Bows, Shields and Drumsticks: The Sir Daniel Thread

Classic Fighting Games Playstation All Stars
1

Okay, time to set up a thread for everyone’s favourite obscure undead knight. Please let me know if any of the info on this post is incorrect, this is a mixture of info from the SRK guide and my own knowledge from videos and my own gameplay. Also tell me of any new information, there is always new tech out there.

Meter Levels:
(Credit to Ultradavid for finding these and SamuelVimes for informing me)
Level 1: 125 AP
Level 2: 225 AP (350 AP Overall)
Level 3: 325 AP (675 AP Overall)

1 (Square) Moves:

Hero Sword Slash: 1 for single slash, 1+1 for two slashes, 1+1+1 for three slash combo.
First two slashes gain 5 AP each, third slash gains 20 AP
The third slash flattens the opponent, making it unable to combo afterwards.
The first two slashes can combo into the Hero Sword Uppercut

Hero Sword Thrust: Forward + 1 for regular thrust, Hold 1 while performing for the Charged Hero Sword Thrust.
Regular thrust gains 20 AP, Charged thrust gains 30 AP.
Regular thrust puts the opponent into a butt drop state, Charged thrust causes a somersault eject.
As far as I know, you can’t combo off either thrusts.

Hero Sword Uppercut: Upwards + 1
Gains 20 AP
Causes a mini launch
Can combo in a second Uppercut and Hero Sword Slash. May be able to combo into Magic Bow, may be a reset.

Magic Sword Spin: Downward + 1
Can hit twice, gains 10 AP each hit. Can hit opponents in front and behind.
Sweeps the opponent.
Can combo into Uppercut and Hero Sword Slash on opponents in front. Can combo into Uppercut and Hero Sword Thrust on opponent from behind.

Hero Sword Air Slam: 1 whilst in air.
Gains 20 AP
Launches opponent downwards, puts into flattened state.
Cannot be comboed off

Hero Sword Air Thrust: Forward + 1 whilst in air.
Gains 20 AP
Puts opponent into butt drop state
Can combo into a second Air Thrust

Hero Sword Air Uppercut: Upward + 1 whilst in air
Gains 30 AP
Causes an eject on opponent.
Cannot be comboed off

Hero Sword Air Spin: Downward + 1 whilst in air, has delayed start-up. Keeps player suspended in air while move is performed.
Gains 20 AP
Puts opponent into butt drop state
Can combo into Magic Sword Spin. May combo into other ground 1 moves.

2 (Triangle) Moves:

Battle Axe-a-rang: 2, is thrown forward, acts as a boomerang, can hit opponents on way back regardless if you are hit or not.
Gains 20 AP
Puts opponent into butt drop state.
Can be comboed off with all ground 1 moves

Charge! (Daring Dash): Forward + 2. Use with Golden Shield for **Shield Charge! **For both versions hold 2 to keep charging. Both versions have delayed start up.
Regular charge gains 20 AP, Shield Charge gains 30 AP.
Regular charge puts opponent into butt drop state. Shield Charge causes somersault eject.
Regular charge can be comboed off with addition of Green Hand. Shield Charge cannot be comboed off.

Magic Bow: Upward + 2, is fired at an upward diagonal angle. Can be charged, differences between charged and uncharged versions not known.
Gains 5 AP
Electrocutes opponent, stuns them in place for brief time.
Maybe able to combo off.

Hammer Smash: Downward + 2, has delayed start-up.
Gains 20 AP
Causes a full launch
Can combo into air sword thrust.

**Air Battle Axe-a-rang: **2 whilst in air.
Shares same properties as ground version.

**Aerial Charge! / Aerial Shield Charge!: **Foward + 2 whilst in air.
Shares same properties as ground version. Charges can begin whilst in mid-air.

**Aerial Magic Bow: **Upward + 2 whilst in air. Can be rapid fired. Cannot be charged.
Gains 5 AP
Electrocutes oppenent, stuns them in place for brief time.
Cannot be comboed off.

Hammer Drop: Downward + 2 whilst in air. Keeps player suspended in air during start-up.
Shares same properties as Ground version.

3 (Circle) Moves

Golden Shield: 3, has delayed start up. Pressing 3 with shield out puts the shield away. Move will not work if interrupted early. Move will work if interrupted late
Shield blocks projectiles. AP is gained when projectiles are blocked. AP gain may differ on projectile.
Shield can break if it takes too much damage. Can replace shield by putting old shield away and getting new one with 3.
Shield enhances Charge! move. Projectiles can be destroyed during Shield Charge!, but mines such as Sweet Tooth’s and Sly Cooper’s cannot be destroyed.

**Green Hand: **Forward + 3. Hand can be destroyed by attacks or by running into walls, water and hazards, hand constantly runs foward.
Gains 5 AP
Causes crumple state on opponent.
Can be comboed off by everything since crumple counts as hit.

**Drumstick Toss: **Upward + 3. Is thrown at upward arc. Can be destroyed by attacks or by walls, floors, roofs, and hazards.
Gains 10 AP
Causes no effect.
Not comboable

Dragon Potion: Downward + 3. Fires downwards and creates area of effect.
Gains 5 AP per hit when on area of effect.
Opponents do not flinch when in area of effect.
Not comboable

Aerial Golden Shield: 3 whilst in air. Keeps player suspended in air during start-up.
Shares same properties as ground version.

**Green Hand Toss: **Forward + 3 whilst in air. Hand does not start travelling until it touches a surface.
Shares same properties as ground version.

Drumstick Air Toss: Upward + 3 whilst in air. Keeps player suspended in air during start-up.
Shares same properties as ground version.

Aerial Dragon Potion: Downward + 3 whilst in air. Keeps player suspended in air during start-up. Area of effect does not take effect until it reaches a surface.
Shares same properties as ground version.

Throws (Right Analogue Stick) Moves

**The Rake: **Forward using right analogue stick.
Causes somersault eject.

**The Punt: **Upward using right analogue stick.
Causes a full launch.

**The Stomp: **Downward using right analogue stick.
Causes a ground bounce.

Supers (R2)

**Level 1 Super: Lightning **(Credit to SamuelVimes for info)
Fires lightning at an upward diagonal angle. Holding upward while performing the super makes the lightning fire straight up. Holding backwards while performing the super makes the lightning fire in the opposite diagonal angle.
Can be set up using Magic Sword Spin on opponent from behind (Only works on Big Daddy)
Can be set up using Hero Sword Uppercut and Magic Bow. This is a tech trap, not a combo.

**Level 2 Super: Chalice of Souls **(Credit to Leebee Link for info)
Fires a beam upwards that does not stop. Tracking soul projectiles (1, 2 or 3 depending on how many players are in the match.) are also part of the attack.
Can be set up using Hero Sword Uppercut, Magic Bow and Hammer Smash.
Can be set up with either one or two Hero Sword Uppercuts, then by walking forward slightly followed by the Chalice.

Level 3 Super: Anubis Stone
Creates an area of effect around player that slowly kills opponents. Opponents affected by area of effect are highlighted with beam effect. Requires two seconds of beam focus to kill an opponent. Super lasts 10 seconds. Can achieve a maximum of 6 kills.

As mentioned, feel free to post any information you know or any mistakes you found in the post.

2

Combos:

Make posts of what combos you have found. If you have posted a video, a link will be added to the thread. All information you have supplied will be added and you will also be credited.

3

Some thoughts:

Meter Levels and AP lost when thrown (thanks to Ultradavid):
1: 125
2: 225 (350)
3: 325 (675)
AP Throw Loss: 12.5%

Lightning can also be fired behind you in a similar arc to forwards by pressing backwards after initiating it.
Elaborate on the Lightning Super setups: how does it combo into Magic Sword Spin against Big Daddy (don’t you have to hit him behind you, or does it work normally)? The Uppercut/Bow/Lightning is merely a tech trap, so name it as such to differentiate it from the combo on Big Daddy.

Mind if I use your movelist format for my Jak thread? Looks much more readable than mine.

4

you can combo into level two by doing u+1 (twice optional), walking forward a bit and then activating.

5

Glad to see a sir dan thread! Haven’t been reading much on all stars because the SRK boards here are so limited and I don’t go to the all stars board.

Anyways I’m loving sir Dan. He seems like a very deliberate character that relies a lot on knowing how to solidly play this game. Looks like you need a lot of solid blocking and spacing with him, and he seems like a monster at the oki game.

D1 has a really long lasting hitbox that can set Dan’s combos up well, so it’s perfect for wake up. Arrow trap is really good even though its not guaranteed, and you can always wait for the opponent’s down tech or combo another u1 to mess with their timing. Right now I’m trying to figure out some wake up traps with axe-a-rang and charge.

6

When you mean AP Throw Loss, do you mean how much AP Sir Dan loses when he is thrown or how much AP the opponent loses when he uses a throw?
Also, feel free to use this format for anything.

7

When he gets thrown he loses 12.5

Sent from my DROID2 GLOBAL using Tapatalk 2

8

I could’ve swore the thread name was Boys, Shields, and Drumsticks.

9

theory fighter real talk:

so we all know that if you down tech after u+1, u+1, you’ll avoid Dan’s level 1, but doesn’t that put them in prime position for him to hit with 1, 1, u+1, u+1 and do it all over again?

is this a legit 50/50 mixup? I was just thinking about it in my head today and have yet to test…

10

Does simply u1 u1 set up Lightning? Thought it needed the bow for the tech trap. I’d test it if I had a human to attempt the evading.

Sent from my DROID2 GLOBAL using Tapatalk 2

11

Haven’t found a guaranteed SP1 setup. I main Sir Dan for the most part, but have been experimenting with other characters the past couple days.

As Leebee said, you’ll likely not have success with Lightning if the opponent presses down following the U1 setup. I have been following up with U2 arrow stun.

I tried out that theory and it seems to work. Although I’m sure a human opponent would quickly catch on and block.

12

It’s very legit actually. I was testing the opponent down teaching the other day (if you set opponent to crouch they down tech.) I would launch the dummy with u1, and then immediately pause and set it to all block. It seems like the opponent has some punishable frames on landing, because they couldn’t block s1, or a timed u1 or n1, 1. Also, if you time a d2 right after the u1 they can’t block it. You could just throw too.

You can guess on the air tech to try and hit super, but bow guarantees it without having to waste super on a guess.

13

His level 1 can be confirmed with an arrow after a u1 or d2, but good players will know to look for that. If they’re teching left or right though, if you pause a second, you can react and nail them. Still the worst super in the game currently. Give us a straight horizontal shot, plzkthx.

His Level 2 is his best super in FFAs but can never score more than 3 kills (compare to Raiden, Parappa, Heihachi, etc. who can score 4+), and more often scores 1-2. Has anyone else noticed the beam often completely misses targets it should hit? Possibly a netcode issue. The homing projectiles that come off of it are stupidly easy to dodge for anyone paying attention. Occasionally enemies will go completely untargeted by extra projectiles at all. Other times the poor homing will cause the projectile to harmlessly circle the target. The only way to guarantee kills with it is to use the beam, which is very thin and doesn’t always work as intended. Positioning under a group melee tossle MIGHT net 3 kills but a group of aware opponents wouldn’t let Daniel get under them holding a Level 2.

His Level 3 is lackluster because it takes too long to actually kill anyone. Honestly, I think they need to move the kill time down to 1-1.5 seconds in the field from the current 2, and possibly buff the effect radius, in order to make it worthwhile. Currently it’s only worth using on Dojo because it’s a small map with nowhere to run. It can get a potential 6 kills but you’d never see this happen in a real match with aware opponents. People know what running away is. I tend to net 3-4 kills with it. Much better to use SP1/2.

Honestly if they gave his level 1 a horizontal shot (which would still whiff small characters like Toro, by the way) he would instantly become soooo much more usable. He can hold his own when it comes to building meter, it’s his ability to use it that makes him Roll Tier.

tl;dr buff please.

14

Dan’s Shield

Okay, so we know what Dan’s shield is and how it works. It blocks projectiles, it grants AP, it enhances Charge!, and it breaks. But a lot of questions went unanswered, mostly what it does and what it does not block, so I took some time playing with it in Practice Mode to see what gets blocked and what doesn’t.

General Shield Mechanics

Pressing n3 will cause Daniel to pull out his shield. Pressing n3 again will put the shield away. The shield will automatically block 3 incoming projectiles, as long as the projectile hits the shielded area of Daniel’s Hitbox and as long as Daniel is not attacking, before it breaks. With each projectile blocked, Daniel will gain some AP. **The amount of AP gained is equal to the amount of AP that would have otherwise been granted to the attacker. **The attacker does not gain AP for Shield-Blocked projectiles.

It may initially appear that it grants Daniel less AP, but this is simply due to how the AP counter display works with combos. For example, if Ratchet uses his s2,2,2 (a 3-shot pistol combo), the hits are worth 5, 5, and 30. The game will display, 5, then 10, then 40, because the combo counter is cumulative. Ratchet gained a total of 40 AP from his combo. If Daniel blocks this combo with his shield, it will simply display 5, then 5, then 30 - however, he’s gaining each of these amounts separately, **so his net gain is still 40 AP. **The game only displays the numbers separately because block chains are not considered combos.

After absorbing 3 hits, the shield will break, briefly leaving Daniel in a vulnerable Buttdrop state (this needs to be removed, but whatever). The strength of the projectiles does not affect this number; it will always absorb 3 projectiles. Actually, strong, slow projectiles are worse at breaking Daniel’s shield, while Cole/Evil Cole’s weak, rapid fire n2 will shatter it quickly. Putting Daniel’s shield away and pulling it back out will reset the number of charges on it. This is a good way to spend time waiting for enemies to respawn.

Following is a comprehensive list of projectiles/pseudo projectiles that are and are not blocked by the Shield. Note that any attack on a chain, and therefore still connected to the attacker, such as Kratos/Nariko’s chained Blades, Parappa’s Microphone, Toro’s Ninja Form Spear, etc., are not considered projectiles and are not blocked by the shield.

Attacks Blocked by Shield

[details=Spoiler]Attacks Blocked by Shield

Kratos’ d2 / j.d2(Hammer Drop, Blocks Fire Only, Does Not Block Hammer)
Kratos’ f3 / j.f3(Bow)
Fat Princess’ n3 / j.n3(Mage)
Fat Princess’ u3 / j.u3 (Veritcal Mage Shot, Very Small Block Window)
Fat Princess’ d3 / j.d3 (Bomber, Blocks Explosion)
Sweet Tooth’s s2 / j.s2(Shotgun)
Sweet Tooth’s u2 / j.u2 (Machete Toss)
Sweet Tooth’s s3 / j.s3 (Molotov, Blocks Projectile, Does Not Block Fire)
Radec’s s1 (Knife + Shotgun Combo, Only Blocks Shotgun)
Radec’s j.s1 (Shotgun)
Radec’s d1 / j.d1 (Grenade Cloak, Blocks Projectile, Does Not Block Explosion)
Radec’s n2 / j.n2 (Machine Gun)
Radec’s s2 / j.s2 (Sniper)
Radec’s u2 / j.u2 (Shotgun)
Radec’s d2 /j.d2 (Grenade Launcher Bounce, Blocks Projectile, Does Not Block Explosion)
Radec’s n3 / j.n3 (Sticky Rocket Launcher, Blocks Projectile, Blocks Explosion when Stuck to Other Characters, Does Not Block Explosion when Stuck to Daniel)
Radec’s s3 / j.s3 (Shock Grenade, Blocks Projectile, Does Not Block Shock Field)
Radec’s d3 / j.d3 (Flamethrower)
Sly Cooper’s d2 (Poison Bomb)
Nathan Drake’s u1 / j.u1 (Grenade, Blocks Projectile, Does Not Block Explosion)
Nathan Drake’s n2 / j.n2 / n2 behind cover (Machine Gun)
Nathan Drake’s s2 / j.s2 (Revolver)
Nathan Drake’s u2 / j.u2 / u2 behind cover (Grenade Launcher, Blocks Projectile, Does Not Block Explosion)
Nathan Drake’s d2 (Heavy Machine Gun)
Nathan Drake’s n3 / j.n3 (Barrel Blocks Projectile, Does Not Block Explosion)
Nathan Drake’s s3 / j.s3 (Poison Dart)
Cole’s n2 / j.n2 (Electric Spam)
Cole’s s2 / j.s2 (Electric Lob, Blocks Projectile AND Explosion)
Cole’s u2 / j.u2 (Homing Electric Ball)
Cole’s d2 / j.d2 (Electric Wave)
Cole’s s3 / j.s3 (Freeze Ball)
Evil Cole’s n2 / j.n2 (Electric Spam)
Evil Cole’s s2 / j.s2 (Electric Lob)
Evil Cole’s u2 / j.u2 (Electric Spread)
Evil Cole’s d2 / j.d2 (Electric Wave)
Evil Cole’s d3 / j.d3 (Goo Trap - ONLY BLOCKS DURING SHIELD CHARGE)
Ratchet’s s2,2,2 / j.s2,2,2 (3 Shot Pistol)
Ratchet’s u2 / j.u2 (Rocket Launcher)
Ratchet’s d2 / j.d2 (Buzz Blade Bounce)
Ratchet’s n3 / j.n3 (Laser Sniper)
Ratchet’s j.s3 (Bomb Bots Capsule, Blocks Capsule Projectile, Blocks Bots Unreliably)
Ratchet’s u3 / j.u3 (Robot Summon, Blocks Summon’s Lasers)
Jak’s n2 (Lightning Cannon, Blocks Air Version Unreliably)
Jak’s s2 / j.s2 (Machine Gun)
Jak’s u2 / j.u2 (Shock Ball)
Jak’s d2 / j.d2 (Machine Gun Bounce)
Jak’s n3 / j.n3 (Laser UFO)
Jak’s s3 / j.s3 (Triple Laser)
Jak’s d3 / j.d3 (Laser Ground Blast)
Big Daddy’s s3 / j.s3 (Lightning Plasmid)
All of Dante’s 2 Attacks
Dante’s d3 / j.d3 (Axe Wheel, Also Blocks Before the Axe Leaves Dante’s Hands)
Heihachi’s u3 / j.u3 (Trophy Throw Only, Will Not Block Tekken Ball Attacks)
Nariko’s u3 / j.u3
Sackboy’s n2 / j.n2 (Jam Session)
Sackboy’s n3 / j.n3 (Cakeinator, **ALSO BLOCKS CAKE LAYING ON GROUND! **Eat it up for free AP!)
Sir Daniel’s n2 / j.n2 (Axearang, Also Blocks on Return if Facing Axe)
Sir Daniel’s u2 / j.u2 (Arrow, Blocks Projectile, Does Not Block Shock Field)
Sir Daniel’s u3 / j.u3 (Drumstick)
Spike’s u2 / j.u2 (Slingshot)
Spike’s d2 / j.d2 (Shock Cannon)
Spike’s d3 / j.d3 GREEN CHARGE (Bananas, Reliably Blocks in Trajectory, ONLY BLOCKS GROUNDED BANANAS IF APPROACHED CAREFULLY FOR SOME REASON. DOES NOT BLOCK GROUNDED BANANAS WHILE NORMALLY RUNNING OR CHARGING)
Toro’s n2 / j.n2 [Oni Form ] (Doughball Hadouken)
Toro’s u2 / j.u2 [Ninja Form] (Throwing Stars)
Toro’s s3 / j.s3 (Ninja Transform > Throwing Stars)
[/details]

Attacks Not Blocked By Shield

Spoiler

Kratos’ d3 / j.d3 (Medusa Head)
Fat Princess’ s3 / j.s3 (Knight Slash)
Sweet Tooth’s n3 / j.n3 (Flame Breath)
Sweet Tooth’s d3 / j.d3 (Mine, Shield Charge Will Block Unreliably)
Radec’s u3 / j.u3 (Shock Line)
Sly Cooper’s n2 (Alarm Clock)
Sly Cooper’s j.d2 (Poison Cane, non-aerial equivalent IS blocked)
Sly Cooper’s d3 / j.d3 (Hat Mine)
Nathan Drake’s j.d2 (Jumping Machine Gun)
Cole’s j.s1 (Lightning Tether)
Cole’s j.u3 (Glacier Drop Jump)
Evil Cole’s u1 / j.u1 (Shock Rod Anti-Air)
Ratchet’s s1 / j.s1 (Wrench Toss)
Ratchet’s n2 / j.n2 (Burp Cannon)
Rachet’s d3 / j.d3 (Lightning Rods)
Jak’s u3 / j.u3 (Antigrav Wave)
Big Daddy’s n3 / j.n3 (Fire Plasmid)
Big Daddy’s u3 / j.u3 (Wind Plasmid)
Big Daddy’s d3 / j.d3 (Ice Plasmid)
Heihachi’s u3 / j.u3 (Tekken Ball Attacks, Will Block Trophies)
Nariko’s s3 / j.s3 (Rocket Launcher)
Sackboy’s u1 / j.u1 (Grapple Glove)
Sackboy’s d3 / j.d3 (Shock Trap)
Sir Daniel’s s3 / j.s3 (Green Hand)
Sir Daniel’s d3 / j.d3 (Dragon Potion)
Spike’s n2 / j.n2 (Shock Drone)
Spike’s s2 / j.s2 (Bananarang)
Spike’s d3 / j.d3 BLUE CHARGE (Monkey Summon)
Spike’s d3 / j.d3 RED CHARGE (Yeti Summon)
Toro’s d1 (Leaf Sweep)
Toro’s Oni Form d2 (Dough Smash)
Toro’s d3 / j.d3 (Oni Transform > Dough Headbutt)

Unreliably Blocked Attacks

Spoiler

Sweet Tooth’s d3 / j.d3 (Mine) - When walking, Daniel will never block the mine. When charging, he will occasionally block the mine. It appears to help his chances of blocking if he’s in the process of connecting the shield charge with a target (usually Sweet Tooth) close to the same time he’s barreling over the bomb. Occasionally the bomb will hit Daniel but still be considered blocked - Daniel will go flying into the air, a shield charge will be expended, and both Daniel and Sweet Tooth will gain AP. This warrants more testing.

Sly Cooper’s s3 / j.s3 (Electric Path) - This has extremely specific placement in order to be blocked, which is mostly determined by Sly instead of Daniel. Certainly not reliable, R1 block or dodge this.

Evil Cole’s u3,3,3 / j.u3,3,3 (Flame Burst Triple Combo) - The first hit of the combo blocks reliably, but in an incredibly narrow placement window. I have not gotten either of the 2nd two hits of the combo to block, but this could use more testing.

Ratchet’s s3 / j.s3 (Bomb Bots) - This one is interesting. The bots are unreliably blocked while Daniel is standing - this seems to be dependent on how high the bot is in its jump when it connects (the bots hop along the ground rather than walking). If Daniel takes the bots standing, he will likely get hit by at least one. However, if crouching, Daniel will reliably block all 3 (although this will result in a shield break). If Ratchet uses the aerial version, he throws a pod containing the bots rather than placing them directly on the ground. Daniel can reliably block the pod.

Jak’s j.n2 (Aerial Lightning Cannon) - Daniel will usually block around 1 hit when standing on the ground if Jak is jumping in, but the others will all connect. It may be possible to block all hits if jumping to match Jak’s trajectory. Warrants further testing.

Spike’s d3 / j.d3 GREEN CHARGE (Bananas) - Daniel will only block a grounded banana if carefully approaching it by tapping on the analog stick/dpad. If running normally (holding dpad/stick), the bananas will reliably go through the shield. If charging, the shield will reliably absorb all bananas (absorbing all 3 will obviously result in a shield break).

And that’s all I have right now. If you notice something I’m missing, please let me know and I’ll update the list. If I didn’t include an attack on this list and you’re not sure if it counts as a projectile, it probably doesn’t.

By the way, literally nothing that Raiden or Parappa does can be blocked by Daniel’s shield, so don’t even waste time pulling it out in 1v1 situations with them. Heihachi also only has 1 blockable projectile that he rarely uses. Big Daddy also only has 1 projectile, but it’s worth keeping the shield out because it’s a dangerous one.

Things to do later:

[LIST]
[]Test to see if Shield Charge changes any blocking properties. I know it still operates under the 3-block-break rule.
[]See if there’s any change to regular blocking while the shield is active
[]Find out which items are and are not blocked by the shield
[]Figure out how/why Sweet Tooth’s mine causes so much trouble
[/LIST]

15

Well, I have something to add about the Shield, I found out about this glitch a few days ago.

Hope you like it.

16

Well I guess it certainly gives us a reason to climb to Level 3. Only problem I see with it besides it obviously being a bug is that in time matches Dan will not have much time to play around with it unless he builds to Anubis at light speed.

I have to say Lightning is a lot better for killing than people give it credit for. Landing your super in a combo is only one way to guarantee a kill, the other is punishing and Dan’s just like Jak’s “ass” Level 1 is one of the best at it. You can punish any roll on reaction made too close to your character, beat air dodges on reaction, and get free kills on many telegraphed attacks many weaker online players rely on such as Ground Pound style moves, and can also kill people sleeping during their level 2 supers (parappa comes to mind). Can also predict a short hop against you which is easier if you are throwing lots of axes but even with the low ap cost it is pretty risky. It has a slightly less horizontal hitbox than Jak’s and you need to predict the direction, but the considerable diagonal range it has means I bet it can punish things in the air Jak cannot.

17

Lvl 1 gets you several kills until people learn the match-up, in my case I play a lot with Sir Dan against my friends and the Lvl 1 super is starting to become obsolete or at least not as powerful, forcing me to climb up to lvl 2. However, if you’re facing ranged enemies, climbing to the lvl 3 in order to trigger the glitch is totally worth it even if you don’t make it to another lvl 3 during the match since you are disabling their abilities to zone you in most cases, anyway, when you play a regular online just count how many times you get hit by projectiles, it is that good.

You have to see the ridiculous amount of meter that you gain when you get hit during the glitch, getting hit by things like a bazooka will earn you a full bar, I dunno if it multiplies the meter that you would normally gain from blocking with your shield by the 3 bars that you previously had or something, I haven’t done the math tbh.

This is even better when playing a stock match.

18

Daniel’s inability to combo his Lv1 isn’t the only reason it’s bad. Lots of Lv. 1’s can be done on punish or reads - take Ratchet’s Lv1 as example. The main reason Lightning is bad is the unorthodox angle which makes it impossible to land on anyone standing but the tallest characters at point blank, but another problem with it is how short its effect time is.

You’re right in saying it can punish ground pound aerials, but unlike Jak’s Lv 1 the timing is incredibly specific. A good read super has a long effective time, probably the best example is Ratchet’s Level 1 which lasts forever, and the length allows him to set up a nasty tech trap off of a throw near a wall. Dante’s is also a good example. Lightning, appropriately, comes and goes in a flash. It’s easy to snipe characters that like to pound close to the ground and have some floaty startup, like Big Daddy or Jak, but it’s not so easy to do against characters that like to do it from higher up and drop fast, like Dante or Raiden. Really skilled Daniels will be able to hit this pretty reliably on local play but with the terrible netcode I’ve found myself discouraged from attempting it often online.

There’s also the complaint that Daniel’s tech trap off of a u1 can be avoided 100% by a down tech (I’m not sure but I believe his d2 is the same case), which simply sucks. Good players can get kills with it, absolutely, but there’s no denying that its usage is incredibly limited compared the other Lv1’s. It’s just too specialized. I think we have to come to terms with the fact that Daniel has the worst Lv1 in the game.

Although talking about effect time got me thinking…what if it were buffed by having Daniel throw 2-3 lightning bolts in rapid succession? Kinda give 'em a right-left-right combo? Increases the effective time, and makes anti-airing with it easier. Players would actually have to watch their step for a second after Daniel throws his Lv1.

19

I think it should just be horizontal. If the time was increased then it would just be easier to interrupt.

20

Still haven’t found a way to combo into lvl 1

Only one I’ve seen is a.d1, d1 (hit with the back swing), and s1 behind but that literally only worked on Big Daddy

Lvl 2 is pretty easy to combo

I really think Sir Dan has some of the best moves in the game but if he can’t combo that level 1 He’s gonna have some trouble because savy people just catch on and tech down ;_;