I find that Rufus is much easier, his reversal can be baited with lk and punished with Ultra 1 - makes a huge difference in that match up.
If Rufus is using his reversal when he has meter like he should be, unless extremely desperate, he can make it safe to U1 punishment. You cant easily make it whiff and be in a position to punish it heavily. Cammy on the other hand has to rely on her reversal more and it can be baited much more effectively. Cammy vs Bison is 6-4 Bison IMO. Bison v Rufus is 5-5 Bison IMO
After about 30 or so games against one of the better Cammy players I have on PSN I’ve picked up a few things to even it out. Although when Cammy is close, it’s very hard for Bison.
St.MK I found was an excellent poke, with the occasional close st.HK to prevent dive kicks.
I used to be worried about the fact that I couldn’t Scissors all that much, because he’d do spiral arrows to beat them out, but just waiting around proves to be the better option because his blocked spiral arrow is far more punishable - once I started that he’d stop the random spiral arrows.
Turtling/patient Rogs make me cry - how do you guys get in?
Also, does Ken’s jab DP really have no punishable recovery, or is that some online lag situation? Every time I go to punish a whiffed jab DP, I seem to eat the next one.
similar to the Rufus match up if you keep them zoned out Cammy is ez pz. The problem lies when she gets in and works the cannon strike pressure. Since they put you in considerable block stun unless you have meter it seems the only option is to wait for them to go for a grab and tech it. Overall i think it’s more 5-5 than 6-4, but it’s not like that’s THAT much of a difference.
I would also like some advice for turtle rogs, but more how do you guys deal with good Giefs/T.hawks? I poke them the whole match only to eat butter churned SPD or ultra. Cross ups/ block strings are useless and even if you out poke them you can eat unlucky huge damage help? Also can you stuff Blanks stupid fucking hop?
His DP recovers much faster now. 3 frames faster I think.
You can punish with a combo after it whiffs but the window is much narrower in super.
I got hit by this a lot, too. My initial reaction was to wait and do c.mp xx scissors. But c.mp would get tagged a lot by the 2nd dp.
I just s.HK now.
Jumped over a Chun Kikoken, got hit by DF+LK flippy kick, and then ate a Kikosho last night. LOL
I’ve seen this a couple of times. It seems like a viable setup. Has anyone tested if this beats j.HP ?
What do you guys do to Viper on her wakeup? I’ve been messing around in training mode and found this option select that seems pretty gdlk: it’s just meaty cr.lk followed immediately with a st.hk. This basically shuts down most of her options:
-Ex seismo: stuffed by hk
-backdash: tagged by hk and reset
-burn kicks: stuffed by hk (mk burn kick seems to avoid getting stuffed, but the burn kick whiffs anyway)
-jump/tries pressing buttons: eats lk, hk doesn’t come out
-blocks: hk doesn’t come out, bison can continue pressure
-hp thunder knuckle: wins obviously, but is risky because viper can be punished hard for it
What do you guys think? Seems like this could be applicable to other characters on their wakeup as well.
Nah not so much. The minute someone has an decent DP or reversal you have to think about bait and punish, sadly that could get you wakeup thrown as well, or worse. Viper is a different animal than anyone else.
I don’t want to rain on your parade but I posted the same os in vanilla.But it’s great that you are finding out stuff on your own.As far as dp if the cr.mk or even cr.lk is spaced right the dp flies over and she eats a hk. Only drawback is due to spacing if she backdashes it resets the situation since you will be to far to catch her backdash. Also the actual dp is nothing since it doesn’t do good damage but the trouble is that the knockdown can set up her mix up game.
Also with blanka you can cr.lk then os st.lk+st.hk in the corner in a similar way but if you don’t want to use an os the just cr.lk then st.lk and the st.lk will reset blanka if he ex rainbow rolls if he upballs you get hit but can U2 or st.hk or scissor on hit.
Not sure if you were talking about my post of not but I was mostly responding to the last sentence of that guys post where he said the same stuff that works with Viper could be used with other characters. Well yes and no there.
lol yeah my mistake tired from work I just read quickly and posted.
With regards to the Zangief match-up. On their wake-up you can Neutral Jump Fierce. I believe this stuffs lariats clean if timed correctly.
However the only downside to this is the Gief can backdash SPD this. Therefore it’s important to know they’re going to lariat (or are too stupid to backdash SPD).
Against scrubby giefs spam the shit out of s.roundhouse and space it so he can’t jump at you without eating size 13 military boot. learn to punish green hand(s.RH,cr.mk xx hk scissors,etc) because it isn’t safe on block. There is really no need to rush gief down, he easily when the matchup up close. Also devils reverse beats lariat clean. Against good giefs be careful about s.roundhouse, still use it but i’ve been spd’d out of it before, use more s.forward and try not to walk yourself into a corner because good giefs are really patient and will let you dig your own grave.
I like to bait spd whiffs by throwing out standing shorts which look like the startup for standing roundhouse. Sometimes I follow it up immediately with standing roundhouse to punish whiffed spd, sometimes I wait to punish whiffed or blocked green hand. I don’t like standing forward because it does standing roundhouse’s job minus the damage. I use roundhouse predominantly.
After you train gief to jump in on you (at least occasionally), it’s pretty easy to react and do j. mp x 2 into Ultra.
I’m fine with OS I’m just not especially sure how in this instance, hit lk and it connects hit hk?
And about gief let’s say I’m playing a vicious one, also let’s say I haven’t been able to win a round against said gief. I tried to play runaway and came really close a couple times. The whole match all I did was S.MK and S.RH and a DR here and there. I’m also pretty sure dude spd me out of mk, is that possible or did it just look like it. He actually used green hand alot, generally for a tick throw it seemed. I guess I’ll have to work on punishing that. I’ll work on the safe jump spacing too that should help considerably. I know if I try and combo though I’ll likely east a spd. Ugh this match sucks, can’t cross up and any combo is really dangerous PC seems totally useless aside from getting out of a corner.
Yeah no gief should ever green hand you for free (make them spend two bars for it to be safe). Once you show that it will be punished if they do it, they’ll stop and then you want have to worry about the green hand-spd shenanigans. the best green hand can do on block is -7 so if you’re courageous, you can do cr.forward hp pc, but i usually just punish with roundhouse. Yes spding s.forward is possible, its just a lot harder to spd then roundhouse. Just don’t let the zangief walk u into a corner and you’ll be alright. by the Way dash->roundhouse is amazing in this matchup.
I’m glad this was found before and works. I just wish important stuff like this was in the first post where it could be easily found.
As for the other characters wakeups, I was mainly thinking of chun-li because she has a good backdash and likes to use it. Just have to watch out for ex sbk.