I’m sure ASW will watch SBO carefully.
I still don’t understand why Rachel starts out with full silpheed yet tager starts with zero magnitism.
Even haku-men should start with more meter.
Getting magnetism with Tager is huge for him, though, and it’s pretty easy to just fire off a spark shot at the start of the round and force the opponent to block it (and be magnetized). Who’s going to be able to avoid it?
I do agree he should start with some meter, though. Maybe half.
Hakumen seems fine all in all. Nerfing the top 3 will basically get rid of his most unfair matchups and make him a solid “goes even with most everyone” character. I can’t see him starting with more meter than he does (he’s already breaking a “rule” that applies to everyone else), but it might be neat to see him generate meter 10% faster. Don’t know how much that would swing him to too good, though. Maybe an impartial Hakumen player can comment.
I’m still convinced that they just need to touch Nu and Arakune a bit, Rachel ever so slightly (but barely at all), and give something to Tager. They don’t have to touch anyone in the middle and the rest of the balance will sort of work itself out. The mid tier is already really balanced. Anyone not the top 3 vs. anyone not Tager seems 6-4 at worst.
I’m curious what ASW will do after SBO.
Why is Tager Vs. Noel 6-4 Noel’s favor? Sledge helps this fight tremendously as it goes through most of her D attacks. Her overheads are pretty easy to see coming as well and you can 360 a lot of her moves.
This tier list needs updating.
Maybe because a decent Noel wouldn’t be rushing Tager straight forward. She may not have any offensive options, but she has tons of defensive ones. She can stick and move, and make it hard for Tager to catch her. Sure it’s easier to catch her than it is V-13 or Arakune. Advantages aren’t based soley on someone’s offensive options. Smart players wouldn’t want to be close to Tager, since grapplers tend to rule all close range combat. If everyone had to get close to Tager, he’d be God tier.
Is this whole page really just “buff my character and nerf my worst matchup” over and over again?
The game is great and you guys will have to find some backup reasons why you suck.
There is nothing wrong with Tager or Hakumen, they’re fine as they are. People would only ask for more tools per their bad matchups. But I think it’s the other characters that need to be tweeking, more so than Tager and Hakumen needing to be buffed. They have enough tools, and they’re designs are good enough. Tilting anything too much in their favor will pretty much make them too good. I’m a Hakumen player, but I can’t honestly say that Hakumen needs more than he has. Well his dash could stand to be better, and I guess he could user an SRK type move. But other than that he has decent enough AAs and he does decent damage as it is. His stars build up slow, but the main difference between H-man the playable version and the boss version is that the boss version stars build up fast. Honestly I think it’s a small price to pay for his major damage with such little effort. He’s not technical, you just have to use him much more strategically than you would any other character. Buffing him will not make him fun anymore. And I don’t know, his matchup with V-13 isn’t that bad. Sure it’s 7-3 but he still has some option, and they’re all practical.
I play a Hakumen and I was able to do a nice set with a good Nu. 4 - 3 Me. I got rocked my first 2 matches. But I edged out wins after that.
It becomes a fuckin mind game that matchup. U definitely have to know your opponents moves and playstyles. All I knew was I had to fuckin get in close. wit Haku you damn near have to air dash to move in quick. She had an anti air that led into almost the same combo string that she was doing from afar. (was worst since she could jump up and do more. Had to start using the counter to stop my dashes and quickly go ham with specials. And thats where ur own skill comes into play, and just being able to do the most damage you can and keeping things in your advantage.
Like folks been saying. Its a hard as shit matchup but I really don’t think buffs/nerfs need to be made. Hell i have more issues with Rachel than Nu. Never fought a legit Arakune so I wont speak on that. Though I’m scared. (that curse is some bull lol).
lol @ me maining Carl. this is a rough path to follow.
Some of us are suggesting nerfs/buffs to characters we don’t play, mainly because we want to see the game leveled out as much as possible (while still keeping the matchups/characters diverse and interesting). If it’s possible with a few small tweaks to a few select characters, why not strive for better balance?
It may never happen anyway, and we’ll still play the game either way. I personally just find the discussion interesting, since I’m still learning the game. But I don’t see a problem with striving for better balance, as long as it’s done objectively.
this game has atrocious balance, ESPECIALLY for 12 characters
the bottom chars are only even playable in japan because of single game format.
you’re fucking dumb never post again ever
Good way to get your point across, you sure told him.
Eh, is it really that bad? I looked at the tier list in the first post, and looked at the two matchups according to the player on both sides (and taking the one that’s closer to 5-5).
Ragna, Jin, Noel, Taokaka, Litchi, and Bang (that’s 6 of the 12) have matchups that are no better than 6-4 and are no worse than 4-6 with every character in the roster. Hakumen has two matches that spoils that trend, and the numbers are 6.5 for both of them (Arakune and Nu). Carl is also a two-match outlier, because he destroys Tager and he loses badly to Rachel… the rest are between 4-6 and 6-4.
So, really, the only characters that break the trend are the top 3 and Tager. I know that’s 4 out of the 12 characters, but as mentioned, the top 3 go largely even with half the cast (over half, if you count Carl who does fine against everyone but Rachel), and that’s not counting high tier vs high tier matchups, which are also balanced in the 5-5 +/- 1 range. So it’s really just the top 3 vs. Tager (and maybe Hakumen) that’s skewing the balance away from being almost universally 6-4 or 4-6.
If they choose to do a balance patch, they can look at these three matchups (Rachel vs. Tager, Arakune vs. Tager, Nu vs. Tager) and try to tweak the characters involved to bring it close to 4-6/6-4. If they do this, it’ll probably do alright fixing the top 3 vs Hakumen, give Tager help versus the others as well, and then the rest of the balance is already in place.
It’s also interesting to note the disparity with how the characters are rated. Of the few that aren’t solidly placed at around +/- 0 overall already, Bang is rated -7 by the Bang player (who isn’t Dora), but is rated only -5 by the others vs. Bang. He just seems to be on the wrong end of several 4-6 matchups (including 2 of the top tiers). Nu is +11.5 (!) by Inoue, but is only +5 down the column.
There’s room to improve the balance for sure, but I wouldn’t call it “atrocious”. Small tweaks to a small selection of the cast fixes pretty much everything for this version. If they want to make major character revisions, they can save it for BBXX.
I agree completely. These characters are solid. ( except i think hakumen can be technical IMO but his core game play revolves around mastery of fundamentals and strategy)
The problem with how player rate tiers is that if character A cant compete against character B, it decided that character A is too weak. But player rarely look on the other side of the situation, whereas character B may just be too good character for many character to even compete. I guess this situation is avoided because if character is too good than the assumption of ban may be in order or suggested property tweaking. Either way a character is being change for the worst which just turns off the majority of players. But some reason to even utter the word nerf is taboo. I guess player don’t want their character weaker ans just want weaker characters to be stronger.
their are also player who just want want things easier for their character for their usage. The problem with this is that developers are not designing a character for players. Though I wont overruled that they have intended strategy’s, but never for the players appeal.
Edit: Personally I don’t think enough of meta game has been developed to determines every one placement. Persoanlly I ses some low tier rising and high tier descending to improve balance. But what can defiantly be confirms is that the gimmicks or the top three are defiantly over power for what their worth. Some are just too easy to abuse, some are not limited enough, or the character traits combine with gimmicks proves to be too good. The main problem is their little to no exploits on the top 3 characters that nearly 75% ( may be exaggerated) of the other cast cant do much about it.
i feel your pain bro
thanks pussies for neg repping me even though im right and better than you
man up babycakes
im glad the arakunes i raped in the arakune thread on live think im wrong too.
HMMMM.
maybe america just cant handle losing to a shit char after they pick god tier and then say the game is balanced as an excuse?
the problem is new players thinking their experiences are indicative of overall game balance
I sort of agree, too much of a buff would just have either Tager or Haku-men take Nu, Arakune and Rachel’s spot as top tier but I still want a “go to” anti air for Tager. Honestly down the line in Blazblue 2 if the only change to Tager is a 4D move that can consistently be used combat various quick striking air moves (or make 2C come out a lot faster), I’ll be happy with just that.
everyone still neg bombing me but without posting to tell me im wrong with your account name, cant handle being wrong pusssssssssiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiessssssssssssssss?