Except slide comes out in 14 frames, Abel ultra comes out in 8. Problem.
You’re missing the point. No one here thinks it’s unavoidable.
It’s just that the methods to avoid it for some characters are often situational and risky since he can delay it or cancel it.
No she can’t. You can’t do axe kick on a backwards jump.
And, axe kick only delays her landing on a neutral jump. It doesn’t really affect her trajectory on a forward jump, unless you use ex.
And, even so, he can call her bluff by just delaying his ultra longer, and catch her when she finishes her axe kick. So, it’s a guess for Makoto, not a true escape.
Ultra 2 won’t necessarily kill it. In most cases it will just avoid it.
Which means Abel can make Makoto waste her ultra.
It also means, Makoto can’t use U1, which would be more useful in this match-up.
I find it quite a shame that the people in this forum can’t discuss something without insulting one another.
Are you serious?
OK… I’ll bite. I’ve actually played a lot of Dudley, and I played my Dud against U2 Abel last night, and fucked him up for using U2.
If I’m Dudley, and Abel activates Breathless at point blank, here are my options.
1- Jump Forward. I’m out, no questions asked. I’m right over Abel. I’m fine.
2- Fierce Jet Upper/EX Jet Upper. 4 Frame move. I don’t even think EX is necessary, since Dudley is off the ground before 8F, and he will get two hits to knock Abel out of U2. He can’t even cancel it to stay safe. This is a free punish.
3- Reversal Ultra/Super, if you have it.
4- I haven’t tested this, and I just thought of this, but Dudley has a 3F Jab. He can probably just mash low Jab, and get out, but don’t quote me on that.
5- I bet his shitty Thunderbolt gets out too…
So… yeah. Free escape/punish, if Abel activates Breathless on Dudley point blank. Hardly even have to think about it… Incidentally, this is really good information for Dudley to know, since Abel’s best use of U2 in this fight is against Dudley at point blank when he has offensive advantage. So, Dudley has numerous escapes at the most likely range from which Abel will use the move on him.
But anyway, in response to the specific point you are trying to make… if you’re at point blank and Abel does U2, jump forward escapes U2 with any character in the game, without having to think AT ALL.
Just because you couldn’t find that obvious ass answer doesn’t mean Breathless is that damn good.
We can… if it’s worth discussing. If the discussion is about something fucking retarded from stupid/lazy/whining players, then it’s much more likely to be met with a certain indignation. Sorry. Step your shit up, then come back.
What do you guys think of u2 vs grappler’s like gief and hawk? I prefer it to u1 in these matches.
So what the fuck do you mean by cheap then?
breathless costs less to get into bed with then your mother. pretty good explanation of why it’s cheap imo:P
he’s not talking about about point blank, he’s saying the position where dudley is after jumping back from point blank, it’s a position where jumping forward wouldn’t make it over abel and jumping back wouldn’t escape U2. though his point is still pretty dumb
Ahhh internet kids who cant read. I said it feels cheap. It makes you feel like you have been robbed. That feeling you get when you see some kid on the streets who looks homeless. You give him a dollar to buy him food thinking you done a good deed and next thing you look he runs into the gamestore to buy a game since he needed one more dollar to meet the price. Is the move cheap? I say depends on the player using it. Have I met one so far? No.
Wow, this does not feel like the Abel forums at all, name calling, character bashing, and chaos. I want to take off my belt and whoop some of these know-it-all kids, but I guess for now I will just school them online with Abel and Makoto.
You act like you didn’t use it in a way that could be easily misinterpreted.
In regards to the Dudley conversation - At that uncertain mid-range, it becomes a guessing game.
I have no problem clarifying if its misinterpreted. However there are ways to go about asking for clarification rather than just making assumptions of what I said.
wow, terrible analogy. 
wait, so people gonna complain about a guessing game now? theres always gonna be some guessing at certain points in a match, its called mixups, the thing with mixups is, if your opp guesses right, most of the times youre going to get punished.
people wanna be all so sensitive when they are being called on their stupidity, ask a question properly and youll get a proper answer, ask stupidly and piss some people off and youll get replies from pissed off ppl. tip on asking questions, be specific + humble + less whining/crying(none is better)… i doubt youll get any kinds of nice and warmy response ANYWHERE when youre being too general + know it all(theres no way to escape EVER! cant even jump! ive only played twice but my opinion matters! etc) + whining like a bitch and to top it all, calling the move cheap. come on, its nice enough that despite the pissed off replies, at least people still answer with INFORMATION, if you choose to focus on the manner of the info was delivered more than the actual info itself, your loss.
7 frame start up on a grab ultra that reaches near 3/4’s screen = good but laughably easy to get away from with all the characters I use.
Im saying if hakan is standing and abel does U2 hakan can sit back and if abel lets go of 3k right away hakan can see it and jump. If abel chooses to sit and hold 3k hakan can just slide to punish.
Frame data has nothing to do with this.
Reacting to a no hold/hold decision from U2 is REALLY, REALLY HARD. I sure as shit don’t have the eyes to react to a 7 frame startup.